Isp's Routing me out of London to Shefield, and they cant do nothing about it!!

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Screeeech said:
Yeah - if I changed ISPs and my ping went from 12ms down to 7ms, I’d obviously be absolutely incandescent with rage.

Honestly man, I’d be up all night leaving rage reviews on trustpilot, trip advisor and then I’d be right on the phone to Rory Cellan Jones to complain to the bbc about this outrage.
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Honestly you are looking a bit silly now, hands over ears refusing to take in what was actually said...

It might be worth starting by reading my linked post here https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/t...tx-discussion.18239808/page-679#post-28645460 to see the root problem (and not just something the OP or myself have experienced), which causes a frustrating impact, beyond the latency value of an ICMP ping, on latency sensitive applications and why the OP would want to avoid a potential repeat of it in the future.
 
@Rroff people have been asking for a full traceroute since the first page I think, yet all has been posted are Facebook level responses and no meaningful data.

PN should not be routing via Sheffield. BT did but that was yonks ago.

The truth will be in the numbers.
 
ChrisD. said:
@Rroff people have been asking for a full traceroute since the first page I think, yet all has been posted are Facebook level responses and no meaningful data.

PN should not be routing via Sheffield. BT did but that was yonks ago.

The truth will be in the numbers.
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OP isn't being helpful at all no, but the problem they are/were experiencing is a real one and I can understand their frustration as people who've not experienced it can't really appreciate it.

The issue still seems to be intermittently lingering in the background from my Google searches, despite it having gone away for those impacted by it 10+ years ago when it was a problem for some of us here.
 
Rroff said:
Honestly you are looking a bit silly now,
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I’m logged onto an edge router in Docklands, and I’m able to hit that “sheff” node, in 0.8ms rtt, ergo it’s not in Sheffield it’s in London.

There’s nothing mysterious or weird about it, it’s an old DNS name taken from a dialler pool they haven’t updated.

You can take off your anorak and put your dowsing rods away….
 
Screeeech said:
I’m logged onto an edge router in Docklands, and I’m able to hit that “sheff” node, in 0.8ms rtt, ergo it’s not in Sheffield it’s in London.

There’s nothing mysterious or weird about it, it’s an old DNS name taken from a dialler pool they haven’t updated.

You can take off your anorak and put your dowsing rods away….
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I posted myself that the IP currently doesn't appear to be in Sheffield, although at some point recently BT's data for it placed it in Sheffield, but that is only a part of the picture here.

Ridiculing people based on your own half baked interpretation of what they've posted and persistently refusing to even try and understand is really silly.
 
Rroff said:
Ridiculing people based on your own half baked interpretation of what they've posted and persistently refusing to even try and understand is really silly.
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I suspect his posting style is as mine, he doesn’t like to called out by the OP as knowing nothing. When OP hasn’t really helped themselves as you also agree with.

Ie, don’t ask for help then shoot down anyone actually being helpful. It really devalues what makes forums great.
 
ChrisD. said:
I suspect his posting style is as mine, he doesn’t like to called out by the OP as knowing nothing. When OP hasn’t really helped themselves as you also agree with.

Ie, don’t ask for help then shoot down anyone actually being helpful. It really devalues what makes forums great.
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A lot of people haven't even tried to understand what the OP is talking about, which admittedly isn't easy to understand unless you've experienced it, and jumping on one part of the problem (this isn't the only forum they've posted about it on with a similar mix of responses).

Whether the issue actually exists or not on PN is one thing, but the original issue isn't something which is just in the OP's head as people have said or implied.
 
Rroff said:
The IP geolocation data gives some mixed results, though not unusual - for example it places my current IP in Panteg, Wales which is certainly not the case hah.
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Geolocation of IP addresses is never really accurate, nor can reverse lookups be trusted as we can tell from this thread.
 
Rroff said:
A lot of people haven't even tried to understand what the OP is talking about, which admittedly isn't easy to understand unless you've experienced it, and jumping on one part of the problem (this isn't the only forum they've posted about it on with a similar mix of responses).

Whether the issue actually exists or not on PN is one thing, but the original issue isn't something which is just in the OP's head as people have said or implied.
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I used to compete in FPS, so I totally get it. But you don’t notice the difference between a few ms, you notice it between say 10 ms and 30+ ms, especially when using non-local servers. But in this day and age with server tick rates as they are, it really doesn’t make as much of a difference compared to CSGO as an example. For the vast majority of people especially on modern fibre to the premesis the difference in ping being noticed is in their heads.
 
ChrisD. said:
I used to compete in FPS, so I totally get it. But you don’t notice the difference between a few ms, you notice it between say 10 ms and 30+ ms, especially when using non-local servers. But in this day and age with server tick rates as they are, it really doesn’t make as much of a difference compared to CSGO as an example. For the vast majority of people especially on modern fibre to the premesis the difference in ping being noticed is in their heads.
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It isn't always that simple - when I first got ADSL we had a 15ms ping and it felt really good, then that stuff started with being routed (or at least appearing to be) via places like Manchester and Sheffield and it felt nasty despite only increasing to around 17-19ms, it later dropped to ~7ms which was pretty much indistinguishable from the original 15ms.

Though a lot of games these days run 60+ tick rates and have lag compensation there are still games running lower tick rates - Frostbite engine titles are often in the 20-40Hz range for example, same for some of the newer COD titles.
 
Rroff said:
A lot of people haven't even tried to understand what the OP is talking about, which admittedly isn't easy to understand unless you've experienced it, and jumping on one part of the problem (this isn't the only forum they've posted about it on with a similar mix of responses).

Whether the issue actually exists or not on PN is one thing, but the original issue isn't something which is just in the OP's head as people have said or implied.
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The issue is very simple. The OP is seeing a hop to a non-linear geographic location and wants their ISP to remove that hop so as to further reduce the indicated ping time, which is already excellent.

Effectively they want the internet to operate like a dedicated leased line.

While I do not discount your experience the fact remains that there is no domestic ISP that will give the OP what they want, and given how the internet in the UK works, where all connections are monitored and recorded, it is unrealistic to expect it. Wherever “Sheffield” is geolocated these days.

I would love to listen in while the OP attempts to get a budget ISP like PlusNet, TalkTalk or Vodafone to give them what they want. I suspect a quick chat with someone from Zen, A&A or Aquiss would put them straight.
 
Reading the posts across two different forums OP has seen something relating to Sheffield in a traceroute and decided their FTTC connection (~5ms access network latency) is tromboning through Sheffield and back to London in 7ms, with that latency being unacceptable.

The connection actually going through Sheffield like that is impossible, it's never leaving London given the latency.

OP is also upset that one of the hops in a traceroute hits 40-60ms even though it reaches the end destination in good time.

OP's expectations are ridiculous for any ISP let alone those well known high-end ISPs Vodafone and Plusnet.

If one of you folks with a presence in one of the Telehouses would be able to lease them a space where they can put a sleeping bag directly connect a cable to a peering router they may be happy.
 
Yeah even if you are being routed via something that really is in Sheffield... so what? Your ISP is not contractually obliged to route you in any given way. They are contractually obliged to provide you with headline speeds and a good enough "service". Poor service can not be evidenced with a ping of 12ms to gaming server X regardless of the number of hops. Some people would love a ping of 12ms. You are never "feeling" the difference of 7 vs 12ms ping. There is nothing else "going on" to make it "feel" bad either as suggested above imo. It's an irrelevant obsession you will never resolve.
 
XGS said:
If one of you folks with a presence in one of the Telehouses would be able to lease them a space where they can put a sleeping bag directly connect a cable to a peering router they may be happy.
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I would......

However we've just used up our last 100G port in Telehouse, all I have to offer is measly 10G - clearly, the difference between the SERDES in a 10G port, vs a 100G Port is never going to give the OP the required level of experience, for online gaming.
 
The problem repeated throughout this thread lies within the emotive language used such as "felt" or "feels".

Connection quality is a tangible component which can be proven with metrics - and logic - and until one posts examples to back up the poor connection "felt" (i.e. packet loss, jitter, etc), then we can only assume it's the placebo effect. We've already ruled out that traffic is actually going to Sheffield.

Users are far more likely to experience connection quality issues originate at the border of an ISPs network. Look at VirginMedia for example: they're the worst UK network for willingness to peer with other networks or increase carrier capacity to reduce congestion and improve user experience, but hey, as long as you've got your xxx Mbps connection and have low latency to your ISP's PoP in London or nearest edge cache node*, everything is fine.. right?

The other issue is that users do feel as if they know better; there are often very good reasons why your traffic might be taking the scenic route - would you prefer 5% packet loss and slower throughput, or a few extra ms to be diverted away from a hot link? Thankfully most routing decisions can be hidden with MPLS otherwise I dread to think what this sub-forum would look like. Just wait til you hear two of the biggest internet carriers in the world are currently sending some EU<->EU traffic to the US and back..
 
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Screeeech said:
I would......

However we've just used up our last 100G port in Telehouse, all I have to offer is measly 10G - clearly, the difference between the SERDES in a 10G port, vs a 100G Port is never going to give the OP the required level of experience, for online gaming.
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Think of the missed headshotz.
 
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