jeremy clarkson v the mail and mirror

Seems Kipling is regarded as a racist by many even though it was the norm for the time.

Guess I didn't realise even in the 60/70s racism was so normal hence why poems like that were taught to kids.
 
Craterloads said:
Seems Kipling is regarded as a racist by many even though it was the norm for the time.
Click to expand...

And yet still others are of the views that he was not, he was in fact a philanthropist whose views were about the wealthy and their duty to enrich the poor...this is often expressed in the imperialism and jingoistic reference of the time, but that doesn't make him a racist...
[/Quote]

Craterloads said:
Guess I didn't realise even in the 60/70s racism was so normal hence why poems like that were taught to kids.
Click to expand...

It seems you still don't really get it or don't want to.....no one will change your mind! it was made up from the get go and no amount of explanation will alter your preconceptions...but hey, what the hell they're White People...
 
Last edited:
Lol sorry for frustrating you, I get it now. I bet that was annoying


"At school in North London 1972-78 we used the ******* version, without any ill intention; it was just part of the rhyme. This was also noted in the TV show The Goodies where they replaced the ******* word with "Hmm Hmm Hmm" a series of throat clearing coughs to indicate that embarrassment at the word's inclusion in the rhyme. "


Although it's highly debatable regarding the meaning of catch a ***** by the toe, and your take seems to be just your take. Some say its in reference to choosing slaves
Etc
 
Craterloads said:
Although it's highly debatable regarding the meaning of catch a ***** by the toe, and your take seems to be just your take. Some say its in reference to choosing slaves
Etc
Click to expand...

Reference to choosing slaves? In 1923? And then why 'let them go'?...it is a reference to British Anti Slavery ideals, to which Kipling would have been bought up in. The term however wouldn't have been racist to him, it wasn't at the time of writing and simply meant a non white member of the British Empire (for whom it was illegal to enslave anyway). Many authors used it thusly.


And just who says this anyway?

It seems you just can't accept that the whole thing wasn't what you first thought.
 
Last edited:
Craterloads said:
I just did, the bit where I said "I get it now" stop being so hostile you hurting my feelings.

On wiki people discussing the phrase, isn't the poem originally much older? Sure I read that.
Click to expand...

Whose hostile, I'm just responding to your hostility with trying to answer the questions you keep asking.

The poem no, it was written in 1923, the gibberish rhyme is much older but doesn't always include the same words, it is one of those multi-lingual rhyme associations we see in language...the reason Kipling used it is because it is a nonsense rhyme, as I explained earlier and the last part of his poem illustrates why he used it as he did.

And where on wiki does it say that Kipling was referring to choosing slaves?...I have just read the unsubstantiated source you quoted (which is why it was edited out of the wiki page) and the subsequent reply saying that the "pinch a slave on his toe" was an urban legend and there are no sources to correlate this and the administrator states that there are no references for this and they would need to supply them, which is why they are not in the wiki article itself...just like the one about it being The Devil etc...
 
Last edited:
I've been very laid back, you have been making a lot of snappy remarks. Anyhow irrelevant.

It's very complicated is this nonsense / jibberish

In the n***** controversy section someone mentions it. Without citation may I add just appear to be folk offering their knowledge. Not sure it's about Kipling but the original variations

Faith in white people restored? Say it in a Katt Williams voice.
 
Craterloads said:
I read this one, the rest of it doesn't seem to mean much

Eeny, Meeny, Miny, Mo,
Catch a *****r by his toe,
If he won't work then let him go;
Skidum, skidee, skidoo.
But when you get money, your little bride
Will surely find out where you hide,
So there's the door and when I count four,
Then out goes you.

I don't know seems the catch bit did mean what I thought it meant considering the following line. But apparently not, cas says it doesn't actually mean to catch a black man bye his toe.
Click to expand...

It's a reference to slavery
 
Clarkson plays up the image of a an pre-adolecent stuck in a badly maintained middle aged buffoons body. He plays the idiot and does it well. I enjoy watching his antics when taken at face value for a brainless bit of TV.

Completely missed the slope comment when I saw that episode and while "theres a slope on it" is not good English, I have heard various people use the same type of phrase. If it was deliberately meant as a racial slurr by Jeremy trying to be clever then it is dissapointing.

The Top Gear team seem to thrive on the off handed insults to each other and everyone else. This was highlighted with the 'Mexican' comment. It is part of the back and forth banter and I am fairly sure they would have laughed it off if a Mexican had thrown something back about English people.

Righteous indignation is free, easy to generate and makes people feel important. Papers know this and it generates sales...
 
The most stupid thing is that JC sent a note with the take saying 'It sounds like I said the N-work here, I didn't but can you find a take where it doesn't sound like that?'.

So, absolute and complete non-story. Everyone knows it, most people are saying it but why is it always the tiny minority who get the biggest stage and loudest microphone?
 
1815 NY City

Hana, man, mona, mike
Barcelona, bona, strike;
Hare, ware, frown, vanac
Harrico, warico, we wo, wac

That children's rhyme changed a lot.
 
godinman said:
The most stupid thing is that JC sent a note with the take saying 'It sounds like I said the N-work here, I didn't but can you find a take where it doesn't sound like that?'.

So, absolute and complete non-story. Everyone knows it, most people are saying it but why is it always the tiny minority who get the biggest stage and loudest microphone?
Click to expand...

If it's a non-story why has Clarkson felt the need to issue an apology?
 
scorza said:
If it's a non-story why has Clarkson felt the need to issue an apology?
Click to expand...

Because he want's to keep his job. He hasn't got the reputation for exactly being PC has he and it's quite clear he has made 1 if not 2 deliberate racist comments. Now if that's the way he wants to act in his personal time it's his business but when he does it in front of others or representing the BBC it comes into the public domain. I like the show I like the bloke but he simply can't do this other people have gone for less.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom