Just what is NVIDIA up to?

[GhostDog1981]

If you're going to quote me don't do it out of context.

Adjusted for inflation a November 2020 6800XT would cost £872, the 7900XT is £725.

Stuffs more expensive...

Possibly the 7900xt might be considered a bargain now the 6800xt has been adjusted for inflation.

 

[uscool]

I don’t even watch them anymore for their Nvidia shilling.

I don’t trust them and certainly think they’re having a laugh when they say that.

They seem alright to me , looking at thumbnails they seem to dish it out to Nvidia didn't Nvidia have that scandal to stop sending them review samples ?

because it focused too heavily on 'rasterisation instead of ray tracing

 

[humbug]

Possibly the 7900xt might be considered a bargain now the 6800xt has been adjusted for inflation.

I'm not saying that, but inflation effects us all, AMD nor Nvidia for that matter are immune, if you want someone to blame for that look at out leaders, they have been printing vast amounts of money for a decade and now its catching up with us.
Printing money devalues the money in your pocket, that's inflation.

The 7900XT is not cheap, but its also not over priced.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I'm not saying that, but inflation effects us all, AMD nor Nvidia for that matter are not immune, if you want someone to blame for that look at out leaders, they have been printing vast amounts of money for a decade and now its catching up with us.
Printing money devalues the money in your pocket, that's inflation.

The 7900XT is not cheap, but its also not over priced.

But inflation in China,Taiwan,etc where all the parts are made is much lower. If not you could apply the inflation rate in Turkey or Zimbabwe and all the current releases would look well priced - even the RTX4060TI 16GB!

These companies got used to Pandemic pricing so have decided they are going to price as high as they can get away with.

 

[GhostDog1981]

They seem alright to me , looking at thumbnails they seem to dish it out to Nvidia didn't Nvidia have that scandal to stop sending them review samples ?

because it focused too heavily on 'rasterisation instead of ray tracing

They keep harping on about the official msrp for AMD cards knowing full well they’re so much cheaper- they should just say that now they’re the better deal?

 

[humbug]

But inflation in China,Taiwan,etc where all the parts are made is much lower.

If not you could apply the inflation rate in Turkey or Zimbabwe and all the current releases would look well priced - even the RTX4060TI 16GB!

Well its £150 cheaper than it should be, its not even 10% more expensive than the 6800XT was in November 2020.

Lets just be ####### reasonable here.....

 

[Joxeon]

You might have a very long wait to hit your price to performance bracket sadly. (Unless you buy used or buy past gen stuff at next gen release)

You keep saying this but the 7900XT has already seen drops of £200 since launch, the 7900XTX is also dropping now and if that gets to £800 as I fully expect it will then the 7900XT will drop down further from £700. Besides you were never good at predicting these things.

Your words from this thread: Unlikely. 7900XT max will fall to £750

RTX 4070 12GB, is it Worth it?

And priced to not sell, pushing everyone into either a 4070 or 4070ti :) I'm betting £549, just slightly better than the outgoing 6950XT at £630ish. At that I might bite, I'd like a 7900XT but at £800+ I'm having a hard time justifying that.

forums.overclockers.co.uk

 

[ICDP]

You keep saying this but the 7900XT has already seen drops of £200 since launch, the 7900XTX is also dropping now and if that gets to £800 as I fully expect it will then the 7900XT will drop down further from £700. Besides you were never good at predicting these things.

Your words from this thread: Unlikely. 7900XT max will fall to £750

RTX 4070 12GB, is it Worth it?

And priced to not sell, pushing everyone into either a 4070 or 4070ti :) I'm betting £549, just slightly better than the outgoing 6950XT at £630ish. At that I might bite, I'd like a 7900XT but at £800+ I'm having a hard time justifying that.

forums.overclockers.co.uk

I agree prices may drop some more. What my point was is that the 7900 XT has dropped to what the 6800 XT replacement should be. At least if we accept the weaker pound and UK inflation.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Well its £150 cheaper than it should be, its not even 10% more expensive than the 6800XT was in November 2020.

Lets just be ####### reasonable here.....

But the launch price wasn't,just like with Zen4. So the issue is like with Nvidia they were trying a fast one.Everyone is also comparing launch prices to the worst value SKUs of the previous generation,ie,RX6900XT/RX6950XT and RTX3090/RTX3090TI.

The RX7900XT should be an RX7800XT at best. The RX6800XT was 90% of the RX6900XT and the RX7900XT is 87.5% of a RX7900XTX in terms of shader count.

But the RX6800XT had the same amount of VRAM as the RX6900XT and wasn't clocked that much lower. The RX7900XT is more cut down.

But in terms of performance at 4K:

https://tpucdn.com/review/asrock-radeon-rx-7900-xtx-taichi-white/images/relative-performance-3840-2160.png

Review from May this year. RX7900XTX reference is 19% faster than a reference RX7900XT! The reference RX6900XT is 7% faster than an RX6800XT. The RX6900XT is 23% faster than the RX6800.

So the reality,in terms of performance the RX7900XT really something between an RX7800XT and an RX7800,going by the last generation.

We all know why AMD decided to called it a RX7900XT - to justify it being priced as close to the RX7900XTX as they could get away with. All because Nvidia lead first and jacked up prices to insane levels.

Then gave Nvidia a marketing "win" when the RTX4070TI was a whole £100 "cheaper". It's almost like both are sort of not wanting to step on each other's toes.

 

[uscool]

They keep harping on about the official msrp for AMD cards knowing full well they’re so much cheaper- they should just say that now they’re the better deal?

I don't mind that as AMD watch them, pretty sure he says the same about Nvidia and has dished out Nvidia on skimping on vram

Also one of the videos he talked about how Nvidia tried to get him to focus on dlss3 and why he didn't accept

If you wanna see Nvidia shilling watch digital foundry

And you think AMD dropped prices to help consumers no it's because they tried to see what they could try to get away with

Nvidia don't seem to care or the mind share is enough even if selling lower volume the margins per card is high

 

[Aegis]

If you're going to quote me don't do it out of context.

Adjusted for inflation a November 2020 6800XT would cost £872, the 7900XT is £725.

Stuffs more expensive...

You're comparing the 6800XT's price at launch vs. the 7900XT's after seven months in an apathetic market.

In performance (and launch MSRPs) the 7900XT is 34%-ish faster than the 6800XT and 38% more expensive - as Gamers Nexus likes to say - that's stagnation - we expect to get more performance for the same money.

BTW, If you apply US inflation to the 6800XT's launch price of $649 then you get $765.00 - or $900 as AMD likes to round up

 

[ICDP]

And? HUB's point was that at $750 this card is still overpriced.

I watched the video and they said $750 was the upper end of what they felt it should have been released. They said $700 - $750 and that it was as cheap as $720 last month. They also said that the MSRP was still set at $900 so these prices are not being pushed down by AMD.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I watched the video and they said $750 was the upper end of what they felt it should have been released. They said $700 - $750 and that it was as cheap as $720 last month. They also said that the MSRP was still set at $900 so these prices are not being pushed down by AMD.

The cards were produced to be sold at $900 with the RX7900XTX being $1000. So if they are going below RRP,either AMD is making up the difference or having to drop the prices of the parts they supply to the AIB partners.

With the RX7900XTX being $999,the HUB pricing statement makes sense. The second tier card is generally better value than the top card,and the RX7900XTX is around 15% to 20% faster overall. The RX6900XT was not massively faster than the RX6800XT,but the latter was 2/3 the cost.

There was no excuse for AMD not to price this at $700~$750 at launch.

You're comparing the 6800XT's price at launch vs. the 7900XT's after seven months in an apathetic market.

In performance (and launch MSRPs) the 7900XT is 34%-ish faster than the 6800XT and 38% more expensive - as Gamers Nexus likes to say - that's stagnation - we expect to get more performance for the same money.

BTW, If you apply US inflation to the 6800XT's launch price of $649 then you get $765.00 - or $900 as AMD likes to round up

Also people are ignoring that the RTX3000/RX6000 series were priced with the Pandemic in mind,ie,high GDDR6 costs,node costs,shipping costs,issues with the factories,etc.

Lots of components like GDDR6,etc are far cheaper now and China and Taiwan have opened up now. Shipping costs have collapsed.

So what is the excuse now for high prices? Both companies making lots of extra dGPUs for miners and now they can't sell them.

 

[GhostDog1981]

You keep saying this but the 7900XT has already seen drops of £200 since launch, the 7900XTX is also dropping now and if that gets to £800 as I fully expect it will then the 7900XT will drop down further from £700. Besides you were never good at predicting these things.

Your words from this thread: Unlikely. 7900XT max will fall to £750

RTX 4070 12GB, is it Worth it?

And priced to not sell, pushing everyone into either a 4070 or 4070ti :) I'm betting £549, just slightly better than the outgoing 6950XT at £630ish. At that I might bite, I'd like a 7900XT but at £800+ I'm having a hard time justifying that.

forums.overclockers.co.uk

Well it’s only a prediction which by definition is allowed to be off slightly. £50 off where they are now isn’t that bad. I don’t think they’ll fall further- happy for you to quote me in 2 months time! Lol

 

[Calin Banc]

I do sometimes wonder if the Nvidia review guide says you're supposed to get X amount of performance and reviewers just copy that down anyway if they don't quite get there because you know what its only 5% and its not worth arguing with Nvidia over.......

I think it will depend a lot on which part of the game(s) they will test. Unfortunately is not always shown the exact benchmark run.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Nvidia Halts RTX 4000 Production: Can AMD Navi 32 Benefit?

I leak bad news for gamers hoping for lower Lovelace pricing...but also good AMD news! [SPON: Click https://tinyurl.com/yckvf34k to support MLID and get a 1...

www.youtube.com

Apparently Nvidia is restricting supply to keep margins high. These companies are so obsessed with margins(because of stock market speculation) they would rather have stuff sat on the shelves not selling,even if it means less profit.

@KompuKare alluded to this a few times.

Lets see if AMD follows Nvidia.

 

[RavenXXX2]

Amd is already restricting supply, hardly huge demand for AMD at £700+.

 

[ICDP]

You're comparing the 6800XT's price at launch vs. the 7900XT's after seven months in an apathetic market.

In performance (and launch MSRPs) the 7900XT is 34%-ish faster than the 6800XT and 38% more expensive - as Gamers Nexus likes to say - that's stagnation - we expect to get more performance for the same money.

BTW, If you apply US inflation to the 6800XT's launch price of $649 then you get $765.00 - or $900 as AMD likes to round up

And you got at me for allegedly cherry picking numbers. The 7900 XT is on average 33% - 48% faster than the 6800 XT depending on when the review was written (older drivers), or the games tested.

Various reviews between Dec 2022 and June 2023
Dec 2022 - TPU have the 7900 XT 33% faster than the 6800 XT at 4K.
Dec 2022 - HUB have the 7900 XT 34% faster than the 6800 XT.
March 2023 - TPU have the 7900 XT 37% faster than the 6800 XT at 4k
May 2023 - Computerbase have the 7900 XT 45% faster than the 6800 XT at 4K (only 3 games though)
June 2023 - Guru3d have the 7900 XT 48% faster than the 6800 XT (5 game average)

Seeing a pattern emerge yet?

 

[humbug]

But the launch price wasn't,just like with Zen4. So the issue is like with Nvidia they were trying a fast one.Everyone is also comparing launch prices to the worst value SKUs of the previous generation,ie,RX6900XT/RX6950XT and RTX3090/RTX3090TI.

The RX7900XT should be an RX7800XT at best. The RX6800XT was 90% of the RX6900XT and the RX7900XT is 87.5% of a RX7900XTX in terms of shader count.

But the RX6800XT had the same amount of VRAM as the RX6900XT and wasn't clocked that much lower. The RX7900XT is more cut down.

But in terms of performance at 4K:

https://tpucdn.com/review/asrock-radeon-rx-7900-xtx-taichi-white/images/relative-performance-3840-2160.png

Review from May this year. RX7900XTX reference is 19% faster than a reference RX7900XT! The reference RX6900XT is 7% faster than an RX6800XT. The RX6900XT is 23% faster than the RX6800.

So the reality,in terms of performance the RX7900XT really something between an RX7800XT and an RX7800,going by the last generation.

We all know why AMD decided to called it a RX7900XT - to justify it being priced as close to the RX7900XTX as they could get away with. All because Nvidia lead first and jacked up prices to insane levels.

Then gave Nvidia a marketing "win" when the RTX4070TI was a whole £100 "cheaper". It's almost like both are sort of not wanting to step on each other's toes.

The XTX is $100 cheaper than the 6900XT was in 2020.

Yes it should have been called the 7800XT, yes it should have been $750 to begin with, AMD got wrapped across the knuckles for that.
For whatever reason it is now $750.

There is a saying, never apologize for anything, they just smell weakness and make it worse for you, Nvidia haven't budged an inch, AMD have, now everyone is out for AMD's blood while Nvidia sit back with popcorn laughing never apologize for anything.

 

[Aegis]

And you got at me for allegedly cherry picking numbers. The 7900 XT is on average 33% - 48% faster than the 6800 XT depending on when the review was written (older drivers), or the games tested.

Various reviews between Dec 2022 and June 2023
Dec 2022 - TPU have the 7900 XT 33% faster than the 6800 XT at 4K.
Dec 2022 - HUB have the 7900 XT 34% faster than the 6800 XT.
March 2023 - TPU have the 7900 XT 37% faster than the 6800 XT at 4k
May 2023 - Computerbase have the 7900 XT 45% faster than the 6800 XT at 4K (only 3 games though)
June 2023 - Guru3d have the 7900 XT 48% faster than the 6800 XT (5 game average)

Seeing a pattern emerge yet?

I took that number from TPU but the average across the five reviews you've referenced is 39.4% performance increase vs. a 38% price increase.

Or - to put it another way - zero improvement in price/performance vs. the 6800XT.

HUB's testing (today) only showed a 2.5% increase vs. the launch driver BTW (or 2fps @4k)