Keyboard/Mouse Adapter Good or Bad.

Fars said:
Been a Xim user for years.

99% of the negative opinions are from people who've never used one or seen one used.

They do give an accuracy advantage.

Deleted the rest of the bumpkin
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Tada! And with that you essentially pointed out the issue that 99% of the negative opinions point to. :)
 
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Psycho Sonny said:
Well there it is - they do give an advantage.

I don't think I needed to see one or use one to know that but thanks for clearing it up anyway.
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No, but upon seeing and using them you realise the accuracy advantage is there for the tiny minority of actual decent m&kb users, not just for anyone that buys one. My point really was this is less of a problem that it is perceived to be.

Red and White said:
Wow you are so pro
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Not pro, above average and living with the reality that these adapters don't equal god mode, or anything close to it.


wannabedamned said:
Tada! And with that you essentially pointed out the issue that 99% of the negative opinions point to. :)
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Sure, but to ignore the rest of my point that the advantage is completely and utterly wasted kind of makes any intelligent discourse on the matter meaningless, no?

I knew posting in this thread would have the usual reaction, personally I don't and can't use a mouse with my xim, I started using it when they were launched as I needed a few years of physiotherapy on my right hand after the marines, and controllers back then were impossible to hold.

I'd hoped to give a little inside perspective on their use, by disabled gamers, pros and noobs alike, that the reality is nothing to fear, I frequently kill fellow xim users with a controller.

You probably do too.
 
Fars said:
They do give an accuracy advantage

Playing Ghosts with xim still give a decent advantage when spawning gets messy as you can genuinely turn on people
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These are the points people take issue with - your other points mean nothing as if you take two equally skilled players, one with a KBM setup and one with a controller, the KBM player will have an advantage over the controller.

It's obviously not the only factor in player skill-levels, but it does skew it in favour of the KBM player due to higher accuracy and turn speed.

I'd never use one myself purely as I'd feel I had an unfair advantage which would detract from the experience for me. I'd equate it to the same level as people who use speed hacks in games.
 
That is one of the main points you have raised Fars which is you may get a slight advantage in terms of accuracy, but in the grand scheme of things using a XIM adapter in no way makes it god mode or easy mode, some of the players you see on youtube for instance using a controller and are literally slaughtering people time and time again, basically my view is you get people who are good with a controller and people who are great and same with keyboard and mouse, as Fars said chances are you play against and kill XIM users often very often specially with the amount of people using it.
 
The Xim has its place. I love the idea of it being used for gamers with disabilities. That's great!

Using it in single player modes, Also fine.

But when a gamer picks it up and uses it with a sight to gain advantage over fellow controller players, well that's akin to cheating. There's no argument there atall to the contrary.

I'm good with a pad, and as a PC gamer I'm sure swapping over to using a keyboard and mouse on console will see me rising high. But I'd never do it, because it unevens the playing field.

How quickly can you turn with the analogue stick? With a High DPI mouse you can instantly spin around and pick people off.
 
The reason I'd consider it cheating is that you are no longer on a level playing field. The beauty of consoles for me is that everything (bar perhaps our net connections) are the same - we're playing the same game on the same hardware using the same controller. If I beat my opponent(s), I know it's because I'm better than they are. If they beat me, it's because they're better than I am. That's how it should be, and not because they are using a device which lets them use a KB&M that gives them a speed and accuracy advantage over my controller.

That really is the bottom line of it. Anything else is just a superfluous argument.
 
Rhodri said:
These are the points people take issue with - your other points mean nothing as if you take two equally skilled players, one with a KBM setup and one with a controller, the KBM player will have an advantage over the controller.

It's obviously not the only factor in player skill-levels, but it does skew it in favour of the KBM player due to higher accuracy and turn speed.

I'd never use one myself purely as I'd feel I had an unfair advantage which would detract from the experience for me. I'd equate it to the same level as people who use speed hacks in games.
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Sure, but the advantage is tiny, they're both still playing the same console port game, I'm trying to highlight just how little this advantage is for all but a handful of people on the planet, people good enough and that play enough they'd kill you with a controller just as fast if they developed that skill set.

I'd also add that a decent controller user the m kb guys don't get a chance to turn on, they're dead. They are dead for any user who plays fps half decently.

These aren't perfect 1:1 translations. Xim is the best adapter on the planet and adds only 25ms lag, but the engine, even with the smart translators still limits it to ever being the same as playing on pc.

They also don't turn slow movement games like Killzone or battlefield in to quake. The best place for them is call of duty as the engine has such high movement rates.

You're always bound by the games engine and the movement it allows.
 
Hmmm just to carry on the sort of topic but does that mean things like those Scuff controllers and the FPS sticks people use are in the same (Cheating) category? As using those obviously gives people an advantage over the basic controllers otherwise people simply wouldn't use or spend money on them, I get its not quite the same sort of advantage as a keyboard and mouse but none the less its still an advantage over players using the standard controller with standard stickers/buttons/triggers.

a lot of the XIM is tailored towards gamers with disabilities which I agreed with is great, but personally and obviously very much against the crowd here that I can simply switch from playing on PC to PS4/XBox One with push of a button on a switch then for me I will do that, I don't do it to cheat or simply as people seem to think slaughter controller players I do it because its simple to switch requires no change it how I play and enables me to play how I feel most comfortable and with my good old mates from work.
 
wannabedamned said:
The Xim has its place. I love the idea of it being used for gamers with disabilities. That's great!

How quickly can you turn with the analogue stick? With a High DPI mouse you can instantly spin around and pick people off.
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Yeah you should see some of the monstrous usb based controllers built by disabled gamers over the years, buttons and wires everywhere to get buttons in useable places. Track balls are a favourite too and they were a complete sod to use for me.

Personally I play on a high sensitivity with a pad now, 14/20 or about 75% in bf4, so I can turn very fast, accuracy is average I'd say. Other very good controller users max it out completely, if you can stomach watching a cod video or two go check out pwnstarzdotcom youtube channel and see what I'd say is about as good a it gets as a controller user with high or maxed sense.
 
I can't for the life of me get how people can play with a controller on ma or even high sensitivity lol I tried on about 4-5 and my god its all over the places, I try these small micro movements and I seem to aim for the sky, far beyond me the precision people get with a controller.
 
You get there slowly, raising 1 point or 10% per week and stop when the benefits do.

When my accuracy with a controller goes below 20% for an extended period I know I've gone too far (10% for lmg's).
 
what kind of disability stops you from using a controller like the DS4 yet you can still use a Mouse and KB with no issues?

both need two arms and 2 sets of hands/fingers.

the only one i can think of is if your missing a thumb and imo i wouldn't say there's a lot of gamers out there missing thumbs which equates to the amount of people using XIM.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
what kind of disability stops you from using a controller like the DS4 yet you can still use a Mouse and KB with no issues?

both need two arms and 2 sets of hands/fingers.

the only one i can think of is if your missing a thumb and imo i wouldn't say there's a lot of gamers out there missing thumbs which equates to the amount of people using XIM.
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Not that it's any of your business, and not that it has anything to do with the question posed or the topic being discussed, but today, none.

My right hand along with various other parts had a through and through from shrapnel severing tendons to the index and middle finger. During the rehabilitation I used a xim, not with a mouse as much as I would have liked to, to allow me to game.

Today I can use a controller very nicely, there are only scars left. I still use my xim from time to time out of curiosity and often to show ignorant friends that they aren't magically good due to engineering restrictions of the hardware and software.

But as a pretty decent mouse and keyboard using pc gamer I'm constantly reminded that mouse and keyboard adapters on consoles aren't what they sound like to the people filling their pants in terror.

My pc battlefield and cod profiles using mouse and keyboard are always and have always been better than my console ones, and I'd argue pc gamers, the people I play against and with, tend to be better.

Console games are just built for controllers, it shows when you've got experience of using alternative controllers like the xim.

BF4 on the PS4, for me, is the perfect example of how little advantage is offered by a mouse and keyboard adapter, personally I do much better with the controller and it isn't simple preference it is just how the game is made.

Hearing the words mouse and keyboard adapter and assuming it offers a pc like experience is incorrect and it's all I really want people to take away from my replies.

Pc mouse and keyboard is superior and amazing, consoles, with console ported games made for a controller using an adapter to translate movements is a close but ultimately poor approximation.

Anyone getting upset over people using them just doesn't understand the product in question, you get more benefit from using a headset, playing on a monitor or focusing on playing well instead of playing impulsively.

The guy using a mouse and keyboard is still bound by the same game rules as the rest of us, the adapter doesn't turn you in to neo.
 
Psycho Sonny said:
what kind of disability stops you from using a controller like the DS4 yet you can still use a Mouse and KB with no issues?

both need two arms and 2 sets of hands/fingers.

the only one i can think of is if your missing a thumb and imo i wouldn't say there's a lot of gamers out there missing thumbs which equates to the amount of people using XIM.
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there are many modded keyboard and mouse solutions out there for people with mobility issues. One of our very own members is an avid gamer and uses such devices. I imagine xim allows for those Mods to come to console. and anything that allows that to happen gets a standing ovation from me.
 
To be fair, of the few hundred xim and other adapter users I don't think more than a few percent are disability users, it's niche within niche.

But I do agree with your sentiment, its great the solution is there, even if it is for a tiny handful of users.

The last mod I did for someone was even easier, just fitting the ds4 inside a ds3 shell as their hands couldn't reach the triggers properly as they could no longer fully extend their fingers. Nice when you don't have to end up programming arduino or teensy boards.
 
yeah i'm all for people with disabilities using them if they cannot use a controller.

but i imagine it's less than 1% of users who buy them for that reason, if it has helped some though then that is great.

the problem is that the vast majority who use them aren't disabled. XIM was never designed as being such a device either, it was designed to be used by anyone.

the fact is it gives you an advantage and therefore is imo a form of cheating if you use it in online FPS games which have no native KB and mouse support.

with the DS4 to DS3 mod, what did you do with the touchpad? what about the share and options buttons? what about the headset input? or the backlight? that doesn't sound like an easy mod to me.

do you have any pics of the finished product?
 
I used an XIM on the 360 for a little while and my K/D ratio more than tripled! It's an enormous cheat and saying otherwise is just kidding yourself.
 
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