Laurence Fox

matt992 said:
He's just another in an ever growing huge amount of celebs, who uses his platform to air his thoughts on whatever opportunity he gets.

I'm thoroughly sick and tired of celebs using their fame to try and influence people, especially in political debate. I mean, why is their opinion any more valid or should have opportunity to spread them than any random person taken off the street!

The very fact you've decided to have a debate about his opinion proves he's nothing but an attention seeking whore. That's the only debate to be had, should celebs opinions be anymore important than anyone of us?
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No they should not. So why all the twittergasms? Beats me, but his views are largely sensible IMO.
 
matt992 said:
He's just another in an ever growing huge amount of celebs, who uses his platform to air his thoughts on whatever opportunity he gets.
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I agree that does happen a lot. But I'm not sure that's the case with Laurence Fox. He was relatively unknown for his views before. I had never heard of him because I rarely watch TV. Then he was attacked by what we now know was a deliberate plant in the BBC Question time audience. He was attacked for immutable characteristics of race and gender and understandably defending himself. The fact he defended himself caused the storm because apparently that's not allowed. He has said several times now that he's worried about his roles drying up and whether he even has a future as an actor. His own professional body, Equity, was forced to apologise to him for remarks they made and eight of their race relations committee resigned. I doubt that Equity would have taken that action if they felt they were in the right.

I've now started following LF on twitter and I haven't once seen him attack someone. He will reply to them asking for their opinion, asking for evidence of a claim (never getting it - sound familiar on this forum?) and usually wishing someone a good day. He seems an entirely reasonable and rational character. So far I haven't seen him express any extreme views at all.

I genuinely think LF is a decent man, father and person who has become the focus of other people's attack because of his profile. I'd say he has a lot of courage to continue speaking his mind while knowing it will probably end his acting career.
 
Hades said:
I agree that does happen a lot. But I'm not sure that's the case with Laurence Fox. He was relatively unknown for his views before. I had never heard of him because I rarely watch TV. Then he was attacked by what we now know was a deliberate plant in the BBC Question time audience. He was attacked for immutable characteristics of race and gender and understandably defending himself. The fact he defended himself caused the storm because apparently that's not allowed. He has said several times now that he's worried about his roles drying up and whether he even has a future as an actor. His own professional body, Equity, was forced to apologise to him for remarks they made and eight of their race relations committee resigned. I doubt that Equity would have taken that action if they felt they were in the right.

I've now started following LF on twitter and I haven't once seen him attack someone. He will reply to them asking for their opinion, asking for evidence of a claim (never getting it - sound familiar on this forum?) and usually wishing someone a good day. He seems an entirely reasonable and rational character. So far I haven't seen him express any extreme views at all.

I genuinely think LF is a decent man, father and person who has become the focus of other people's attack because of his profile. I'd say he has a lot of courage to continue speaking his mind while knowing it will probably end his acting career.
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Yes it is very poor when your union does not support you. In fact probably acting against your interests over non work related issues.
 
Hades said:
I agree that does happen a lot. But I'm not sure that's the case with Laurence Fox. He was relatively unknown for his views before. I had never heard of him because I rarely watch TV. Then he was attacked by what we now know was a deliberate plant in the BBC Question time audience. He was attacked for immutable characteristics of race and gender and understandably defending himself. The fact he defended himself caused the storm because apparently that's not allowed. He has said several times now that he's worried about his roles drying up and whether he even has a future as an actor. His own professional body, Equity, was forced to apologise to him for remarks they made and eight of their race relations committee resigned. I doubt that Equity would have taken that action if they felt they were in the right.

I've now started following LF on twitter and I haven't once seen him attack someone. He will reply to them asking for their opinion, asking for evidence of a claim (never getting it - sound familiar on this forum?) and usually wishing someone a good day. He seems an entirely reasonable and rational character. So far I haven't seen him express any extreme views at all.

I genuinely think LF is a decent man, father and person who has become the focus of other people's attack because of his profile. I'd say he has a lot of courage to continue speaking his mind while knowing it will probably end his acting career.
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And yet it all seems perfectly fine within the acting community and media that the Shameless actress, that the Labour politician retweeted and got sacked for, is okay to tweet anti Jewish / Israel messages and is lauded as some sort of positive role model. The double standards of these people (the Owen Jones Guardian types) is staggering.

I've always been a Labour voter and hate the Tories, however these people with there cancel culture and far left agenda sicken me so much that I could only vote Tories now as these people are all drawn to Labour. I'm convinced the vast majority of the population feel the same way as well.

It's weird as don't think I've ever met a person with this crazy far left ideologies in life outside of the internet? Weird how they have become so vocal and powerful in the media yet represent a very very tiny proportion of the population.
 
Amplus said:
I've always been a Labour voter and hate the Tories, however these people with there cancel culture and far left agenda sicken me so much that I could only vote Tories now as these people are all drawn to Labour. I'm convinced the vast majority of the population feel the same way as well.

It's weird as don't think I've ever met a person with this crazy far left ideologies in life outside of the internet? Weird how they have become so vocal and powerful in the media yet represent a very very tiny proportion of the population.
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Almost as if there's dark forces afoot, trying to get people to vote against our own interests.
 
Amplus said:
And yet it all seems perfectly fine within the acting community and media that the Shameless actress, that the Labour politician retweeted and got sacked for, is okay to tweet anti Jewish / Israel messages and is lauded as some sort of positive role model. The double standards of these people (the Owen Jones Guardian types) is staggering.

I've always been a Labour voter and hate the Tories, however these people with there cancel culture and far left agenda sicken me so much that I could only vote Tories now as these people are all drawn to Labour. I'm convinced the vast majority of the population feel the same way as well.

It's weird as don't think I've ever met a person with this crazy far left ideologies in life outside of the internet? Weird how they have become so vocal and powerful in the media yet represent a very very tiny proportion of the population.
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Yeah you're not alone in that. I won't be voting Labour in future. They are/have attracted a lot of the crazy SJW types, and seem to be happy to adopt their lunatic policies and agenda.

Wake me up when we have someone worth voting for, tbh...
 
Amplus said:
I've always been a Labour voter and hate the Tories, however these people with there cancel culture and far left agenda sicken me so much that I could only vote Tories now as these people are all drawn to Labour. I'm convinced the vast majority of the population feel the same way as well.
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I fully agree with you there.

I think the "majority" of people are relatively centrist who lean a little bit left or a little bit right but generally stick nearer to centre than to the extremes and, because they're fairly centralist, they just want everyone to get along without any fuss, follow the rules like they do and just get on with their life, which is one reason why I think Labour, who adopted so many fringe beliefs as a party, did so poorly in the election and yet didn't see it coming, despite all the evidence being laid out simply for anyone to follow.

Worse for me is that over the past decade a very small but very vocal fringe has appeared on both sides, with the right fringe being shutdown very quickly, loudly and publicly, forcing it back into hiding to lick it's wounds. Yet in comparison the left fringe has continued to shout their version of bigoted "hate" speech unabated, celebrated even, with anyone who stands up to them risking not just physical violence (a tool used by both sides) but nowadays risking financial ruin too which could be considered much worse in the eyes of the average person.

Sadly whilst I don't think for a second that Mr & Mrs Average "little bit left/right" Centralists like myself agrees with the vast majority of what this extreme fringes decree we are, maybe understandably having seen what happens to people to speak out and just with them just wanting a quiet life, deciding to keep quiet, to not challenge the fringes because of the perceived "risk". Meanwhile the very obvious hypocrisy of how different "sides" are dealt with will just continue to ferment further division rather than inclusion*, increasing the levels of anger in people until there's a tipping point and eventually a "strong" authoritarian Political party (probably Right wing) which promises to get tough on the fringes gets voted in, and then we're all in the poop.

But thats just me guessing and being a little cynical about life I suppose.

* - As an example look at recent events in the US where inclusion is now being ignored and segregation/division is being brought back by the Left fringe - actors can only play characters with the same skin colour/gender/sexual orientation etc as the actor, different national anthems for Black/White, majority "white" protests banned and/or negatively reported on but majority "black" protests allowed and praised as "peaceful" when thousands of businesses have been damaged (1500+ in one city alone) costing billions, California repealing is Civil Rights act so that the state will be able to discriminate against a person based on their skin colour once more etc etc - None of that is "inclusive" and all of it just adds to division.
 
ianh said:
* - As an example look at recent events in the US where inclusion is now being ignored and segregation/division is being brought back by the Left fringe - actors can only play characters with the same skin colour/gender/sexual orientation etc as the actor, different national anthems for Black/White, majority "white" protests banned and/or negatively reported on but majority "black" protests allowed and praised as "peaceful" when thousands of businesses have been damaged (1500+ in one city alone) costing billions, California repealing is Civil Rights act so that the state will be able to discriminate against a person based on their skin colour once more etc etc - None of that is "inclusive" and all of it just adds to division.
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The trouble with a lot of these people, is that they have decided the "ends justify the means". And "the ends" is whatever they want it to be.

Not enough black kids in university? Spend more per pupil on black children's education. OK, but what if that doesn't work sufficiently well to satisfy your agenda? Start excluding white kids until you get the result you feel you need. Give girls and black kids bonus points on their exams for having to overcome the horrid patriarchy and institutional racism (that's apparently "everywhere" now in these people's minds).

Some of the things I'm reading are just bizarre. That black kids must have black teachers. Why? Like you say it seems that segregation is coming back only now it's being pushed by the SJWs. The whole agenda is confused and hypocritical and won't lead anywhere worth going.

e: It doesn't help when these people also want to put race into literally everything. Like when I heard the other day some uni student complaining that British history (and the teaching thereof) was actually "white people's history". She said something along the lines of history teaching needing to focus more on the achievements of black people.

I only studied history in secondary school and no further. I remember (in truth I mostly *don't* remember :p) learning about the middle ages and, later, a bit about WW2.

I'm not sure how we should have "blacked up" those history lessons, and I really don't remember race being a significant part of anything that was taught.

But now it seems that some people just want history lessons that conform to a political ideology. Maybe teach how Martin Luther King is all black people (struggling for justice) and Hitler is all white people. Tbh I have no idea what these people "want" other than attention.
 
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ianh said:
I fully agree with you there.

I think the "majority" of people are relatively centrist who lean a little bit left or a little bit right but generally stick nearer to centre than to the extremes and, because they're fairly centralist, they just want everyone to get along without any fuss, follow the rules like they do and just get on with their life, which is one reason why I think Labour, who adopted so many fringe beliefs as a party, did so poorly in the election and yet didn't see it coming, despite all the evidence being laid out simply for anyone to follow.

Worse for me is that over the past decade a very small but very vocal fringe has appeared on both sides, with the right fringe being shutdown very quickly, loudly and publicly, forcing it back into hiding to lick it's wounds. Yet in comparison the left fringe has continued to shout their version of bigoted "hate" speech unabated, celebrated even, with anyone who stands up to them risking not just physical violence (a tool used by both sides) but nowadays risking financial ruin too which could be considered much worse in the eyes of the average person.

Sadly whilst I don't think for a second that Mr & Mrs Average "little bit left/right" Centralists like myself agrees with the vast majority of what this extreme fringes decree we are, maybe understandably having seen what happens to people to speak out and just with them just wanting a quiet life, deciding to keep quiet, to not challenge the fringes because of the perceived "risk". Meanwhile the very obvious hypocrisy of how different "sides" are dealt with will just continue to ferment further division rather than inclusion*, increasing the levels of anger in people until there's a tipping point and eventually a "strong" authoritarian Political party (probably Right wing) which promises to get tough on the fringes gets voted in, and then we're all in the poop.

But thats just me guessing and being a little cynical about life I suppose.

* - As an example look at recent events in the US where inclusion is now being ignored and segregation/division is being brought back by the Left fringe - actors can only play characters with the same skin colour/gender/sexual orientation etc as the actor, different national anthems for Black/White, majority "white" protests banned and/or negatively reported on but majority "black" protests allowed and praised as "peaceful" when thousands of businesses have been damaged (1500+ in one city alone) costing billions, California repealing is Civil Rights act so that the state will be able to discriminate against a person based on their skin colour once more etc etc - None of that is "inclusive" and all of it just adds to division.
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Completely agree.

In fact I'd go as far as to say the reason people (most not all) voted for Brexit wasn't because they were 'little Englanders' but because they were so sick of these vocal Owen Jones types (don't know how else to describe them other then far left which sounds weird) patronising them thrown in with the Syrian refugee crisis at that time, they voted Brexit just to **** them off..... Did most people want Brexit? No. Did they believe staying in the EU is better? Yes.....however got to the point where people were sick of being branded 'racist' and being told what to do they voted just to **** them off. I have to say as a remainer, Brexit was a glorious day to see all these patronising 'owen Jones types' crying and getting mad on social media.
 
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The above post made me google for Owen Jones since everyone seems to go on about him. That led me to this series of tweet which is just.... well.

mE3eNCj.jpg

Twitter is just terrible. I think it’s shortened my life span just by looking at it.
 
Amplus said:
In fact I'd go as far as to say the reason people (most not all) voted for Brexit wasn't because they were 'little Englanders' but because they were so sick of these vocal Owen Jones types
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Owen was suggesting leaving the EU as recently as July of 2015 and this wasn't a one of.

The left must put Britain's EU withdrawal on the agenda

The left must call the right's bluff – and challenge the EU
Why is it only Tory Eurosceptics that are highlighting Europe's lack of democracy?
 
Amplus said:
In fact I'd go as far as to say the reason people (most not all) voted for Brexit wasn't because they were 'little Englanders' but because they were so sick of these vocal Owen Jones types (don't know how else to describe them other then far left which sounds weird) patronising them thrown in with the Syrian refugee crisis at that time, they voted Brexit just to **** them off..... Did most people want Brexit? No. Did they believe staying in the EU is better? Yes.....however got to the point where people were sick of being branded 'racist' and being told what to do they voted just to **** them off. I have to say as a remainer, Brexit was a glorious day to see all these patronising 'owen Jones types' crying and getting mad on social media.
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What an utterly bizarre mindset.

"Here's something that I know will be self-defeating (potentially even self-harming) but I'm going to do it anyway to **** off some people I don't like".

Is there a better example of the phrase 'cutting off your nose to spite your face'?
 
stockhausen said:
Laurence Fox is launching a new populist political party (provisionally to be named "Reclaim") advocating the reform of publicly funded institutions, likely to include the BBC, and celebrating Britain's history and global contribution.
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Celebrating Britains history? Shouldn't we be going around apologising for our continued existence? What a cretin. /s
 
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