let's jump from n side to ati

[Final8y]

with the exception of the mentioned physx/ati issue, please give me an example of nvidia bad practice that warrants what i can only describe as hate, that is proven to be true.
I think it is likely that our definition of evidence to be same/similiar.

I am not saying nvidia are some kind of holier than thou company, but for example from bad to worse how would you rate nvidia alongside intel/microsoft

I have been asked this many times & either the person does not know, very unlikely or simply does not care.

Assassins creed 10.1.
Taking out multi threading in CPU physx
BattmanAA & i have the work around for the disabled real ingame AA on ATI cards that works flawlessly.

Even in a legal system enough history, motive & means & enough reason to suspect is enough.

I would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of.

And NV PR atm is awful, i would rather they say nothing.

 

[D13]

I have been asked this many times & either the person does not know, very unlikely or simply does not care.

Assassins creed 10.1.
Taking out multi threading in CPU physx
BattmanAA & i have the work around for the disabled real ingame AA on ATI cards that works flawlessly.

Even in a legal system enough history, motive & means & enough reason to suspect is enough.

I would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of.

And NV PR atm is awful, i would rather they say nothing.

asassin creed, so here I think we have a situation where even though we may lack 100% source, we can agree that it is likely nvidia influenced ubisoft to hold back 10.1 features. But this is not an nvidia only issue, I mean can i presume that you hate ubisoft as they are half the equation? This is i think a good example of bad nvidia behaviour, but really overall we are talking about one game (i wont even mention my opinion about the game itself).

'Taking out multi threading in CPU physx' - I dont know what you mean by this, are you saying that they change the way physx engine works? if so it is there tech now they bought it and they can do what they want with it.

Batman AA, this is what I mention earlier with regards to proving an allegation, there is zero evidence to saythat nvidia somehow forced eidos/rocksteady to actively sabotage ati cards being able to use AA.
You say you use a patch that enables it? so what? you can enable AA surely by going into the ccc, that doesnt prove anything about WHY the option isnt there in the settings menu. Surely that is a question for rocksteady/eidos? given that any supposed sabotage of ati hardware perfromance would have to involve the devs you must have course be just as critical of the devs in this case, so do you boycott batman AA as well as nvidia cards?

'I would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of.'

seriously? Intel were fined by eu court, for a company that huge with access to the finest legal team money can buy to atually recieve a anti-comp fine you have to be pretty hardcore.
As a gamer I personally have very serious problem with MS, they have seemingly abandoned pc gaming for their precious xbox, i remember when games used to load up from microsoft games studio. Now look at fable 2/ala wake for example, those are actually big titles that we as pc gamers are completely missing out as ms prioritise 360 exclusivity, and that is just scratching the surface. I find it amazing that someone could be so critical of nvidia but fine with microsoft.

Overall looking at the examples you bring up I still dont see how that fairly equates to actual 'hatred' for nvidia

 

[Final8y]

asassin creed, so here I think we have a situation where even though we may lack 100% source, we can agree that it is likely nvidia influenced ubisoft to hold back 10.1 features. But this is not an nvidia only issue, I mean can i presume that you hate ubisoft as they are half the equation? This is i think a good example of bad nvidia behaviour, but really overall we are talking about one game (i wont even mention my opinion about the game itself).

'Taking out multi threading in CPU physx' - I dont know what you mean by this, are you saying that they change the way physx engine works? if so it is there tech now they bought it and they can do what they want with it.

Batman AA, this is what I mention earlier with regards to proving an allegation, there is zero evidence to saythat nvidia somehow forced eidos/rocksteady to actively sabotage ati cards being able to use AA.
You say you use a patch that enables it? so what? you can enable AA surely by going into the ccc, that doesnt prove anything about WHY the option isnt there in the settings menu. Surely that is a question for rocksteady/eidos? given that any supposed sabotage of ati hardware perfromance would have to involve the devs you must have course be just as critical of the devs in this case, so do you boycott batman AA as well as nvidia cards?

'I would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of.'

seriously? Intel were fined by eu court, for a company that huge with access to the finest legal team money can buy to atually recieve a anti-comp fine you have to be pretty hardcore.
As a gamer I personally have very serious problem with MS, they have seemingly abandoned pc gaming for their precious xbox, i remember when games used to load up from microsoft games studio. Now look at fable 2/ala wake for example, those are actually big titles that we as pc gamers are completely missing out as ms prioritise 360 exclusivity, and that is just scratching the surface. I find it amazing that someone could be so critical of nvidia but fine with microsoft.

Overall looking at the examples you bring up I still dont see how that fairly equates to actual 'hatred' for nvidia

Don't make presumptions about me on my behalf regarding ubisoft, i really don't need your help.

Again about
battmanAA there is enough evidence for me.

Of course NV can do with Taking out multi threading in CPU physx as they like. but they can not tell me that the CPU is not capable of the effects at the same time when they have done so.

I did not say i was fine with MS or Intel the court thing is done & was because of things done in the past.
The console things you have mentions are for another thread as im talking about this platform.
We don't have to bring up every wrong doing in history by every company every time a company comes into the spotlight in the present with its practices as there would be no need for a focused topic.

We are talking about gfx card makers practise here between ATi & NV.
When MS or Intel pull there next underhanded stunt there will be topics about them like usual.

 

[D13]

Don't make presumptions about me on my behalf regarding ubisoft, i really don't need your help.

Again about
battmanAA there is enough evidence for me.

Of course NV can do with Taking out multi threading in CPU physx as they like. but they can not tell me that the CPU is not capable of the effects at the same time when they have done so.

I did not say i was fine with MS or Intel the court thing is done & was because of things done in the past.
The console things you have mentions are for another thread as im talking about this platform.
We don't have to bring up every wrong doing in history by every company every time a company comes into the spotlight in the present with its practices as there would be no need for a focused topic.

We are talking about gfx card makers practise here between ATi & NV.

'Don't make presumptions about me on my behalf regarding ubisoft, i really don't need your help.'
Have I offended you? if so iapologise as that certainly is not my intention, i was not 'offering help' just inquiring as whether you share blame ubisoft as much as you so seem to blame nvidia.

until we see legal proceedings involving the batman aa issue then we will just have to agree to disagree on that one.

'but they can not tell me that the CPU is not capable of the effects at the same time when they have done so'
Again i dont understand, are you maybe referring to some kind of specific announcement they made? if we are talking about some knid of statement, than as you mention earlier ppl care or dont care about different things.

'I did not say i was fine with MS or Intel the court thing is done & was because of things done in the past.
The console things you have mentions are for another thread as im talking about this platform.
We don't have to bring up every wrong doing in history by every company every time a company comes into the spotlight in the present with its practices as there would be no need for a focused topic.

We are talking about gfx card makers practise here between ATi & NV.
When MS or Intel pull there next underhanded stunt there will be topics about them like usual'

WHat i am trying to do is basically (from a pc gamers point of view) try to understand how ppl might feel so passionate about nvidia recent activity and yet 'would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of'. With regards to the examples you raise we are missing 'graphical effects using specific hardware' on two games (one imo) with MS we are missing ENTIRE GAMES yet as you say you 'would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of'

Look i am not some nvidia obsessed loon, in fact maybe it is arrogant but i consider myself to be a highly objective person especially when spending money, but when i see so much (and there is no other way to describe it) raw hatred for nvidia, I cant help but 'where the hell is this coming from'?

 

[Final8y]

'Don't make presumptions about me on my behalf regarding ubisoft, i really don't need your help.'
Have I offended you? if so iapologise as that certainly is not my intention, i was not 'offering help' just inquiring as whether you share blame ubisoft as much as you so seem to blame nvidia.

until we see legal proceedings involving the batman aa issue then we will just have to agree to disagree on that one.

'but they can not tell me that the CPU is not capable of the effects at the same time when they have done so'
Again i dont understand, are you maybe referring to some kind of specific announcement they made? if we are talking about some knid of statement, than as you mention earlier ppl care or dont care about different things.

'I did not say i was fine with MS or Intel the court thing is done & was because of things done in the past.
The console things you have mentions are for another thread as im talking about this platform.
We don't have to bring up every wrong doing in history by every company every time a company comes into the spotlight in the present with its practices as there would be no need for a focused topic.

We are talking about gfx card makers practise here between ATi & NV.
When MS or Intel pull there next underhanded stunt there will be topics about them like usual'

3
WHat i am trying to do is basically (from a pc gamers point of view) try to understand how ppl might feel so passionate about nvidia recent activity and yet 'would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of'. With regards to the examples you raise we are missing 'graphical effects using specific hardware' on two games (one imo) with MS we are missing ENTIRE GAMES yet as you say you 'would rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel have cleaned up there as far as im aware of'

Look i am not some nvidia obsessed loon, in fact maybe it is arrogant but i consider myself to be a highly objective person especially when spending money, but when i see so much (and there is no other way to describe it) raw hatred for nvidia, I cant help but 'where the hell is this coming from'?

NV whole physx marketing is that it can not be done on the CPU & have been proven to not be the case with some of the effects when inf files changed or patches made to enable physx Multi threading on the CPU.
I have yet to see a physx on the CPU option in any game that does not tank out the game so why even have the option there in the first place if not to prove a point.

3 the actions are not comparable so have no relevance to this specific case as that is PC V Console & many including me are not happy with many games not appearing on the PC & would have been said so many times in the PC gaming section ,so as i said its not relevant to this topic.


Some people may have raw hated for NV i have not. if the situation with practices changed places between ATI ^ NV i would be coming straight down on ATI.

 

[straxusii]

The batman AA issue is the biggest problem, anyone who doesnt think this is due to marketing pressure from Nvidia is in cloud cuckoo land.

 

[TheRealDeal]

I think the nv hating all started back with the rebranding of the g92 cards over and over. There practices of late have enraged a lot of people so they must be doing something wrong. There are just some situations where you can't prove it 100% but you know the truth in your own mind.

 

[Final8y]

I think the nv hating all started back with the rebranding of the g92 cards over and over. There practices of late have enraged a lot of people so they must be doing something wrong. There are just some situations where you can't prove it 100% but you know the truth in your own mind.

When im asked about all the things NV have gotten upto i seem to not be able to remember them all at once like the one you mentioned & the renamed chipset.

 

[D13]

NV whole physx marketing is that it can not be done on the CPU & have been proven to not be the case with some of the effects when inf files changed or patches made to enable physx Multi threading on the CPU.
I have yet to see a physx on the CPU option in any game that does not tank out the game so why even have the option there in the first place if not to prove a point.

3 the actions are not comparable so have no relevance to this specific case as that is PC V Console & many including me are not happy with many games not appearing on the PC & would have been said so many times in the PC gaming section ,so as i said its not relevant to this topic.


Some people may have raw hated for NV i have not. if the situation with practices changed places between ATI ^ NV i would be coming straight down on ATI.

honestly what difference does it make what nvidia or anyone else says about how physx can be carried out on different hardware. the tech is owned by nvidia so it just amkes NO difference.

'the actions are not comparable so have no relevance to this specific case as that is PC V Console'
that is just dodging my point, my point is not about pc vs console, but how a pc gamer can 'rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel' it's just difficult understand

The batman AA issue is the biggest problem, anyone who doesnt think this is due to marketing pressure from Nvidia is in cloud cuckoo land.

Or maybe those ppl on cloud cuckoo land are just not as fortunate as you having such exclusive access to information

I think the nv hating all started back with the rebranding of the g92 cards over and over. There practices of late have enraged a lot of people so they must be doing something wrong. There are just some situations where you can't prove it 100% but you know the truth in your own mind.

Seriously what is the significance of the hardware behind a name, ALL THAT MATTERS IS PRICE AND PERFORMANCE.

Tell me if nvidia released the gtx380 and it was revealed to be nothing more than a gtx280 but sold it for a fiver, would you complain? no because the only thing that matters is the cost and the performance

 

[Final8y]

honestly what difference does it make what nvidia or anyone else says about how physx can be carried out on different hardware. the tech is owned by nvidia so it just amkes NO difference.

The fact that its owned by NV & they can do whatever they like with it is not the point.
The point is what NV claim & in fact what is are not the same.
Basically NV are making false claims about there product.

'the actions are not comparable so have no relevance to this specific case as that is PC V Console'
that is just dodging my point, my point is not about pc vs console, but how a pc gamer can 'rate NV worse atm as MS & Intel' it's just difficult understand

Its difficult to understand because everyone has different priorities to you in what is most important to them at any given time which could all change tomorrow.
Anyway if you applied NV to MS then the only browser & Mediaplayer, email client, Paint programs, DVD burning app. Anti virus .ect... allowed on windows would be MS own.

 

[D13]

The fact that its owned by NV & they can do whatever they like with it is not the point.
The point is what NV claim & in fact what is are not the same.
Basically NV are making false claims about there product.


Its difficult to understand because everyone has different priorities to you in what is most important to them at any given time which could all change tomorrow.
Anyway if you applied NV to MS then the only browser & Mediaplayer, email client, Paint programs, DVD burning app. Anti virus .ect... allowed on windows would be MS own.

'The fact that its owned by NV & they can do whatever they like with it is not the point.
The point is what NV claim & in fact what is are not the same.
Basically NV are making false claims about there product.'

if they are making false claims (tbh i am too unfamiliar with the relevant technical details to even guess whether it is or not) then I doubt it would be far off any of the coutless claims made by pretty much every company each day.

'Anyway if you applied NV to MS then the only browser & Mediaplayer, email client, Paint programs, DVD burning app. Anti virus .ect... allowed on windows would be MS own.'

tbh that i think it a very exaggerated comparison, it is hard to draw any comparison as the companies fields are so different.

'Its difficult to understand because everyone has different priorities to you in what is most important to them at any given time which could all change tomorrow.'

maybe that is a good point to leave it on, but 'difference in priorities' is one thing, and what seems like excessive and un warranted criticism is another.

 

[Final8y]

'The fact that its owned by NV & they can do whatever they like with it is not the point.
The point is what NV claim & in fact what is are not the same.
Basically NV are making false claims about there product.'

if they are making false claims (tbh i am too unfamiliar with the relevant technical details to even guess whether it is or not) then I doubt it would be far off any of the coutless claims made by pretty much every company each day.

'Anyway if you applied NV to MS then the only browser & Mediaplayer, email client, Paint programs, DVD burning app. Anti virus .ect... allowed on windows would be MS own.'

tbh that i think it a very exaggerated comparison, it is hard to draw any comparison as the companies fields are so different.

'Its difficult to understand because everyone has different priorities to you in what is most important to them at any given time which could all change tomorrow.'

maybe that is a good point to leave it on, but 'difference in priorities' is one thing, and what seems like excessive and un warranted criticism is another.

Yes the companies fields are so different but you brought them into it anyway.

Just because other companies makes false claims does not pardon NV.
And i repeat we are not talking about other company practises in general, we are talking about NV & ATI. try to stick to the topic.