Luton airport...

tom_e said:
My wife's car has a pee poor rear window which is fine as it's got a rear camera...until like the other day when I was in a rammed Aldi carpark trying to squeeze out of a space with other cars poking out of theirs and the camera decides it doesn't want to turn on :o

Tech is great but my mirrors are never going to refuse to turn on :D
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fair point....... at which point my dad would probably say "use your offside mirrors" (he was a van / lorry driver and was used to no rear vision........ I am not and hate driving without it - and it still does not give you the absolute back of your car!)
 
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tom_e said:
My wife's car has a pee poor rear window which is fine as it's got a rear camera...until like the other day when I was in a rammed Aldi carpark trying to squeeze out of a space with other cars poking out of theirs and the camera decides it doesn't want to turn on :o

Tech is great but my mirrors are never going to refuse to turn on :D
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I'm seeing more of those wing-mirror cameras appearing too, first on some Audis, now that awesome little Honda-E thingy, I'm sure I've seen more. As as biker I can't see what the driver of the car is doing like I can with "normal" mirrors, can't stand the bloody things!
 
Diddums said:
I'm seeing more of those wing-mirror cameras appearing too, first on some Audis, now that awesome little Honda-E thingy, I'm sure I've seen more. As as biker I can't see what the driver of the car is doing like I can with "normal" mirrors, can't stand the bloody things!
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Good point!
 
Diddums said:
I'm seeing more of those wing-mirror cameras appearing too, first on some Audis, now that awesome little Honda-E thingy, I'm sure I've seen more. As as biker I can't see what the driver of the car is doing like I can with "normal" mirrors, can't stand the bloody things!
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I absolutely do not want them on my offside mirrors .... imo the rear mirror is different and it's far more useful
 
Ali195 said:
Everytime I see these huge SUV type vehicles, the monsters, all i think of is how the heck do they park these things and not have to squeeze out or go searching the very corner of car parks for a double empty space. Horrible. Surely these people go shopping in them at some point?
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Its easy with a 360 camera, parking sensors front, back and down the sides, combined with auto-park its hard to go wrong.

Biggest issue is how much the car stick out of some spaces.
 
The younger generation now, have never had a car with good visibility, where you can see where the boot and wings are,
A pillars slimmer too (speaking to you ID3) passive safety as opposed to NCAP points.
the reliance on electronic aids probably contributes to loss in dexterity driving the car forward through traffic crowded streets ... and increased accidents especially novice drivers
 
jpaul said:
The younger generation now, have never had a car with good visibility, where you can see where the boot and wings are,
A pillars slimmer too (speaking to you ID3) passive safety as opposed to NCAP points.
the reliance on electronic aids probably contributes to loss in dexterity driving the car forward through traffic crowded streets ... and increased accidents especially novice drivers
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Not to mention the free workout of no power steering, tinnitus from all the rattles and tinny engines or 3rd degree burns from welding the rust patches:D
 
m4rmite said:
Not to mention the free workout of no power steering, tinnitus from all the rattles and tinny engines or 3rd degree burns from welding the rust patches:D
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Plus increased dexterity from using the choke and fitting the baked bean can around the rusted exhaust with gun gum.
 
Hades said:
Plus increased dexterity from using the choke and fitting the baked bean can around the rusted exhaust with gun gum.
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Guilty, drove 125miles with a baked beans can, two cable ties and asbestos cloth sandwiched in. Folks turning heads expecting a beast but see Rover 25 young lad keeping revs low as possible due to embarrassment :D.
 
jpaul said:
The younger generation now, have never had a car with good visibility, where you can see where the boot and wings are,
A pillars slimmer too (speaking to you ID3) passive safety as opposed to NCAP points.
the reliance on electronic aids probably contributes to loss in dexterity driving the car forward through traffic crowded streets ... and increased accidents especially novice drivers
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My feeling is your statement is wrong. Older drivers are usually less well trained drivers and driving was far more dangerous 30-50 years ago than now. Car accidents / fatalities are significantly down on the 60s, 70s & 80s. Cars are much safer with better driving tests and requirements to drive and safer road systems and Legislation.

Data link here:

 
Diddums said:
I'm seeing more of those wing-mirror cameras appearing too, first on some Audis, now that awesome little Honda-E thingy, I'm sure I've seen more. As as biker I can't see what the driver of the car is doing like I can with "normal" mirrors, can't stand the bloody things!
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Yeah I don't think drivers appreciate how bikers use car mirrors to see if the driver has seen us.
 
Shoza said:
My feeling is your statement is wrong. Older drivers are usually less well trained drivers and driving was far more dangerous 30-50 years ago than now. Car accidents / fatalities are significantly down on the 60s, 70s & 80s. Cars are much safer with better driving tests and requirements to drive and safer road systems and Legislation.

Data link here:

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Driving tests may have been simpler. However a million miles or so of experience in all sorts of situations helps. Roads are safer today we're it not for excessive traffic volumes, excessive and often unnecessary signage and concern for cameras in box junctions or for speed monitoring.

Driving a car safely can be much harder today. Electronic aids and screens in cars are a step backwards when all your attention should be outside the car not in.
 
thought this advert on during rugby break epitomized the suv size problem
you buy a * tank and mess up everyones life, but tech will save you, and you probably wouldn't be slim enough to get into the car anyway, if the advert was 'filmed' in the uk.

 
Shoza said:
My feeling is your statement is wrong. Older drivers are usually less well trained drivers and driving was far more dangerous 30-50 years ago than now. Car accidents / fatalities are significantly down on the 60s, 70s & 80s. Cars are much safer with better driving tests and requirements to drive and safer road systems and Legislation.
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those statistics whilst they show accident of young versus old/others have remained the same ratio don't show what the change of number of accidents per mile/trip are for each demographic.

Relative car insurance premiums are probably the best measure of any reduced driving competency in young ? albeit younger folks may be driving more expensive cars than they used to /PCP's ,so even that would be difficult to interpret.
 
jpaul said:
those statistics whilst they show accident of young versus old/others have remained the same ratio don't show what the change of number of accidents per mile/trip are for each demographic.

Relative car insurance premiums are probably the best measure of any reduced driving competency in young ? albeit younger folks may be driving more expensive cars than they used to /PCP's ,so even that would be difficult to interpret.
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How the hell do you manage to make these posts, and other posts are like you ate & then puked up a scrabble set? :confused:
 
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Hagar said:
Driving tests may have been simpler. However a million miles or so of experience in all sorts of situations helps. Roads are safer today we're it not for excessive traffic volumes, excessive and often unnecessary signage and concern for cameras in box junctions or for speed monitoring.

Driving a car safely can be much harder today. Electronic aids and screens in cars are a step backwards when all your attention should be outside the car not in.
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Lane control (well the Vauxhall implementation) was horribly distracting for an old fart like myself who cut his driving teeth on cars which needed their point cleaning and gapping.

The first time it happened, I was joining the A12 in roadworks near Bishop‘s Stortford and the lane control system decided we needed to steer away from the main carriageway and I immediately thought a front tyre had blown out as that’s the only thing I know apart from deep surface water that tugs the steering wheel like that.

I counter-steered and all was well again. Pulled into the next lay-by and checked around the car. Clocked the warn8ng indication next time it happened and twigged what was going on. Found the switch to disable it and drove happily thereafter, remembering to turn the damned thing off every time I got into the car.
 
Shoza said:
My feeling is your statement is wrong. Older drivers are usually less well trained drivers and driving was far more dangerous 30-50 years ago than now. Car accidents / fatalities are significantly down on the 60s, 70s & 80s. Cars are much safer with better driving tests and requirements to drive and safer road systems and Legislation.

Data link here:

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I would disagree. A large proportionate of older drivers would have driven a RWD car on skinny 155 section tyres so would have learnt car control. The vast majority of new pass drivers now will have never driven RWD and if they have it will all have nanny controls on it. Most can barely manage a manual gearbox.

There are less accidents because of increased technology not because of better drivers. ABS is a massive one that I can think of. Locking up the wheels on a non ABS car can be a massive brown trouser moment.

I think age is pretty irrelevant anyway. What matters is what you have done with your driving.

If I had a choice of a van driver that has driven all over the UK for 10 years but has had 2-3 prangs or someone who hasn't left their town driving locally for ten years but has had no accidents I would take the first person in a heartbeat because he most likely has 500+k varied miles on his belt compared to 30-40k of the same roads.
 
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adam cool dude said:
I think age is pretty irrelevant anyway. What matters is what you have done with your driving.

If I had a choice of a van driver that has driven all over the UK for 10 years but has had 2-3 prangs or someone who hasn't left their town driving locally for ten years but has had no accidents I would take the first person in a heartbeat because he most likely has 500+k varied miles on his belt compared to 30-40k of the same roads.
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I think you are conflating 2 things which are not necessarily the same.

I would much rather a technically only adequate driver (who was capable of passing their test) be on the road, making full use of driver aids such as adaptive cruise and ABS , and whilst maybe not actually that amazing at controlling a drift on a damp roundabout , keep a safe distance behind people on the road and don't hoon through residential areas.....

than a driver who thinks he is Lewis Hamilton , and maybe technically IS a more talented driver if push came to shove on a track or driving sim, but who likes to try to climb in the back of my car on a motorway , weaving in and out of traffic because they have the "skills" and just generally being really aggressive.

obviously I am painting with a wide brush and there is a whole range of people but imo a lot of drivers who think they are really good drivers and pooh pooh traction control and what not because they can do it better......... are more likely to the the bell ends who are super aggressive on the road. and I would take a less "talented" driver over them every time.
 
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