M140i, Golf R, S3 - Anything else to look at?

[Diddums x]

Which once again leads me back to why not save your money and choose a MX5 / GT86 then as they are equally as visceral / demanding? In fact a GT86 is moreso because it has a lower centre of mavity and less grip than a Boxster... which by your assertion must equal a better, more engaging drive.

What? Seriously? What a load of toss. The GT86 for a start is slower. Much, much slower. As is the MX5. The GT86 isn't a droptop, although the MX5 is.

You seem to look at cars and go "engine? check. Four wheels? Check. Fast? Check - cool, that's all those cars sorted then".

Do you really not understand the difference between those cars or are you being obtuse for the sake of it? Those two cars are in completely different leagues from the Boxster. Yes there are similarities but I can guarantee you that a Boxster is a much, much more pleasant place to be.

Here, where would you rather sit?

Spoiler

And that's before the keys have even been insterted in to the ignition.

 

[Nasher]

The gt86 is a proper manual, I'll take that

 

[SDK^]

I'll also take the GT86 and use the £20k+ left over for 100 track days
Plus, I prefer the digital clock in the GT86

 

[pioneer2000]

Diddums, we're discussing how people can say hatchbacks aren't worthy of the money but for some bizarre reason entry level Porsches are.

An 86 provides a very similar experience to a Cayman, in many ways it's actually more of a drivers car, being lighter, with a lower centre of mavity, having no bits that get in the way like steering controls etc.

It's greatly amusing that the A45 being faster than a Cayman R is glossed over, yet an 86 cannot be compared to a Boxster/Cayman because it's "slow".

At the end of the day you're paying double the price of a GT86 to get in a Cayman, and most of that is the badge and a bit more performance that many here claim is "never used on the road".

Why are you even looking at interior quality when comparing drivers cars?

Also, the ergonomic layout of the 86 is arguably better than a Cayman. Which is what matters the most in a drivers car, no?

 

[Diddums x]

Because it's not ONLY about driving, as has been said numerous times, including by you. If that was the case, we wouldn't be discussing four door hatchbacks but rather Lotus 7s and the like. The fact is that these cars also need to be lived with on a daily basis, in which case I'd rather have a Porsche a million times before I'd have a GT86 or MX5. The fit & finish, materials used, build quality, ride quality, it's all on a whole different level to an GT86. Yes the GT86 might be more fun in the right conditions but for most people those conditions happen one or two days a month at best, so for the other 29 days I'd prefer a nice plush ride.


I will concede that a Boxster is probably about as practical as a housebrick for the OP's purposes which is why it shouldn't even factor in the discussion, the point I was making was that a four door hatchback should under to circumstances cost as much as a purpose built sports car. Whether you agree with me or not is your problem, that's my opinion and I'm going to be a spoilt brat and stick with it.

 

[paradigm]

I can't get my head around the fact that the argument exists in the thread, full stop.

Someone who wants the practicality of a 5-door hatch or small estate isn't going to find a use for a Cayman, GT86, MX5 or Maybach, regardless of cost/performance/wheel count similarities.

The premium hot <insert body shape here> exists because there are times that you might want the performance, but you are lifestyle limited to <insert body shape here>.

 

[pioneer2000]

the point I was making was that a four door hatchback should under to circumstances cost as much as a purpose built sports car.

This is exactly what we're skirting around - As a purpose built sports car, they're still slower, less practical and more expensive than the current crop of hyper hatches.

There's no justifiable reason to flat out state that because it's a hatchback shape, it can't justify the cost.

If anything, the Boxsters and Caymans are now struggling to justify their cost, as they're outperformed by hatches and cheaper alternatives like the aformentioned 86 and MX5 do the same job as a drivers car.

 

[Diddums x]

This was my point all along:

the point I was making was that a four door hatchback should under to circumstances cost as much as a purpose built sports car.

How we've got to the point where we're comparing MX5s to A45 AMGs is a bit of a tricky journey but hey ho, here we are

 

[pioneer2000]

I can't get my head around the fact that the argument exists in the thread, full stop.

Someone who wants the practicality of a 5-door hatch or small estate isn't going to find a use for a Cayman, GT86, MX5 or Maybach, regardless of cost/performance/wheel count similarities.

The premium hot <insert body shape here> exists because there are times that you might want the performance, but you are lifestyle limited to <insert body shape here>.

But this is where the problem started, with people coming in claiming that the A45 / RS3 / Golf R etc don't justify their cost, despite them being the most suitable car for the OP. The point is that these cars bring both performance and practicality to the table, that's why they are priced as they are.

 

[chaparral]

Here, where would you rather sit?


And that's before the keys have even been insterted in to the ignition.

LOL at it having a boring Auto gearbox

 

[pioneer2000]

This was my point all along:



How we've got to the point where we're comparing MX5s to A45 AMGs is a bit of a tricky journey but hey ho, here we are

lol (just after I posted, damn you!)

Of course they can justify the cost - they're better in the majority of metrics as a road car, than these "purpose built sports cars".

 

[DAIR]

It's all these youngens care about. Top speed and 0-60 times.

OP just bag the Golf R and be done with it.

 

[pioneer2000]

It's all this youngens care about. Top speed and 0-60 times.

OP just bag the Golf R and be done with it.

Definitely should be the M140 if he's on a budget.

RWD, so it satisifies all this precision handling / drifting crowd, 6 cylinder engine so we don't get anyone slating it for being a 4 pot, and you can actually fit more than 2 people and a handbag in it.

 

[DAIR]

Definitely should be the M140 if he's on a budget.

RWD, so it satisifies all this precision handling / drifting crowd, 6 cylinder engine so we don't get anyone slating it for being a 4 pot, and you can actually fit more than 2 people and a handbag in it.

True.

Save yourself even more money and bag a used 135i.

 

[Diddums x]

Save yourself even more money and get a 116d, stick some M badges on it and voila, all your mates will be amazed.

 

[DAIR]

Here we go!

 

[SDK^]

The point I was making was that a four door hatchback should under to circumstances cost as much as a purpose built sports car. Whether you agree with me or not is your problem, that's my opinion and I'm going to be a spoilt brat and stick with it.

It (A45) doesn't cost the same as a Boxster though does it - that's the point you missed several pages back
RRP there is £2k difference AND after you add the options to the Porsche which are standard on the A45 the difference is about £10k+, so that makes the Boxster £50k

 

[Schnippzle]

Been driving the M140i for nearly two months now and loving every minute of it. A-roads it's awesome on, motorways it's a decent cruiser. All roads, it just makes me smile.

 

[Gibbo]

Hi,

Just starting to look at replacements for my Focus ST as my deal (PCP) is up in March.

I've narrowed it down to the 3 mentioned in the title, but just want to check I've not missed anything off?


Requirements:
5 doors (would consider an estate, but need a hatch for the dog)
~240hp+
'Sporty'
Auto preferable
Petrol
Upto ~£35k

I quite like the look of the V40's, but don't think they would trump either listed above considering they're around the same price (in T5 auto spec).


Anything else?

This thread makes my head hurt a lot reading it, seems like no one actually read your post.

M140i: I've being fortunate enough to have a lot of seat time in an M135i as a friend keeps upgrading his and then throws me the keys to see what I think. He has the car mapped to around 400 horses, with LC and a LSD fitted. In short to drive its a nice car, it has huge grip (MPSS tyres) in pretty much all conditions and if statistics is your thing it accelerates pretty quick, sub 4.5 to 60 and around 10 to 100, it has the auto box, not DCT the other one that BMW have, 8 speed I think. Its a great all round car, I am sure an M140i will be nearly as quick but more refined and modern in other areas. Also for a turbocharged motor BMW have got it sounding quite nice, he does have some BMW induction, BMW sports exhaust on it but it does lovely pops and crackles. The downside, the steering is vague, I don't find the front-end very confident inspiring and well the AUTO box when in manual mode is not really for me, DCT found in the M cars is much better. I am not a fan of the interior or looks of 1 series either, but its a good all rounder and would suit your needs perfectly.

Golf R: I like these, they just blend in and doing everything well, they do not exceed at particular anything, but they are good at everything, I like the looks and styling though the interior is a bit boring, but quality is fine. Dare I say it I even prefer the steering feel on these, a little more confident inspiring compared to the BMW, I suspect the 4WD/Haldex is partially assisting with this however. Its a good all round car! Also the PDK is excellent in them, in manual mode a bit quicker and more responsive than the other offerings, though it is very smooth which for me is the downer. I like the artificial thud, kick in the back the BMW auto gives.

S3: Buy the the Golf R instead, or find some extra pennies and get the RS3, yes the handling is a bit weaker than the Golf R but for me it does everything else better, sounds much better (5 cylinder), is nicer inside, it is faster and it looks nicer.

A45 AMG: Cannot belief I am recommending same car as Pioneer, but if you happy to grab something a year old, these fall into budget I think, they look better and are a nicer place to sit than all the above, only weaknesses are well the auto gearbox like the M135i is great as an auto as you'd expect but in manual mode again its no DCT or Porsche PDK Sports Plus, but its OK.


No idea why Boxsters, GT86's are being mentioned but hey if you want the most fun and best handling experience (forgetting lap times) just get a Caterham or a Lotus.