Manchester City and PSG breach Uefa FFP rules.

So how does this help competition other than keeping the established rich clubs at the top of the table forever?

It doesn't, that's the point.

I've mentioned this before, UEFA first started talking about financial controls due to the amount of debt in football. The biggest sides didn't give a **** about this though and a compromise with UEFA was reached. UEFA can pretend they're doing something to help clubs and the biggest clubs no longer need to worry about another Chelsea, City or PSG popping up and making it more expensive for them to stay at the top.
Will FFP affect Man.U at all if they're not in Europe next season seeing as they're going to spend '£150m-£200m' and revenues will be at least £30m down apparently?

Their revenues aren't likely to be down. They'll lose CL money but the new TV deal, sponsorship deals etc will compensate.

And even if they spent £200m net, that cost will be spread over the life of the contracts of the new signings. So if you say that each player signs a 5 year deal, that £200m will only cost £40m per season.
 
I'm not sure if anybody has mentioned it yet but this punishment isn't 100% final. Any effected teams (Everton and Utd being the most directly effected) can still appeal the punishment if they feel it's too lenient.
 
Not with the genuine income we take, it's done over 5 years as well afaik and City got caught out because of the dodgy sponsorships where it was basically the Sheiq giving his own company money.

I don't even see why that's an issue, at least with these other clubs coming along we have actually had some competition in the league. If he couldn't afford it and was borrowing against the club then fine I see the problem but he isn't.

If the Sugar Daddy packs up shop and decides he doesn't want to spend any more money in the club what will happen then?

It's to protect clubs spending within their means so they dont go bankrupt in the future.

If Man $ity's sheik stopped putting money into the club it would most likely go into administration which could have disastrous consequences.

How is that anymore dangerous that what we currently have, all except a few clubs owing lots of money and servicing debt each year? City would still have the assets and a club to sell if he decided to quit.

So we are back to Man United being the club that can out spend everyone and take all the best players and price every one else out the market. Especially when they have paid off their debt. Well that will be a great league, unless of course you are a United fan that is happy winning like that every year.
 
I don't even see why that's an issue, at least with these other clubs coming along we have actually had some competition in the league. If he couldn't afford it and was borrowing against the club then fine I see the problem but he isn't.

It's about operating within your means though, basically signing your own deal for sponsorship and naming rights to balance the books is dodgy and not operating within yours means, I dread to think the losses City would be making if they didn't have such deals in place.
 
Toothless load of old crap. The place should have gone to Everton. City knew the FFP rules and chose to carry on regardless.
 
It's about operating within your means though, basically signing your own deal for sponsorship and naming rights to balance the books is dodgy and not operating within yours means, I dread to think the losses City would be making if they didn't have such deals in place.

Why does it matter? They can afford to make 10x the losses they have and it wouldn't be an issue.

FFP won't stop some cowboy taking over Pompey and bankrupting them. It will put off anybody buying City and ploughing 100's of £m's into the City of Manchester, youth development and so on.
 
Why does it matter? They can afford to make 10x the losses they have and it wouldn't be an issue.

FFP won't stop some cowboy taking over Pompey and bankrupting them. It will put off anybody buying City and ploughing 100's of £m's into the City of Manchester, youth development and so on.

Don't get me wrong I can see both sides, same with Chelsea, if that owner decides to do that then fair enough, he owns it.

There has to be some kind of levelling out though, it will turn into La Liga with two super rich clubs fighting it out. (bar this season of course :p)
 
It's about operating within your means though, basically signing your own deal for sponsorship and naming rights to balance the books is dodgy and not operating within yours means, I dread to think the losses City would be making if they didn't have such deals in place.

Yeah their losses would be huge, but so what they have the money there to fund it. I totally get that things need to change, a fairer system and bring down costs but this isn't going to do anything other than make sure Manu Barca and Real Madrid are always at the top of the league.

Surely you would rather see a more competitve league than that, where everyone worked to the same transfer and wage budget. So the teams with the best manager can build a team rather than have it ripped apart every transfer window?

I would also make players that came through the youth system for 4 years or from a lower league exempt from any totting up to encourage teams to bring through players.

I know it's a dream world I live in where one year Sunderland could create a good squad with wage and transfer parity and three years down the line it could be someone else.

I just don't see the benefit of keeping the rich club at the top all the time.

Toothless load of old crap. The place should have gone to Everton. City knew the FFP rules and chose to carry on regardless.

So a club in debt and in financially a much worst state should make way for a team that is funded? What about Liverpool, they lost 90m? Should Spurs have their place?
 
Don't get me wrong I can see both sides, same with Chelsea, if that owner decides to do that then fair enough, he owns it.

There has to be some kind of levelling out though, it will turn into La Liga with two super rich clubs fighting it out. (bar this season of course :p)

What does FFP achieve regarding competitiveness though? The biggest clubs spend the most and stay as the biggest clubs.

We won't see another Blackburn ever win the League again.
 
There has to be some kind of levelling out though, it will turn into La Liga with two super rich clubs fighting it out. (bar this season of course :p)

And how will that change if you can only spend your profits. Manu could out spend everyone by quite some margin? So it could actually be worse than Real Madrid and Barca?

You can't magic up the years of history and fans United have without over spending like City have. They would still have to win the league for the next 10 years to have kids start to say they will choose City. I don't see how they or anyone can make a fight of it without spending more.

Except Arsenal and wenger for a brief period of history no one else has managed it when you look at the teams that have won the premiership. I can't recall what Leeds spent. None of those teams would have a hope if all they could spend was profit.
 
Yeah their losses would be huge, but so what they have the money there to fund it. I totally get that things need to change, a fairer system and bring down costs but this isn't going to do anything other than make sure Manu Barca and Real Madrid are always at the top of the league.

Surely you would rather see a more competitve league than that, where everyone worked to the same transfer and wage budget. So the teams with the best manager can build a team rather than have it ripped apart every transfer window?

I would also make players that came through the youth system for 4 years or from a lower league exempt from any totting up to encourage teams to bring through players.

I know it's a dream world I live in where one year Sunderland could create a good squad with wage and transfer parity and three years down the line it could be someone else.

I just don't see the benefit of keeping the rich club at the top all the time.



So a club in debt and in financially a much worst state should make way for a team that is funded? What about Liverpool, they lost 90m? Should Spurs have their place?

City have spent a small fortune in the last few years on players, and even Jose mentioned in Jan that they had to balance the books with the Mata sale before buying Saleh ( sp?) because of their recent spending. Utd are only in the position they are in this summer because for the last three or four seasons they havent spent the earth on getting new players.

Look at City ' s / Chelsea' s results this season ( even after all that spending), its not anywhere near as clear cut as Spain or Germany - quite a few bad / surprising results in there ( even before thinking about the financial parity of any two sides).

It could also be argued that handing Everton £70-80m. (or ~ 60m difference) for their fine 5th place will make a much bigger change for the better to their finances than adding the same amount to City's books for the difference in winnings between 12/13 and 13/14.

So you want Rooney' s wages to be exempt , thank you very much:D ( inside our boarders, it shouldnt matter that a player who grown up / trained im the UK has changed UK clubs to be counted for this kind of rule). In all fairness though from a sqaud size point of view they will be exempt below 21 years of age - but there is still a big disparity between the quality of any given Epl game and that of any given U18/U21 game which doesnt help the flow of younsters into the senior game. Umtil any player starts getting regular appearances at the senior level financially they are going to be invisible simply because these players will be on peanuts comparatively anyway.

For right or wrong 1/2 the league is more concerned about actually staying in the league year on year ( and direct parity between themselves) rather than breaking the top four / five monopoly. When the points gap between 11th/12th and relegation is the same as 4 th/5 th and 7 th ( which I dont believe is that different from last few years), this isnt going to change.

Liverpool came out in profit then over the year if they lost £90m but won ~£100m for coming 2nd and having a few more live games. Good for them.

Are there any likely individuals that have a comparative wealth like Jack walker at Blackburn nowadays ( surely £25M on players in the early 90's must be like 200-300m now, or £5m for an individual player compared to £40m now)?

If someone comes in and buys Villa for example, surely its financially prudent to build the brand slowly again consistantly challanging the top 10, and trying for long cup runs while encouraging better commercial deals over the years than doing a Leeds and risking everything on one or two seasons of immense spending ( and possibly seeing it all go down the pan thanks to one or two bad injuries)

The world is a different place to the early 90's, I can see both sides but imo these days it just isnt realistic ( even without ffp) to expect a Blackburn to happen ( it wasnt exactly a regular occurance before this)
 
Will FFP affect Man.U at all if they're not in Europe next season seeing as they're going to spend '£150m-£200m' and revenues will be at least £30m down apparently?

I doubt £200m would even come close considering the turnover if United is so high in comparison to everyone else.
 
Did Everton or Liverpool break the FFP rules?

My point is how is those teams especially Everton struggling to balance the books any better than a club that is spending money they have or Liverpool losing 90m but exempt from FFP until August.

Look at City ' s / Chelsea' s results this season ( even after all that spending), its not anywhere near as clear cut as Spain or Germany - quite a few bad / surprising results in there ( even before thinking about the financial parity of any two sides).

Not but it will be as clear cut if the clubs with a smaller fan base and income can't spend the money they actually have. No one can match Uniteds turnover, so you create a system where they win every year.

So you want Rooney' s wages to be exempt , thank you very much:D

Rooney went through Evertons youth system not uniteds :p My point being if United bought through another Scholes I would make his wages exempt from FFP. If they brought a player from Barnsley I would do the same. Encourage teams to have better youth set ups and hang on to them.
 
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