Marina Bay Circuit -Singapore Grand Prix 2009 - Race 14/17

Thomas. PLease. · 27 Sep 2009 at 20:19

arknor said:
barrichelo would have finished ahead of him if it wasnt for button beeing able to take advantage of a safety car pitstop.

i wouldnt call that outclassing someone the situation played into his hands end of

The safety car pitstop was a disadvantage for button. He had another four laps fuel had the s/c not come out he would have had even more of an advantage.

JRS · 27 Sep 2009 at 20:36

SKILL said:
Button is/has been quite lucky in a couple of races, but to give him his dues his race today was good, if only for ~10 laps before his stop where he set some consistantly quick laps to leapfrog past heikki and barrichello.

That's the thing. He's going for a title this year - what's the point in driving so fast you crash (like La Messia* at Monza) and lose the chance of any points? While the points system is as it is, you aren't going to find drivers willing to risk a decent points haul for a decent points haul plus one. The days of Mansell sticking one right around the outside of Berger at Mexico right near the end of the race are long gone.

* - I'm going to use foreign languages now for Hamilton's Messiah status.

Jono8 · 27 Sep 2009 at 20:44

Hamilton is a much better driver than Button in my opinion.

mctiny · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:01

Jono8 said:
Hamilton is a much better driver than Button in my opinion.

I seriously think that Hamilton is way too overated, he got into F1 via lots of money from a proven team - who at thetime of him entering F1 had a great car.

SKILL · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:01

I can understand points racing to get the title, I dislike it as a spectator but I can understand it and it's a valid tactic, today was perfect for him in that respect, beat his only real title contender so it doesn't matter if he's 1 or 10 points ahead of him, as long as he is ahead.

To say again, his race today was a solid race, did what was needed and did make up for an atrocious qualifying, there was some luck involved but he did outrace his teammate.

But back to points racing, I make it 22 points in the last 7 races, and more to the point other than today he hasn't looked like he's specifically points racing, he's been looking like he's struggling.

If Barrichello/Vettel/Webber had been more solid over the past 7 race he'd be in trouble, as it is they weren't, and he's looking comfortable for the championship, although it's definately not over just yet...

Jono8 · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:03

mctiny said:
I seriously think that Hamilton is way too overated, he got into F1 via lots of money from a proven team - who at thetime of him entering F1 had a great car.

overrated maybe, better than Button, yes

el_dazza · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:06

I do think Hamilton's been moulded by McLaren very well, and I'd say he's probably one of the more talented drivers in the field. Of course you have to be supremely skilled to be an F1 driver but the kid's got such genuine pace it's crazy.

mctiny · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:12

Jono8 said:
overrated maybe, better than Button, yes

I don't think so, 3rd in 2004 in - let's be honest - not the best of cars. I think the teams and a few bad team choices have hindered Button over the years, but this year is just fairytale

JRS · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:14

SKILL said:
But back to points racing, I make it 22 points in the last 7 races, and more to the point other than today he hasn't looked like he's specifically points racing, he's been looking like he's struggling.

Alain Prost, in the final six races of the '93 season that he won quite easily in the end, just how many points did he get in those races? Can you guess?

Might it have been 22?

To borrow from a more recent example - 2006. Alonso won 6 of the first 9 races that year and finished 2nd in the ones he didn't win. Of the final 9, he won once. And this is a man who many rate as being a Schumacher-killer, one of the greats of modern GP racing, a man who could still get the business done if he had a decent car.

So why is Button ****, and Alonso great? Just because Button hasn't had a title-worthy car before now?

I hope he wins it, I really do. And I hope he can mount a defense to that title next year against the RBR boys, and a Hamilton that can fight from round 1 without having to lie to the stewards, and hopefully a Ferrari or two in the mix as well.

Jono8 · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:24

mctiny said:
I don't think so, 3rd in 2004 in - let's be honest - not the best of cars. I think the teams and a few bad team choices have hindered Button over the years, but this year is just fairytale

Nope, nothing will convince me that Button is better than Hamilton. Unless he goes on to win many consecutive championships ofcourse. Which, i think is far more likely for Hamilton.

The thing is, in Hamilton's first two seasons he actually had fierce competition in the form of a very good ferrari team (and BMW in 2008). Came second in 2007 and won 2008. Brawn had no realy competition for most of the first half of this season.

Duke · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:42

Had to post this pic below, great emotion as always from Hamilton

SKILL · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:45

JRS said:
Alain Prost, in the final six races of the '93 season that he won quite easily in the end, just how many points did he get in those races? Can you guess?

Might it have been 22?

To borrow from a more recent example - 2006. Alonso won 6 of the first 9 races that year and finished 2nd in the ones he didn't win. Of the final 9, he won once. And this is a man who many rate as being a Schumacher-killer, one of the greats of modern GP racing, a man who could still get the business done if he had a decent car.

So why is Button ****, and Alonso great? Just because Button hasn't had a title-worthy car before now?

I hope he wins it, I really do. And I hope he can mount a defense to that title next year against the RBR boys, and a Hamilton that can fight from round 1 without having to lie to the stewards, and hopefully a Ferrari or two in the mix as well.

'93 was before I got into F1, I was only 9

As for Alonso, he won 1 championship due to kimi's mclaren blowing up every other lap, and the other was due, as you mentioned, in a large part because for the first half of the season, then schumacher couldn't quite claw it back once he had the equipment.

Neither Alonso nor Button are ****, but I also don't think either driver is a great like Schumacher is/was, I can't be bothered to look at his championships but when he did win I seem to remember it being a dominant victory from start to finish of the season, not getting a lead and then going into 'mediocre mode' to cling on till the end...

As I said, if he wins, he will deserve it (like alonso deserved his), but I simply don't think he is good enough to be a true great and to win multiple/many times in the future. But I would be happy to see Barrichello win, because if he does he will have really fought for it, plus it's his last chance realistically and It'd be good to see him get one...

Like sunama I'm looking forward to next season, If the rumours are to be believed we'll see Hamilton Vs Raikkonen in the mclarens, Alonso Vs Massa and Button Vs Rosberg, and hopefully with each of them competing for wins, that'd be a good season

Flibster · 27 Sep 2009 at 21:49

Just seen a few pictures of the trophy. It's really a pretty cool one.
Certainly a hell of a lot better than the Santander logos that have been dished out several times this year. Not quite as good as the Australian one though.

NathanE · 27 Sep 2009 at 22:08

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=39149

Love this article

Ecclestone's close escape methinks...

Glaucus · 27 Sep 2009 at 22:11

NathanE said:
http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=39149

Love this article Ecclestone's close escape methinks...

Love it, left on the back of a fag packet.

FrankJH · 27 Sep 2009 at 22:23

SKILL said:
.....nor Button are ****, but I also don't think either driver is a great like Schumacher is/was, I can't be bothered to look at his championships but when he did win I seem to remember it being a dominant victory from start to finish of the season, not getting a lead and then going into 'mediocre mode' to cling on till the end...

Because Button doesnt cheat like Alonso (or as Martin called him "Teflonso" during quali) or Schumi?

(Martin "Why does Alonso get surrounded in scandels?" - Whitmarsh "(chuckle) ......because he likes to win)

So much **** that never sticks

Who ever wins the title, I just hope they get a decent car to defend it next season (unlike Hamilton and Hill)

Jono8 said:
The thing is, in Hamilton's first two seasons he actually had fierce competition in the form of a very good ferrari team (and BMW in 2008). Came second in 2007 and won 2008. Brawn had no realy competition for most of the first half of this season.

Red Bull / Vettel messed up big time in Aussie, giving away a good 6 points in both championships, and they made a few other mistakes as a team which has gone in Brawn's favour, but you cant really say they had no real competition

Jono8 · 27 Sep 2009 at 22:37

FrankJH said:
Because Button doesnt cheat like Alonso (or as Martin called him "Teflonso" during quali) or Schumi?

(Martin "Why does Alonso get surrounded in scandels?" - Whitmarsh "(chuckle) ......because he likes to win)

So much **** that never sticks

Who ever wins the title, I just hope they get a decent car to defend it next season (unlike Hamilton and Hill)

Red Bull / Vettel messed up big time in Aussie, giving away a good 6 points in both championships, and they made a few other mistakes as a team which has gone in Brawn's favour, but you cant really say they had no real competition

By the same note, you can't say that the Brawns had anywhere near the same competition that Ferrari gave mclaren in 2007 and 2008...

Emlyn_Dewar · 28 Sep 2009 at 00:18

People are saying that today was a good race? :confused:

I don't understand, maybe I tuned into the wrong one as the one I saw was a real let down.
Yay for night racing, boo for this track!

Glaucus · 28 Sep 2009 at 00:28

What are they goign to do with brakes next year. if they can not increase the disk size and with all that fuel weight for the entire race.

arknor · 28 Sep 2009 at 01:42

Thomas. PLease. said:
The safety car pitstop was a disadvantage for button. He had another four laps fuel had the s/c not come out he would have had even more of an advantage.

how many places did button gain in the safety car pitstops again?

four laps was an advantage? lol you dont seem to understand how safety car pitstops work and why people rush in for them