Mexican Grand Prix 2015, Mexico City - Race 17/19

[this_is_gav]

I reckon if we have a bike race around our village I'd be in with a shot. I'd even let them have a walk around the track to see the little details you can't see behind a visor, you know, like they do every weekend.

We even do that in the most basic club racing, looking at kerbs, bumps, barriers and run-offs and so on. Local knowledge might make a weeny bit of difference when it comes to a track with a proper micro-climate, like the Nordschleife or Knockhill perhaps (there's two extremes, but quite similar in that regard!), but not Monaco, a track that probably evolves quicker than any other F1 track.

 

[Skeeter]

WOOOSHIIII

Look at what I highlighted in your post

No I think he got it. It just wasn't funny or clever.

 

[JeditOjanen]

I don't think he's got the same rawness that made him so dangerous (in a positive sense) when he first arrived in F1, but he's in no way average.

I'm undecided as to whether he's a great... he's beat Rosberg in a dominant car and Massa, which is hardly the biggest challenge, but then Schumacher had some distinctly average team-mates in dominant cars and yet I do rate him as a great. I guess the difference is Schumacher beat some top drivers to his titles (Hakkinen, Raikkonen near his peak for a year I suppose) and I just don't feel Hamilton's done that yet.

In 2007 Hamilton as a rookie matched the defending double-champion Alonso on points, beat him on countback and would have taken the WDC without a dodgy pit decision from McLaren in China. If beating top drivers is your criterion for being a great, I don't see how you can exclude Hamilton from that.

 

[this_is_gav]

In 2007 Hamilton as a rookie matched the defending double-champion Alonso on points, beat him on countback and would have taken the WDC without a dodgy pit decision from McLaren in China. If beating top drivers is your criterion for being a great, I don't see how you can exclude Hamilton from that.

It's just opinion, chill.

I just think the raw Hamilton in 2007 was better than he has been since. Even 2008 he wasn't great and made some key mistakes - perhaps you could even argue the title was won because Hamilton hit the wall in Monaco, which by pure fluke won him the race.

Anyway, 2007 wasn't Alonso's finest hour on many levels, and is possibly the least reliable for comparing two team-mates. It turned from Hakkinen vs Coulthard love-child into all out war. It's a minor miracle that both drivers appeared to be on a level footing at season's end.

Like I say, my definition of great is going toe-to-toe with another top driver and winning the title, and Hamilton hasn't done that yet, not by a long way. It's one of the reasons Mansell isn't considered a great, despite three or four title challenges. If you went through history and brought up all the time a "great" was beaten by another driver away from the title itself, you'd have to rewrite half of F1 history.