I used to think that, but there's plenty of reasons they specifically choose to stay in the UK. So yeah, if they want to leave then so be it.
Mortgage Rate Rises
- Thread starter glenimp617
- Start date
I used to think that, but there's plenty of reasons they specifically choose to stay in the UK. So yeah, if they want to leave then so be it.
Soldato
I don’t think primary residence within reason should be included in any wealth calculation. It’s very realistic for someone to be house poor where that’s the only way for them to live in their area and to sting them with extra taxes they can’t afford. It would need to be adjusted per area or set at a rate so high such as £10m+ that it’s not going to hurt people trying to get by in London or other expensive areas.
Soldato
Maybe there should be but if the objective for Labour is to do something different and set out a longer term vision for fairer taxation, they aren't going to get anywhere by threatening things like that which will impact normal people.
Whereas surely nobody is going to mind redistribution from the top 1 or 2% (I wasn't saying it should be exactly the top 1%, it was just an example), and Labour should be working to establish the real facts and stop fear taking over for normal people that they would he taxed more.
The smartest thing they can do right now is as close to nothing as possible given the tories are dong a spiffing job of campaigning on their behalf.
Obviously the figures could be tweaked, but in a previous discussion about wealth tax I suggested exemption limits of £1M of assets if you don't own property, rising to £2M including your primary residence. That should allow for a non property owner who might be saving up for a house, retirement, emigration or whatever (and so is cash rich but property poor) or someone who may be cash poor but own a home that has significantly increased in value. Frankly if you own a house worth (say) £5M then I don't think it's reasonable to argue that you are too poor to pay a wealth tax, even if you don't have much money in the bank.
Soldato
Don't say that... Council tax was meant to be for this purpose along with paying for other local services.
In the US there's a tax just for this, and if it was applied in the uk, it would be applied to everyone.
Soldato
It might not be enough, when it comes to the crunch, on tax. People might vote Tory again if they are promising tax cuts, and without Labour committing to anything or any long term fairer tax plan.
Soldato
Sure, but that person would likely be in the top 1%. Isn't that my point, that the real top 1% isn't being properly communicated or targeted?
I was just addressing the point about exempting the primary residence. If that happened with no limits then it seems likely that rich people would move more of their money into property as an investment/to avoid the wealth tax and further inflate the market.
I’m not sure I buy that. There are only so many people that can afford to buy an £x,0,000,000 house and they all already have at least one so there isn’t going to be additional demand for them.
Even if there was, it would only be for those who can afford a ‘I’ve got more money than I know what to do with’ style house’, oh no what a shame….
Joe and Joanne who live in Essex in a £900k house are not ‘rich’ and they’ll certainly not be retiring any time soon on their wealth…
There is orders of magnitude between the top 10% and 5% and then again to 1% of wealthy people.
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I don't see why if you've worked hard and been successful in life, despite already paying exorbitant taxes in this country, you should be taxed AGAIN on your wealth.
High income tax on your earnings
More stamp duty when buying the house
Higher council tax
Might as well start taxing us for breathing air as well next.
High income tax on your earnings
More stamp duty when buying the house
Higher council tax
Might as well start taxing us for breathing air as well next.
Caporegime
Because fundamentally you reach a point where your wealth has no justification vs that of others. The majority of super wealthy are also there due to the lottery essentially. Good parents, good schooling, supportive parents, high IQ, good genetics. Hard work is just one component and just because you work hard doesn't mean you should be worth £1bn when someone else who works just as hard barely gets by.
The super wealthy are also not paying high rates of tax because they are exploiting every loop hole put in place by people like themselves to avoid it.
Wealth also gives you the easy ability to grow wealth with the opportunities it offers.
We have created a two tier society where a shockingly large proportion of the country are looking at a life of endless work, uncertainty and misery despite having reasonable jobs while others live in unimaginable luxury. Thats not a healthy society.
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Soldato
Yeah sorry for sidetracking into wealth taxation. Its the only way that realistically I see it working but it needs to be very carefully implemented, and over a decent period.
In my version there would be exemptions but they would not be simply primary residence.
They would also align with a reduction in income taxes. (Bolded because IMO its a realignment of the tax system designed for the rich to pay less historically hence why income is taxed far higher than capital gains, over a period of say 20 years minimum where its not primarily income for many people)
So broadly low income low asset people would pay less tax
lowish income and lowish assets would pay less bot not a lot less
Well paid but low assets and low paid but high assets somewhere similar to now
High paid and high assets a decent chunk more
I would allow a long term charging order for anyone cash (income) poor but asset rich. Your stereotypical old lady in a family mansion living on state pension. Oft quoted but probably only a handfull in the country in reality.
So they can avoid their taxes for now, but not long term.
I don't think targetting the 1% specifically would work. They are the most internationally mobile. IMO the old labour who would have done that would just see the revenue vanish.
Its part of the reason for not excluding primary residence IMO.
Anyway back to mortgages
In my version there would be exemptions but they would not be simply primary residence.
They would also align with a reduction in income taxes. (Bolded because IMO its a realignment of the tax system designed for the rich to pay less historically hence why income is taxed far higher than capital gains, over a period of say 20 years minimum where its not primarily income for many people)
So broadly low income low asset people would pay less tax
lowish income and lowish assets would pay less bot not a lot less
Well paid but low assets and low paid but high assets somewhere similar to now
High paid and high assets a decent chunk more
I would allow a long term charging order for anyone cash (income) poor but asset rich. Your stereotypical old lady in a family mansion living on state pension. Oft quoted but probably only a handfull in the country in reality.
So they can avoid their taxes for now, but not long term.
I don't think targetting the 1% specifically would work. They are the most internationally mobile. IMO the old labour who would have done that would just see the revenue vanish.
Its part of the reason for not excluding primary residence IMO.
Anyway back to mortgages
I did suggest an exemption of £1M if you don't own property rising to £2M including your primary residence.
Because people are jealously of their wealth. They need to get over it.
Not everyone in the world can be rich.
Associate
How much money do people really need though? I'm not quite in the camp of imposing ridiculous taxes on rich people - but it gets to a point where if you can solve 95% of your problems by throwing money at it then you've probably got enough cash.
Soldato
Are you in top 1%? If not, and tax policy was to put more load on top 1% and take off some load from everyone else, would you not support this and why?
