Motorsport Off Topic Thread

Stumble Bum said:
Scam doesn't let facts get in the way of his agenda!
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If Ferrari thought it unclear during the race then it is still unclear. You can still blame the FIA for not clearly enforcing rules like that. I didn’t see any other teams protest, or get caught doing the same thing as the two RB drivers.
 
Scam said:
If Ferrari thought it unclear during the race then it is still unclear. You can still blame the FIA for not clearly enforcing rules like that. I didn’t see any other teams protest, or get caught doing the same thing as the two RB drivers.
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Sure it seems like they needed to clarify it, but quite clearly your own link states several times that these rules were already in place since the start of the season. There is no FIA bending the rules just for RB like you seem to claim.
 
Scam said:
If Ferrari thought it unclear during the race then it is still unclear. You can still blame the FIA for not clearly enforcing rules like that. I didn’t see any other teams protest, or get caught doing the same thing as the two RB drivers.
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The Race Director's notes were wrong, that shouldn't have happened, but clarifying to correct the mistake isn't bending the rules for RB. Honestly, I'm not sure why the Race Director's notes didn't take precedence in Monaco though?
 
Judging from comments on the articles about this it seems most people on the inside are thoroughly confused as they why it has changed at all. In all other formulas it has (apparently) always been touching the line at all, never crossing it. Meh.
 
It always used to be touching the line in F1 too. I called a penalty for Verstappen straight away as I wasn't aware it had changed.

I guess it's to bring it in line with the track limits (all of the wheel over all of the line).

All FIA-sanctioned events follow the same sporting code as F1, so many will be the same as F1 now. Not that pit-stops happen in most other FIA formulae.
 
It makes more sense to be as soon as the tyre touches the line. Enforcing it now from an arbitrary part of the car crossing the line is just muddying the water. What if the whole tyre crosses the inner demarcation of the line; is that allowed or is it that the tyre has to cross the line entirely and contact the tarmac on the other side? Also, a tyre is wider than the line, so a car could be legally riding the line on pit exit and bang wheels with another car which is using also legally the full track extremities. The old rule meant they would always be a lines width apart. More needless rule making for no benefit of The Show.

this_is_gav said:
All FIA-sanctioned events follow the same sporting code as F1, so many will be the same as F1 now. Not that pit-stops happen in most other FIA formulae.
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That makes even less sense - how do they know if a tyre goes across the line in a closed-wheel car?
 
Lots of rumours now that Piastri will go to Williams for '23 and '24, along with a switch to Renault engines for Williams. Given the range of sources, I think it's probably about 80% certain. Latifi will lose his seat. There are also rumours that Latifi will be removed mid-season but I think those are less likely.
 
Mr Jack said:
Lots of rumours now that Piastri will go to Williams for '23 and '24, along with a switch to Renault engines for Williams. Given the range of sources, I think it's probably about 80% certain. Latifi will lose his seat. There are also rumours that Latifi will be removed mid-season but I think those are less likely.
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Didn't Williams sign a contract with Mercedes until 2025 for engines?
 
Mr Jack said:
Yes, they did. But these contracts often seem to be not all that fixed.
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I can't imagine Mercedes fighting too hard to enforce a contract with Williams. A) Merc are already whining about how the price cap means they can't make money selling engines and B) they're not exactly getting much in the way of positive exposure having their engines stabbed in the back of the backmarker team.
 
JRS said:
I can't imagine Mercedes fighting too hard to enforce a contract with Williams. A) Merc are already whining about how the price cap means they can't make money selling engines and B) they're not exactly getting much in the way of positive exposure having their engines stabbed in the back of the backmarker team.
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Cost of Engines for customer teams isn't included in the cap AFAIK? Might be wrong though.
 

FIA intervenes to reduce F1 porpoising on safety grounds​

The FIA has responded to the request from Formula 1 drivers to tackle the porpoising issue on the grounds of safety, announcing a new technical directive ahead of the Canadian Grand Prix​

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The FIA has reacted by issuing a technical directive to teams that references both short and long term measures.

However, it's understood that there will be no impact on how teams run their cars in Montreal this weekend, when the FIA's focus will observation and data gathering.

In a statement, the FIA said: "Following the eighth round of this year's FIA Formula One World Championship, during which the phenomenon of aerodynamic oscillations ("porpoising") of the new generation of F1 cars, and the effect of this during and after the race on the physical condition of the drivers was once again visible, the FIA, as the governing body of the sport, has decided that, in the interests of the safety, it is necessary to intervene to require that the teams make the necessary adjustments to reduce or to eliminate this phenomenon."


Full Article Link


Sounds like the FIA will not stipulate what changes need to be made, just that the changes must reduce porpoiseing/bouncing /bottoming out, to levels that will not fail the new criteria being introduced.

The simplest easiest way to do that, is increase ride height, so basically, this is an FIA mandated increase in ride height, for all teams most affected by the phenomena.

If the team can meet the criteria, without increasing ride height, they will obviously be at a performance advantage over the others.

So to me this is a rather unfair way of doing things.
 
Entai said:
The FIA has reacted by issuing a technical directive to teams that references both short and long term measures.

However, it's understood that there will be no impact on how teams run their cars in Montreal this weekend, when the FIA's focus will observation and data gathering.

In a statement, the FIA said: "Following the eighth round of this year's FIA Formula One World Championship, during which the phenomenon of aerodynamic oscillations ("porpoising") of the new generation of F1 cars, and the effect of this during and after the race on the physical condition of the drivers was once again visible, the FIA, as the governing body of the sport, has decided that, in the interests of the safety, it is necessary to intervene to require that the teams make the necessary adjustments to reduce or to eliminate this phenomenon."


Full Article Link


Sounds like the FIA will not stipulate what changes need to be made, just that the changes must reduce porpoiseing/bouncing /bottoming out, to levels that will not fail the new criteria being introduced.

The simplest easiest way to do that, is increase ride height, so basically, this is an FIA mandated increase in ride height, for all teams most affected by the phenomena.

If the team can meet the criteria, without increasing ride height, they will obviously be at a performance advantage over the others.

So to me this is a rather unfair way of doing things.
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Safety is the only way the FIA can introduce mid season changes without the full agreement of all the teams. As it’s clear that Red Bull and a few others that aren’t having too many issues won’t agree the FIA had to step in. And rightly so. Teams have shown many times they’ll sacrifice whatever they can for performance, including removing on board drinks bottles, restricting driver weight and certainly in the past reducing driver safety, the FIA had no choice. Sure it impacts some teams worse than others but it had to be done.
 
MissChief said:
Safety is the only way the FIA can introduce mid season changes without the full agreement of all the teams. As it’s clear that Red Bull and a few others that aren’t having too many issues won’t agree the FIA had to step in. And rightly so. Teams have shown many times they’ll sacrifice whatever they can for performance, including removing on board drinks bottles, restricting driver weight and certainly in the past reducing driver safety, the FIA had no choice. Sure it impacts some teams worse than others but it had to be done.
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These changes will have the full agreement of all teams.
It is the teams agreeing how to calculate what is acceptable vertical movement and what is not.
The teams are managing this themselves, the FIA are not stipulating any specific changes, it is up to the teams to sort it all out.
There will be a full meeting of all teams to agree the way forward for the mid to long term, this technical directive is only short term, but does not come into force after Canada.
 
Entai said:
These changes will have the full agreement of all teams.
It is the teams agreeing how to calculate what is acceptable vertical movement and what is not.
The teams are managing this themselves, the FIA are not stipulating any specific changes, it is up to the teams to sort it all out.
There will be a full meeting of all teams to agree the way forward for the mid to long term, this technical directive is only short term, but does not come into force after Canada.
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That's an interesting perspective,
 
Slam62 said:
That's an interesting perspective,
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Read the article, that is exactly what is happening.

The only thing the FIA are doing is checkinv planks amd skids blocks for excess wear more often, and the FIA will, once the teams agree what is acceotable vertical movement parameters, be checking that teams abide by that.

The FIA have not told the teams to do A, B or C, they have just said they will monitor the situation.

The drivers have complained , the FIA have said it is teams that must sort it.
 
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