Doesn't that just take everything out of the trail unless you are doing some borderline downhill stuff? 170/170 is huge.
Mountain Biking
- Thread starter Zefan
- Start date
Doesn't that just take everything out of the trail unless you are doing some borderline downhill stuff? 170/170 is huge.
I bought an ebike because it's all I could get hold of as I wanted to max out the C2W and get something fairly capable spec wise. Originally I wanted the new Stumpy, Orange five, Bird Aeirs - but no stock anywhere. Alas Giant had a eTrance coming "in the next six months" so I ordered it.
I am pleasantly surprised by it, the Yamaha motor requires cadence to work so I'm still hitting 160-170HR up climbs I'm just going much quicker. It's a workout but more of a spin class as as long as you spin fast enough the motor will provide the torque. It does lacks the sense of achievement of a non-ebike, but for an all day epic it can't be beaten.
Oh and I don't have to use the van at BPW, can get 8 runs in, maybe 9 if I'm feeling lucky and I'm usually dead by that point as the "ebike optimized fork" is anything but
I am pleasantly surprised by it, the Yamaha motor requires cadence to work so I'm still hitting 160-170HR up climbs I'm just going much quicker. It's a workout but more of a spin class as as long as you spin fast enough the motor will provide the torque. It does lacks the sense of achievement of a non-ebike, but for an all day epic it can't be beaten.
Oh and I don't have to use the van at BPW, can get 8 runs in, maybe 9 if I'm feeling lucky and I'm usually dead by that point as the "ebike optimized fork" is anything but
Your just riding the wrong stuff for one of those bikes. If your riding trail centres (I. E xc loops) do you even want an ebike? Loads of lads riding my local spots are on ebikes (including the likes of matt walker, Joe Smith, 50:01 lads etc) but it is a proper hill. I'd absolutely love one and would go for a big enduro style if I did too, because of what would suit my local riding/stuff that I seek out to ride.
Considering the amount of lads who I know in them who can properly properly shift, and claim they're the best things in the world.
I'd claim they ars definitely catered towards mtbers, just your experience of them hasn't showed this.
The UK has some of the steepest, gnarliest riding available. Just not as concentrated as the likes of France, BC etc. But there is plenty of it!
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But most people aren’t riding that. I ride all over, XC loops, bike parks, trail centres, natural trails. The vast majority of people are nowhere near good enough to need a monster travel eBike to ride what they are tackling and yet that’s what most people are on.
I reckon in my experience 1/10 eBikers are riding more than red level trails on their bikes. There are plenty of absolute beasts on them too but they are in the minority. Each to their own but I think eBikes should be going more towards the Orbea Rise side of things. Instead they seem to be going full enduro despite the tiny percentage of people doing enduro in the uk as a percentage of the whole.
Everytime I go to cannock chase (to ride the off piste mainly) most people are on Mega Towers or equivalent 170mm monsters. People always over bike themselves, this isn't a fault of the bike or the bike company it's just that people love to think they are better/ride gnalier stuff than what they actually do. A lot of people think that Cannock chase (or equivalent XC trail centre) requires a 170mm enduro bike, because they don't ride anything else and beleive the black sections to be 'gnar'. It's also a difficult one, because I'd want a smaller bike for the stuff like that if it was my local stuff but then I'd always want a bigger bike for Revs/Dyfi/trips to Scotland etc. Bike companies will just offer what the demand is.
Off to do a few rides in the lakes next weekend (Helvellyn, Borrowdale, Whinlater BP) and have been given my mates Orbea Rise M10 for the weekend to try out. Certainly going to be different than my current Orbea Rallon, but want to see if a lightweight ebike is for me. He reckons it pedals completely differently to full fat ebikes (other mates ride YT, Merida, Specialized etc) as he reckons you need to put more effort into pedaling. Had Covid last year and been left with a permanent cough and gone from always being the last one up the hill but not by much to all my mates having to wait 10 minutes for me to catch up, then 10 minutes for me to get my breath back, hasn't helped with probably only doing half the riding i would usually have done.
Will have to give a report back on how it goes!
Will have to give a report back on how it goes!
I agree to some extent but bike manufacturers and the MTB media are very much to blame for this. Part of it is the influx of cash rich, knowledge poor people that have started biking since lockdown as well but companies are always trying to push something different. Not new, just different. Gravel bikes, Downcountry bikes, enduro bikes etc.
A few years ago anyone on a 170mm/170mm bike was either riding downhill or was almost guaranteed to be a very serious mountain biker because anyone with an ounce of knowledge knew that having too much travel was A) awful for pedalling uphill, although suspension has got a lot better in that respect. B) That it took all the fun out of anything that wasn't steep and fast and gnarly.
eBikes have basically solved the first point there but the second is still prevalent. Thats why people have 2-3 bikes. If a 170mm beast was good on all terrain thats all they would have. The only place I go to where I feel seriously underbiked is BPW and the like. Even then I know that my 140/120 trail bike is plenty capable of riding harder trails, I am the weak link.
Unless your riding the massive black jump lines at BPW, a trail bike is pretty much perfect for there.
Though there is plenty of information and demo rides available everywhere (out of covid, ovbiously). Any bike is fun though, regardless of what and where you ride - I've ridden some trail centre stuff on my 'enduro/AM' bike and never thought that I neeeded to spend another £4k to get a trail bike also. Yes most people might be on the wrong bike for what they usually ride, but the sport is growing and people want to ride like the equivlant EWS/DH pro they see on a youtube edit. The issue is people can't see past a trail centre and sadly the UK govt/land owners aren't willing to imrpove most of this and give us proper places to ride bikes - if this had to open up more then people would probably get better use out of their bigger bikes. My local spot isn't legally meant to be ridden, infact there isn't many gnarly places in the UK that are authorised to be ridden on - outside some of the bike parks dyfi/revs/fortbill etc.
I get horribly jealous of all the people in the US and Canada with their trails in the mountains. They are utterly stunning and completely free, they just have a strong culture around MTB in the area and lots of people help with trail building. I love natural trails through the woods but like you say, there aren't enough in the UK.
No, it's a shame really as we have stunning trails but due to how land ownership works we have to keep it all a secret/not advertise them. Scotland has changed drastically in this regard and now has an incredible set of trail networks up and down the country. England/Wales need to catch up and promote a better lifestyle for the majority.
I've not seen anything in the UK that compares to the US/CA. You got any videos of these trail networks in Scotland? Honestly haven't seen them.
Soldato
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Remember there's more to mtb than trail centres or purpose built "natural" mtb trails (cheeky or sanctioned).
Even in the south of the UK there's plenty of gnar on bridleways and legal paths if you know where to look, and are prepared to climb for it. It may not be singletrack, but picking your line through massive football sized rocks while the bike is pinging left right and every direction under you at speed is massive fun.
Even in the south of the UK there's plenty of gnar on bridleways and legal paths if you know where to look, and are prepared to climb for it. It may not be singletrack, but picking your line through massive football sized rocks while the bike is pinging left right and every direction under you at speed is massive fun.
Golfie (just look at trail forks here, unreal - https://www.trailforks.com/region/caberston/. Theres places like the Mast (inverness), Dunkield, Pitlochry (cathros trails), Laggan (not the trail centre) etc. The golfie is so good, it gets used for EWS (as does some of the glentress off piste stuff). And of course, it's legal to ride on walking trails etc. Even just zooming out on Trail Forks the amount of trails in comparassion to the amount of people is quite crazy in scotland in comparisonto England and a big chunk of the English ones are unsanctioned.
A lot of these places started as folk building in the woods to now the FLS collabarting with other organisations and allowing a lot of this building work. Ben Cathro done a good video on it recently.
Only going to get better too, with the goverment actually putting some good money in. Inners/Golfie is getting close to £15million soon, so that trail network is going to implode soon and a ton of jobs created. Scotlands future for legal mountain biking hasn't looked so good. I might even move back! ha.
I might move to Scotland haha, but ta for the trailforks shout out, didn't know about that. Have seen a few more local trails i can go check out.
True, I need to get out and explore more. Should have a car come Friday so will be able to access stuff that isn't within cyclable distance!
Trail forks segment explorer is good too, if you also combine it with the heatmap. As is going to a hill and just looking, I've found some right gold doing this.
Soldato
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- 10 Oct 2006
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Golfie is great got shown it a few years ago by a local I met when doing Innerleithen. The downside now is it’s pretty busy
The upside thoug is the international business due to the popularity and 19 million thrown into the area/sport.
Coincidental article regarding short travel v long travel bikes that popped up today. Even more of a coincidence that the author is talking about UK trails.
https://m.pinkbike.com/news/the-case-for-being-over-biked-opinion.html
https://m.pinkbike.com/news/the-case-for-being-over-biked-opinion.html
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Is the coincidence that you secretly write for pinkbike
I think we are still arguing different points. You're arguing for the point of view of "people are good on bikes and riding gnarly terrain" and I'm arguing from the point of view that "the vast majority of people on trails in the UK are not good and 170mm of travel isn't even remotely necessary for what they are riding". I'm watching the guys on massive enduro bikes that are being overtaken by hardtail riders on 20 year old bikes on the downhills. I obviously see the guys who are really good on those bikes as well but they are heavily outnumbered (certainly from where I ride) by the beginners.
If I was in the former category I would 100% have an enduro style bike or at least something with 150mm travel but I'm not. I do the occasional bike park trip, trips to surrey hills, some other trails centres and some moderate jumps at my local jump park. More suspension than I have would make 90% of my rides less fun and 10% more fun. If I ever win the lottery I will get myself an Orbea Rise and join the dark side of more suspension and eBikes however.
Is the coincidence that you secretly write for pinkbike
I think we are still arguing different points. You're arguing for the point of view of "people are good on bikes and riding gnarly terrain" and I'm arguing from the point of view that "the vast majority of people on trails in the UK are not good and 170mm of travel isn't even remotely necessary for what they are riding". I'm watching the guys on massive enduro bikes that are being overtaken by hardtail riders on 20 year old bikes on the downhills. I obviously see the guys who are really good on those bikes as well but they are heavily outnumbered (certainly from where I ride) by the beginners.
If I was in the former category I would 100% have an enduro style bike or at least something with 150mm travel but I'm not. I do the occasional bike park trip, trips to surrey hills, some other trails centres and some moderate jumps at my local jump park. More suspension than I have would make 90% of my rides less fun and 10% more fun. If I ever win the lottery I will get myself an Orbea Rise and join the dark side of more suspension and eBikes however.
Yeah that's hugely true, my local spot is hard to ride unless your prepared to ride some decent trails so seeing this isn't very common and it's a lot quieter. I very rarely visit a trail centre, where as you say - see this more often.
I wish I could construct a sentence well enough to be able to write for any media!
More importantly, I'll have a 170mm ebike within the next three years