Soldato
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They weren't fighting for their country, they were fighting for a militant ideology based on the opposition of communism taking place in countries over the other side of the world.
Muhammad Ali put on life support as family warned ‘the end is near - **edit Ali has now passed away*
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They weren't fighting for their country, they were fighting for a militant ideology based on the opposition of communism taking place in countries over the other side of the world.
He was with the Nation of Islam then thats why he said those things. Malcolm X pointed him to the true version of Islam which doesn't discriminate against colours of peoples skin.
Read the book 'The Soul Of A Butterfly' and you'll get to know what Ali was really all about.
Man of Honour
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He still went with 1000s of others, just because he was cap and protested later doesn't alter what he selflessly did along with others.
He was given a choice between prison and the army, because he was a bit of a scallywag. Was nothing selfless about it.
And for a lot of people, particularly poor people, the Army isn't a moral decision: it's a financial one. i.e. it's a job, with bed and board.
Did your grandad advocate killing everyone who had a relationship in which one person was "black" and the other wasn't?
Did your your great grandad advocate killing everyone who had a relationship in which one person was Japanese and the other person wasn't?
Did either of them advocate killing everyone who had a relationship in which one person followed the "right" religion and the other didn't?
Irrational prejudices are common and the reasons for them can be understandable (though not justified), but there are degrees. Also, your grandad and great grandad aren't being lauded across the world as saintly figures of pure goodness.
I disagree on that point. He refused to go on a matter of principle and accepted being jailed as the cost of standing by his principles. That shows an admirable integrity. He didn't see it as fighting for his country. He saw it as fighting some people he had no quarrel with.
Of course, his racism was a large part of that. He'd probably have gone if he saw the north Vietnamese as being "whites".
I seem to be missing the point you're trying to make now. However, if you want to discuss whether you thought Ali was a decent person or not then I suspect this is not the thread for that.
Soldato
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Don't think it's been mentioned, but personally I think boxing is a horrific 'sport', up there with bull fighting, cage fighting, **** fighting or whatever ridiculous past times are still clinging onto the 21st century.
I know I'm way out viewed on that based on the audiences that boxing draws but meh.
Along with his radical views which have been been pointed out in this thread it seems more of a life to learn and advance from than respect and look up to.
I know I'm way out viewed on that based on the audiences that boxing draws but meh.
Along with his radical views which have been been pointed out in this thread it seems more of a life to learn and advance from than respect and look up to.
Im very disappointed in some people on here.
I think it's a huge disrespect to muhammad ali (legend) to call him Cassius Clay
When the man spent most of his life trying to get rid of a slave name which he did not like and be known as muhammad ali by the world and to be known as a muslim even when times were hard.
I think it's a huge disrespect to muhammad ali (legend) to call him Cassius Clay
When the man spent most of his life trying to get rid of a slave name which he did not like and be known as muhammad ali by the world and to be known as a muslim even when times were hard.
Man of Honour
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I think it was a huge disrespect by him to change his name and then be so outspoken about whites & mixed marriages etc.
He could have changed his name to Obowatu Mandobe and still made a point.
Yeah but he is black and in today's society you're given more leeway to say racist things as long as you're not white. Same with pretty much most *isms, if you're in the group that is supposedly in a position of 'power' then you're fair game. So golf clubs that only allow men to join = disgusting sexist institutions, special area at Glastonbury festival for people who identify as women = 'progressive', a 'safe space' etc..
He's also a celebrity which allows a lot more leeway, you can beat your wife, be a kiddy fiddler and be (the right sort of) 'racist' or homophobe and people will be prepared to ignore your behaviour.
In fact I'm surprised your post is still allowed as RIP threads don't usually allow for discussion like this. For example mentioning that Bowie enjoyed sex with underage girls prompted deletions. I guess we're allowed to mention that Ali was rather misguided and had some dodgy racial views. He did seem like a nice person, in a weird sort of way, in spite of those views.
Who did he disrespect by changing his name ?
outspoken, he was the same as most other people at the time the only difference was he was a famous black person.
Man of Honour
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All the white people who helped him to get to his celebrity status for starters.
Soldato
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Indeed very disrespectful to insult the man in a thread paying respect to him after passing away, by referring to him by his slave name. Something he detested, but hey ho guess some white people in this thread cant let go.
Soldato
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Rest in Power
Muhammad Ali
Muhammad Ali