New Comp

Monstermunch · 22 May 2006 at 19:18

AMD Athlon 64 3700 - IMO buying now and not getting Dual Core is silly

Asus A8N32-SL Deluxe - Good chipset but buggy, lots of people have had problems with the bios etc

2GB Corsair XMS - The Mushkin Blue HP3200 has tighter timings and is the same price!

BFG GeForce 7900 GTX 512MB - The X1900XT would walk all over this card and it's cheaper!

Akasa 80mm fan - Good fans

FSP Sparkle FX600 - Good PSU but OTT in my op, The Enermax Liberty 500W is plenty powerful enough and it's modular!

Lian Li PC-7 PLUS - Excellent case!

Western Digital Caviar 160GB (Storage) - Nothing wrong with WD's, but the Hitachi drives are better!

Western Digital Raptor 74GB (OS) - Complete and total waste of money....2 x Hitachi Deskstar's in Raid0 are faster, cheaper and quieter.

Saitek Eclipse illuminated Keyboard - Good KB

Logitech MX518 Mouse - Good Mouse

Monstermunch · 22 May 2006 at 19:21

semi-pro waster said:
//edit just to play devil's advocate to Monstermunch for a second there isn't much price difference between the 7900gtx and the X1900XTX last time I looked and while the X1900XTX is the more powerful card (maybe not hugely though) it does use more power and is louder. Actually just rechecked and the OcUK 7900GTX 512mb is cheaper than the cheapest X1900XTX, albeit by ~£10 but still

The X1900XT is faster and better than the 7900GT and the XTX version walks all over it! Why buy a 7900gt when they're slower have poorer image quality and can't do AA & HDR at the same time!

But yes they do use marginally more power and if you buy a cheap make they can be louder. The HIS excalibur version is normally the best at stock!

theFSB · 22 May 2006 at 19:45

the X1900XT-X is the best card in the world, the 7900GT is quite a way off tbqfh

semi-pro waster · 22 May 2006 at 19:50

Monstermunch said:
The X1900XT is faster and better than the 7900GT and the XTX version walks all over it! Why buy a 7900gt when they're slower have poorer image quality and can't do AA & HDR at the same time!

But yes they do use marginally more power and if you buy a cheap make they can be louder. The HIS excalibur version is normally the best at stock!

In fairness you aren't comparing like for like here, a 7900GTX should go up against an X1900XTX. A 7900GT sits against an X1800XT and is comparable in price and performance. I'm not saying that Mippie should necessarily go for a 7900GTX over an X1900XTX (or at least I wasn't initially) but they can be marginally cheaper depending on the brand, can be quieter and perform pretty much on a par. I am also somewhat sceptical about the image quality argument although I obviously cannot disagree about the inability to do AA and HDR which is a bit of a dumb omission for Nvidia to make.

We could probably trade links for quite some time to attempt to prove which card is better but in all honesty either card is going to be a great performer and what one wins in one game will be lost in another and so on

Monstermunch · 23 May 2006 at 00:21

semi-pro waster said:
In fairness you aren't comparing like for like here, a 7900GTX should go up against an X1900XTX. A 7900GT sits against an X1800XT and is comparable in price and performance. I'm not saying that Mippie should necessarily go for a 7900GTX over an X1900XTX (or at least I wasn't initially) but they can be marginally cheaper depending on the brand, can be quieter and perform pretty much on a par. I am also somewhat sceptical about the image quality argument although I obviously cannot disagree about the inability to do AA and HDR which is a bit of a dumb omission for Nvidia to make.

We could probably trade links for quite some time to attempt to prove which card is better but in all honesty either card is going to be a great performer and what one wins in one game will be lost in another and so on

I agree that both cards are great cards and I would gladly own either. However your comparison isn't entirely accurate......

7900gt(256mb) @ £188 vs x1800xt(256mb) @ £199 - Roughly Equal, except the AA & HDR and nVidia £11 cheaper.

7900gt(512mb) @ £270 vs x1800xt(512mb) @ £235 - Roughly Equal, except AA & HDR....Plus the ATI is £35 cheaper!

7900gtx(512mb) @ £305 vs x1900xt(512mb) @ £276 - Roughly Equal, except AA & HDR....Plus the ATI is £29 cheaper!

x1900xtx(512mb) @ £311 - Only £6 more than the 7900gtx and faster than all of the above!

Monstermunch · 23 May 2006 at 16:35

Edit: ooops!

Mippie · 23 May 2006 at 18:14

okay, so now im thinking of this spec:

HIS Excaliber ATI Radeon X1900XT-X
Lian Li PC7+
NEC 16x16 DVD+RW
Mushkin 2GB DDR XP4000 (CAS3)
Saitek illuminated keyboard
logitech optical gaming mouse
Hitachi Deskstar 160GB
Akasa 80mm fan
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4400+
Not about mobo but these are the two- DFI Lanparty UT NF4 SLI-D or DFI Lanparty UT NF4 Ultra-D- which is the better?

This current setup is based around S939, however i have noticed that AM2 has now been released....guess what the question is lol. Is it worth gettin a S939 or should i wait and invest in AM2?

Monstermunch · 23 May 2006 at 18:29

Mippie said:
okay, so now im thinking of this spec:

HIS Excaliber ATI Radeon X1900XT-X
Lian Li PC7+
NEC 16x16 DVD+RW
Mushkin 2GB DDR XP4000 (CAS3)
Saitek illuminated keyboard
logitech optical gaming mouse
Hitachi Deskstar 160GB
Akasa 80mm fan
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4400+
Not about mobo but these are the two- DFI Lanparty UT NF4 SLI-D or DFI Lanparty UT NF4 Ultra-D- which is the better?

This current setup is based around S939, however i have noticed that AM2 has now been released....guess what the question is lol. Is it worth gettin a S939 or should i wait and invest in AM2?

Good spec.....Personally I think the SLI-D is a waste of money and no better performance wise than the Ultra-D....The only difference being the SLI has 2 PCI-E slots for dual nVidia cards....Which you won't need.

Any particular reason for wanting PC4000 ram instead of PC3200?

NightmareXX · 23 May 2006 at 18:46

If your gonna get an ATI card either:
A) Don't bother getting an SLI mobo
B) Get a crossfire mobo. I've got the Asus A8R-MVP and tis wonderful

If you go via the crossfire route, get a decent PSU as well. I'd recommend the 700W FSP Epsilon as its more then powerful enough for anything you want. It isn't modular, but the cables are sheathed so it doesn't look messy.

LadFromWales · 23 May 2006 at 18:46

Are the XT-X's suddenly a better buy than the XT?

Last I checked, the clocks only differed by 25mhz/50mhz DDR, and achieved similar overclocks. Apparently XT's meet XT-X overclocks when flashed with an XT-X bios too

Mippie · 23 May 2006 at 19:41

okay, so if i am going to be using a ATI card then go for a crossfire mobo or a single slot mobo. Has anybody got any views on the new AM2 socket processors, mobos and ram. is it worth buying S939 over the AM2 or should i just take the plunge?

Monstermunch · 23 May 2006 at 23:20

NightmareXX said:
If you go via the crossfire route, get a decent PSU as well. I'd recommend the 700W FSP Epsilon as its more then powerful enough for anything you want. It isn't modular, but the cables are sheathed so it doesn't look messy.

Why people keep speccing 600 & 700w PSU's is beyond me......450w is normally more than enough but for peace of mind 500w will run everything that you would possibly need.......Short of filling the case with gay cathodes and fans!

Monstermunch · 23 May 2006 at 23:24

Mippie said:
okay, so if i am going to be using a ATI card then go for a crossfire mobo or a single slot mobo. Has anybody got any views on the new AM2 socket processors, mobos and ram. is it worth buying S939 over the AM2 or should i just take the plunge?

Crossfire boards are very good but can be bug ridden with bios problems, ram speeds etc. If you only plan on having 1 gfx card then personally the DFI Ulta-D is the best on the market...bar none!

As far as AM2 goes, from what i've read the current chips are just skt 939's with DDR2 support, but there's all kind of talk about next batch having extra instructions etc.....and don't forget that with every new chipset there WILL be big teething problems with motherboard bios etc. Personally I would avoid until September at least!

semi-pro waster · 24 May 2006 at 00:47

Monstermunch said:
As far as AM2 goes, from what i've read the current chips are just skt 939's with DDR2 support, but there's all kind of talk about next batch having extra instructions etc.....and don't forget that with every new chipset there WILL be big teething problems with motherboard bios etc. Personally I would avoid until September at least!

I'm not willing to argue too much on the graphics card front because as I said we can throw about benchmark results for ages and I don't care that much

but here I will certainly agree with you, the current crop of AM2s are not that far removed from socket 939 chips. The FX62 or equivalent can be reached on socket 939 already so it isn't much more than a socket 939 chip tarted up and ported over(on the bright side that should mean the chip iteself is tried and tested albeit the motherboards aren't), however in the future AM2 may start to reveal advantages but in the meantime I'd say it isn't quite worth it.

NightmareXX · 24 May 2006 at 00:50

Monstermunch said:
Why people keep speccing 600 & 700w PSU's is beyond me......450w is normally more than enough but for peace of mind 500w will run everything that you would possibly need.......Short of filling the case with gay cathodes and fans!

Last time I checked (I assumed we were talking about 2*X1900) running crossfire need one hell of a lot of power. According to that PSU calculator thing that everyone keeps mentioning, even with other stuff turned off like HDD's and CD drives, it still needs about 550W minimum with dual core.

I aint saying your wrong coz you probably know more then I do, I'm just going by what I know. And anyway, if you've got the money, why not go all the way?

Edit: BTW semi-pro waster, loving your overlord guide

Made me laugh.

semi-pro waster · 24 May 2006 at 00:58

NightmareXX said:
Edit: BTW semi-pro waster, loving your overlord guide Made me laugh.

Cheers, it isn't mine but I think some of the suggestions in the dungeons are even better

If going Crossfire or SLi I'd agree that at least 550w is a good starting point. It might not strictly be necessary and I'd say Monstermunch is right in his assertion that people will continue to overspecify but it doesn't do any harm especially as PSUs get less efficient over time. I'm running a reasonably demanding system on a 400w PSU(A64 3400, 1gb Ram, 6800gt and 3 hard drives) but it is probably quite close to the limit.

Mikey1280 · 24 May 2006 at 08:05

I remember people in one of the threads with x1900s in crossfire saying that 580w wasnt enough, they are incredibly power hungry.

hp7909 · 24 May 2006 at 08:36

Monstermunch said:
Why people keep speccing 600 & 700w PSU's is beyond me......450w is normally more than enough but for peace of mind 500w will run everything that you would possibly need.......Short of filling the case with gay cathodes and fans!

ATI themselves, on the Crossfire website, do not even recommend a PSU thats less than 550W for X1900's!

Monstermunch · 24 May 2006 at 13:51

hp7909 said:
ATI themselves, on the Crossfire website, do not even recommend a PSU thats less than 550W for X1900's!

Yes....I know, i've even contacted ATi and Nvidia directly......

Both replies came back saying that they reccommed 450w for a single gfx card and 500w for dual cards..........BUT, and this is a very big but, Manufacturers will always cover their backsides of any claims resulting in system failure etc caused by insufficient power.

So basically they are covering themselves because of the numpties of this world who go out and buy a 400w Q-Tec power supply for example, when a 400w Enermax would be approximately equal to about 500w+ on the Q-Tec.

Most of the tests i've seen show that a 400w good quality PSU is more than enough to power a single card gaming rig, with case fans etc.......But for futureproofing etc I would personally buy or reccommend 500w!

Obviously there's no harm in buying a 600 or 700w PSU but just consider the budget first, If you're spending £1500ish then go for 600w (if you must) but budgets around £8/900 or less it's a complete waste of total budget spending £100+ on a PSU.

hp7909 · 24 May 2006 at 13:59

Fair enuff m8

Oh, if a 650W Q-Tec = 480Watts, then a 500w Q-Tec = 370W :eek:

Nowhere near a 400W Enermax. If anyone's reading, this still doens't justify buying a Q-Tec PSU even if your requiremnts are low, lets just say it gets worse in other areas e.g. AMPS