New Olympus OM-D E-M1 Mark II - The perfect camera???

[D.P.]

Is m43 actually used by many pros? If it can't compete on IQ or size I don't know why you'd actually pick it as a pro. For mere mortals the size advantage of the smaller cameras and lenses along with OBIS is important and I get that, but I don't really get where these bigger m43 cameras fit in for pros - the lenses aren't even cheap.

I can't think of any occasion I've seen a paid photographer not using a DSLR.

The IQ differences are much smaller than you might think, the m43 cameras happily give a Canon APS-C DSLR a run for their money and I see plenty of wedding togs using a Canon 600D etc. I also see some wildlife togs using M43 setups since you need the reach.

I agree the market is probably pretty mall for such cameras and I also don't really see the point. I have a little Olympus EPM-2 and I love the results it provides in a tiny package.

I'm also not really sold on the idea of the f/2.8 lenses. Yeah, they are way smaller than the 24-70mm or 70-200mm f/2.8 FF lenses but they don't have the same equivalent aperture. Its those tiny fast primes that are more interesting, or the incredibly light plasticity kit lenses.

 

[Greebo]

Its not so much the depth of field with 2.8 lenses but how much light they let in. Plus they are weatherproof and razor sharp.

But I agree on the primes. They are gems. And also the long lenses. I have a 112m to 420mm equivalent F4 zoom which only weighs a kilo and fits in my shoulder bag and didnt need me to remortgage my house.

Through in the fact I can hand hold shots at 420mm at 1/10th second.............

 

[D.P.]

Its not so much the depth of field with 2.8 lenses but how much light they let in. Plus they are weatherproof and razor sharp.

But I agree on the primes. They are gems. And also the long lenses. I have a 112m to 420mm equivalent F4 zoom which only weighs a kilo and fits in my shoulder bag and didnt need me to remortgage my house.

Through in the fact I can hand hold shots at 420mm at 1/10th second.............

But if you need the wider aperture for low light then you might as well go to a bigger sensor IMO.

Your 420mm FF equivalent lens though is has an equivalent aperture of f/8 on FF though (M43 is 2 stops slower than FF). I have a 420mm f/5.6 lens on FF that weighs on 750grams (+ weight of the TC). Long live the Nikon 300mm F/4.0 PF, seriously, it is game changing.

 

[Greebo]

for depth of field not light gathering though................

But size and weight are key advantages to me. I used to lug around 15kgs of dslr stuff......never again.

 

[D.P.]

for depth of field not light gathering though................

But size and weight are key advantages to me. I used to lug around 15kgs of dslr stuff......never again.

No. For light gathering as well as DoF, the 2 are intrinsicaly linked. The reason is the sensor size. M43is four times smaller than FF so devices 4x less light, = 2 stops.

 

[englishpremier]

Which would be fine if there were lenses with an f stop wide enough to compensate for this, but f0.95 is widest aperture lens i've seen on m43. Now if there was a f/0.25 or f0.5 the argument would go away. You'd end up with lenses of a similar size (at the font anyway) to their full frame cousins.

Still, I don't imagine anyone will be buying this for its low light performance, so I suppose there is not need to compare.

 

[Greebo]

To be fair, it does "okay" in low light bearing in mind the sensor size. Well good enough for me.

I have just won a competition with my photo taken at night inside Durahm cathedral on a 30 second exposure and I went on a night time astronomy course last month and got some great shots of the milky way.

But I wouldnt go above ISO 6400 on it. I assume FF cameras you can go way above this and get good pics? But the 5 stops of IS compensates for that with mine so I dont need to worry about using high ISO's as I just use a slower shutter speed.

Only becomes an issue I suppose if trying to take pic of moving stuff in low light.

 

[Phate]

m43 produces nice DOF too!

 

[D.P.]

To be fair, it does "okay" in low light bearing in mind the sensor size. Well good enough for me.

I have just won a competition with my photo taken at night inside Durahm cathedral on a 30 second exposure and I went on a night time astronomy course last month and got some great shots of the milky way.

But I wouldnt go above ISO 6400 on it. I assume FF cameras you can go way above this and get good pics? But the 5 stops of IS compensates for that with mine so I dont need to worry about using high ISO's as I just use a slower shutter speed.

Only becomes an issue I suppose if trying to take pic of moving stuff in low light.

The sensors in modern m43 cameras are made y Sony and offer the same performance as the sensors in Sony cameras and Nikon, including the Toshiba sensors Nikon also uses. So basically the only real difference is the sensors size, which is 4x larger in a FF DSLR, 2x larger in an APS-C camera.

What Noise limit is acceptable is a subjective thing but since the technology is the same and the sensor size difference is 2 stops then whatever you find acceptable on your m43 camera you can add 2 stops to that for FF. Even if you Normalized that differences, so on m43 you used an f/2.8 lens and FF you used f/5.6, the FF image will still have superior image quality due to the circle of confusion differences. Basically if you want to make a 30" print you have to enlarge the image projected on the M43 sensor 4x more than the FF sensor, which is why medium and large format cameras are especially popular with landscape togs make giant poster prints etc.





Anyway, this is a little off-topic. i like the M43 cameras, love my epm2, but IMO the important aspect is the small system size so I simply don't see the point in the larger f/2.8 pro zoom. However, they are amazing lenses, very sharp. If you only had an m43 setup then these pro zooms have a little more value but it is debatable whether adding a n APS-C or FF DSLR to your kit bag would not achieve something superior. The strength of M43 is the small size of the system due to the small sensor. If you try to overcome the sensor size limitation by using faster and faster lenses you are kind of fighting against the main design principle in the first place. Where this doesn't hold so much ground is some of the primes that are f/2.0 or faster and still very small. You get a camera setup equivalent to using an f/4.0 lens on FF in a very small package.



Persoanlly I really like the combo of a small m43 camera and a D800. The little PEm2 stands up very well for soemthign I can carry in my pocket.

 

[Greebo]

Olympus does have a trick up its sleeve for landscapes with its 40Mb super pic which rivals FF camera pics for quality/detail.

But yes point taken you can't overcome physics fully and the FF will always win out on abolute quality.

My winning pic is getting blown up to A1 print size. Will be interesting to see how that comes out...........

 

[footman]

My big conundrum will be what to sell to part fund the new body.
Will it be my little and very new E-m5ii or my older E-M1? I've always liked walking around with 2 bodies, so easy to switch when a situation arises and also as a back-up.

 

[D.P.]

Olympus does have a trick up its sleeve for landscapes with its 40Mb super pic which rivals FF camera pics for quality/detail.

But yes point taken you can't overcome physics fully and the FF will always win out on abolute quality.

My winning pic is getting blown up to A1 print size. Will be interesting to see how that comes out...........

Nothing stop you doing the same with any camera though. You can combine exposure to reduce noise, increase DR and increase resolution. People have been doing this for decades to make wide angle panoramic or HDR photos.

 

[Greebo]

Nothing stop you doing the same with any camera though. You can combine exposure to reduce noise, increase DR and increase resolution. People have been doing this for decades to make wide angle panoramic or HDR photos.

Agreed but not quite the same. The olympus is a "trick" to catch up with the FF cameras as it takes 5 pics one pixel different and then merges into one 40MP picture.

taking 5 exact pics and merging to gain exposure/focus/HDR etc isnt quite the same. Again with the Olympus you could take 5 40MP super pics and merge them.

 

[Minstadave]

Nothing stop you doing the same with any camera though. You can combine exposure to reduce noise, increase DR and increase resolution. People have been doing this for decades to make wide angle panoramic or HDR photos.

Not exactly as simple as the in camera Olympus tech though.

 

[D.P.]

Agreed but not quite the same. The olympus is a "trick" to catch up with the FF cameras as it takes 5 pics one pixel different and then merges into one 40MP picture.

taking 5 exact pics and merging to gain exposure/focus/HDR etc isnt quite the same. Again with the Olympus you could take 5 40MP super pics and merge them.

I know how the Olympus works but again, nothing stops you doing great with any camera. You just have to do the merging yourself. You can shift the image with a panoramic head or a PC lens.

 

[JRJ]

43 rumors suggest this will start shipping in December, I've been looking at changing my A6000 for an M1 and 12-40 pro, is it worth waiting?

 

[Minstadave]

43 rumors suggest this will start shipping in December, I've been looking at changing my A6000 for an M1 and 12-40 pro, is it worth waiting?

Depends a lot on the price. It'll be north of 1k for body alone which puts it into XT-2 pricing which is pretty stiff competition.

 

[Greebo]

Depends a lot on the price. It'll be north of 1k for body alone which puts it into XT-2 pricing which is pretty stiff competition.

Yeah sadly the all the rumours i have seen is 1399 euros which with our current exhange rate makes it £1261 (plus VAT??????????)

AT the same price as an XT-2, I would buy an XT-2 over it if I wasnt so heavily invested in Olympus glass already. I would have to start from scratch again.

I was even considering doing it before this body was announced but this body coming made me decide to stick with olympus.

It does make it be far the most expensive m4/3 camera esp when you consider the version one can be bought new for £700 and the equally impressive omd5 mark 2 for £500.

You are certainly paying a premium for the new model. I was hoping it would have come in at a £1000 which would be a fairer price.

BTW seen it said pre-orders go up on 9th November for deliver early December so we will soon know the price.

 

[niko]

Yeah sadly the all the rumours i have seen is 1399 euros which with our current exhange rate makes it £1261 (plus VAT??????????)

AT the same price as an XT-2, I would buy an XT-2 over it if I wasnt so heavily invested in Olympus glass already. I would have to start from scratch again.

I was even considering doing it before this body was announced but this body coming made me decide to stick with olympus.

It does make it be far the most expensive m4/3 camera esp when you consider the version one can be bought new for £700 and the equally impressive omd5 mark 2 for £500.

You are certainly paying a premium for the new model. I was hoping it would have come in at a £1000 which would be a fairer price.

BTW seen it said pre-orders go up on 9th November for deliver early December so we will soon know the price.

i seem to remember the mk1 was about £1300 on release so i think it will be £1300>£1400

 

[JRJ]

Depends a lot on the price. It'll be north of 1k for body alone which puts it into XT-2 pricing which is pretty stiff competition.

Once I sell my Sony stuff I won't be tied into a system so I've been pretty opened minded, but I loved how the M1 felt in hand the size seemed just right for me, I found the Fuji a bit small.