***Official 2010 F1 thread***

I don't see how the FIA can massively fine Renault. This isn't 2007 when they along with the whole world were raking it in...

Let's say they want to fine them £30mil... Renault can't afford it. So they'd have to quit F1.

I think what is going to happen here is that there will be a "public" punishment and a "private" punishment. The private one will be hardly anything other than a huge slap on the wrist (let's face it the two perps have already left the team!). Then the "public" punishment will be way over the top but it will just be for the PR of trying to keep the sport credible and to make it seem that McLaren weren't treated excessively harsh in 2007.
 
JRS said:
Someone else can finish, I'm bored. Fact remains that for all his faults, he was a truly exceptional talent and it's a damned shame that certain folks on here just point-blank refuse to recognise that.
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I am not denying he is a great driver as he clearly is.
 
NathanE said:
I don't see how the FIA can massively fine Renault. This isn't 2007 when they along with the whole world were raking it in...
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So if a speeding fine in 2007 was 200 quid, if you get fined now you can expect the judge to lower that to 100 quid due to the economic recession :confused:
 
NathanE said:
I think what is going to happen here is that there will be a "public" punishment and a "private" punishment. The private one will be hardly anything other than a huge slap on the wrist (let's face it the two perps have already left the team!). Then the "public" punishment will be way over the top but it will just be for the PR of trying to keep the sport credible and to make it seem that McLaren weren't treated excessively harsh in 2007.
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I can't see this, If found guilty they will have to be punished more than McLaren. Remember the people in McLaren left as well to save the team. The crashing is far worse than what McLaren did.

anything but a bigger punishment, would fuel that FIA are biased and continue to erode the reputation of the sport.
 
On the plus side, no-one yet has managed to twist this latest saga round as Yet Another Pro-Ferrari Conspiracy™ ;)
 
JRS said:
Name me a single other driver in the modern era of the sport who wouldn't have done what Schumacher did in turning into that bend at Adelaide, given that Hill never made it all the way alongside him.

Clue - you won't be able to.



Okay, a summary then.

1994 - overtook Hill on the warm-up lap at Silverstone several times, proceeded to ignore the black flags for this heinous crime, DQ'd and handed a (suspended I think?) two race ban. Team were caught with traction control software in the ECU but no 100% proof could be found that they were actually using it in the races. Team were caught tampering with fuel rigs to deliver fuel quicker, blamed a junior crewman, lucky to not barbecue Verstappen in the incident that brought it to light. Those last two would be a little but hard to pin on "the german git" as you so eloquently term him. Can probably pin them on Briatore, mind.

1995 - engaged in a spot of wheelbanging with Hill at Spa, stewards thought it was a bit robust of him and gave him a suspended ban for it. Had the temerity to be leading Hill at Silverstone and Monza, Hill taking him out both times in retribution.

1996 - had the bare-faced cheek and effrontery to win several times in a car that wasn't really capable, so everyone jumped up and down and screamed "Cheat! Cheat!". Despite mutterings about traction control and the like, nothing ever found. Not that this would stop folks on here of course, he must have been cheating :)

1997 - tried, and failed, to take out Villeneuve to win the title. Again, name me a driver in the modern era who wouldn't have made the attempt. Not that this matters, of course. DQ'd from the season, leaving folks to scream and wail that he should have been punished further.

Someone else can finish, I'm bored. Fact remains that for all his faults, he was a truly exceptional talent and it's a damned shame that certain folks on here just point-blank refuse to recognise that.
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Delusional post. You dont happen to be a Schumacher fan do you...
Yes he was a great talent, an exceptional driver, no one is disputing that. But he also was a dirty competitor, which no one should be disputing either.
 
Christo said:
Delusional post.
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Really? Could you point out where I was delusional in it? Cheers in advance.

Christo said:
You dont happen to be a Schumacher fan do you...
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How about you take a wild guess?

Christo said:
Yes he was a great talent, an exceptional driver, no one is disputing that. But he also was a dirty competitor, which no one should be disputing either.
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I don't believe I've ever disputed that he had questionable, amoral, and yes even dirty moments in his career. Trying to nerf Villeneuve at Jerez and Monacogate were by far and away the worst, and he was quite rightly punished for them. But what grates is that people fixate on these moments to the exclusion of everything else he did in his career that was good.
 
JRS said:
Really? Could you point out where I was delusional in it? Cheers in advance.



How about you take a wild guess?



I don't believe I've ever disputed that he had questionable, amoral, and yes even dirty moments in his career. Trying to nerf Villeneuve at Jerez and Monacogate were by far and away the worst, and he was quite rightly punished for them. But what grates is that people fixate on these moments to the exclusion of everything else he did in his career that was good.
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I am not going to discuss the finer details - but its very obvious your account/outlook is rather lenient towards Schumacher. Im not sure you detected the sarcasm in the obviously sarcastic comment about being a Schumacher fan.;)

What, so when we discuss cheating and happen to mention Schumacher we should self censor our comments with an asterisk (but lets not forget how great and mighty Schumacher was). lol.
Its obvious, its there for all to see, people know he was a good driver - whats with the humongous chip on your shoulder.
 
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You see that dot Christo? That was the point I was trying to make. You're about six or seven miles to the east.

No, I'm not saying you should self-censor any mention you make of Schumacher. What on Earth would be the point in that? All I'm saying is that it just grates when people ignore all the times when he showed great talent and fixate on the moments when he was an unsporting, cheating, dirty Kraut swine. That's all.
 
to be honest, he did the viewing public a favour - it was, up until the point of his crash, one of the most boring races I've ever watched.

Its the racing equivilent of giving a rugby player a blood capsule. :D

Dutch Guy said:
So if a speeding fine in 2007 was 200 quid, if you get fined now you can expect the judge to lower that to 100 quid due to the economic recession :confused:
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Its more to do with keeping car manufacturers in F1 while their bread and butter income drops off the edge of a cliff.
 
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most of the F1 cars are at ema airport today and friday
i work for DHL and were loading the planes to fly them out to the next GP.
first batch of cars and spares etc arrived today
 
Of course it happens in f1 all the time, Maybe less so now since team orders. But we all know what's happened and what continues to happen. Cheating is part of F1 just don' get caught.
 
AcidHell2 said:
Of course it happens in f1 all the time, Maybe less so now since team orders. ...
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How have team orders reduced cheating :confused:

AcidHell2 said:
... Cheating is part of F1 just don' get caught.
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Which is why the FIA should come down very hard on Renault and if it can be proved that he knew either before or after the event, also on Alonso for withholding vital information - again.
 
AcidHell2 said:
Cheating is part of F1 just don' get caught.
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Times are changing, people will no longer tolerate that in the sport. What was once deemed just part of the sport and acceptable has had people turning away from the sport.

Listening to Irvine he lived in a time when it was so acceptable he doesn't understand the fuss. I bet he could write a shocking book of F1 cheating tactics.

F1 is slowly having to clean up it's act. Most of which I blame the FIA, they should have cleaned it up and come down on some of the tactics and driving used years ago. There's never been a decent deterent before. There is now, a team boss will have to think twice about upsetting a major manufacturer again.
 
Renault’s chief operating officer Patrick Pelata says the French manufacturer will have a “calm debate” about whether to continue in Formula 1 in the wake of the Singapore race-fixing scandal.

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=46906
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The decision as to whether or not Renault continues in F1 may not be entirely in their hands - it certainly shouldn't be.

However, I am quietly confident that the Dwarf will find a way of sweeping everything under the carpet ;)
 
stockhausen said:
However, you do often see cases of a driver from one team deliberately holding up the driver of another team in the interests of the team (or of their engine supplier, e.g. Ferrari) without any real expectation of being able actually to beat him - hence "blue flags".
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This is actually one of the jobs that a No.2 driver is required to perform - be the rear gunner of the No.1. There is nothing illegal about this.

The most outstanding example of this, from the top of my head is Malaysia, 1999, when M.Schumacher returned from his broken leg, took pole and off the start line let E.Irvine through to take the lead (as he was going for the title). MS then gave an exhibition of how to drive defensively, which allowed EI to pull away in front of him.

I hope that Renault don't come to grief over this, as I feel we need Renault in F1 and I don't think what happened is a big deal. Using one driver to allow another driver to prosper is morally bad, but its all part of competition.
 
Overlag said:
yup, those two [Hill and MS] had a thing about fighting for the exact same peice of track
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Too right. And so it should be. Top drivers are expected to be at each other's throats and are expected not to give their main rival an inch.

Hill openly admitted, that when he took MS out at Silverstone, he was damned if he was going to let a German win the British GP. Personally, I would've done exactly the same.

This is all part of sport. We see this in football, where if 1 player fouls another, the other player will seek retribution (either in the same game or in a later game).

The key point is that F1 drivers are ultra competitive in their make up and at times will do things that are borderline unfair/cheating.

In all honesty, were it not for the ruthlessness of certain drivers, F1 would be boring. 2007 was one of my all time fave seasons, for the simple reason that we saw 2 drivers (Alonso, Hamilton), at the top of their game, with genuine dislike for one another, both fighting tooth and nail in every race.
 
JRS said:
Okay, a summary then.

1994 - ...
1995 - ...
1996 - ...
1997 - ...

Fact remains that for all his [MS's] faults, he was a truly exceptional talent ...
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Agree 100%.

For me, MS remains the most complete F1 driver I have ever seen (and I've watched F1, through the days of Prost, Senna, Mansell, Hill, Hakinnen, Alonso, Hamilton).
 
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