Only Person with a clutch problem eh ?

[jaykay]

well arent you a condescending little **** today ?

As ive already previously stated. The gearbox is rated to 400NM constant torque (approx 300 lb/ft) the car puts out 260 lb/ft as standard. The remap takes it to 400 lb/ft, but it only puts out more than 300 lb/ft on a small portion of the rev range (2500 rpm to 5000rpm)

http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p279/mrlol_album/Vectra VXR/P1020282.jpg

Theory is, its rated to higher than 300 lb/ft for occasional torque, but should take 300 lb/ft all day every day so you should in theory be safe. Obviously in practice thats not the case, but theres no need to be a **** and call me retarded.

2500rpm to 5000rpm is quite a large portion of the rev range. Especially as its peaks nearly 100lb/ft over the rated amount.

Kinda lucky the clutch went tho, as im betting and uprated one will just blow the gearbox.

But anyways when remapping, always take into account that something may break and don'talways believe tuners.

Not having a go at you btw.

 

[sigma]

What if they added 'we recommend purchasing our gearbox upgrade' to the description?

Unless there is no gearbox uprgrade available, I'd be surprised if there wasn't anything suitable out there though.

I have seen supporting modification recommendations in the past but then I'd assume a little application of common sense would help too.

Goes back to the days of people claiming R5GTTs kept blowing head gaskets etc when in actual fact some people just upped the boost to 20odd psi without any other modifications and then wondered why the engine went pop.

 

[Matt82]

another thing you have to consider for MRLOL is that as a vectra owner getting his car tuned... he was an early adopter, there arnt going to be many tweaked vxr vectras out there

long and short of it though, his clutch went and anyone can kill the clutch even on a totally standard car in no time at all

look at the failure rates on aygo/107s and c1s. they last 30k ish

 

[[TW]Fox]

well arent you a condescending little **** today ?

As ive already previously stated. The gearbox is rated to 400NM constant torque (approx 300 lb/ft) the car puts out 260 lb/ft as standard. The remap takes it to 400 lb/ft, but it only puts out more than 300 lb/ft on a small portion of the rev range (2500 rpm to 5000rpm)

I might need to start a MrLOL LOLQUOTES spreadsheet at this rate - how is 2500rpm (ie basically what, half your rev range if you assume idle at 1kish and redline at 6kish) a 'small portion'?!

 

[L0rdMike]

2500-5000rpm isnt what I would call small and its in the always in zone.

 

[sigma]

Unless he meant a small portion of that range? Can't quite see how you'd think that's a small portion of the entire rev rage. :s

 

[L0rdMike]

Unless he meant a small portion of that range? Can't quite see how you'd think that's a small portion of the entire rev rage. :s

Depends how many Revs you got to play with.

 

[sigma]

On flat land of course.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Unless he meant a small portion of that range? Can't quite see how you'd think that's a small portion of the entire rev rage. :s

Same way you'd think a Monaro and a Corvette are the same I guess

 

[Fett]

I am not entirely convinced that major remaps are ever a good idea. I get small ones to smooth things out, etc etc but if you can safely and reliably get 340bhp from a car thats 280bhp stock why didnt the manufacturer do that given it was a flagship halo performance product? We are long past compromises for emissions and economy reasons at this end of the market.

BMW have taken 10 years of development to get the M57 3.0 diesel in the 330d to 231bhp from its original 184bhp yet half the internet thinks there is no downside to getting a bloke with a laptop to complete this process in 2 minutes.... It just seeems odd.

The way it was explained to me was reliability and usability throughout a huge range of variables. A manufacturer has to ensure the car will run all day without a hitch in extreme conditions, whether its bombing down a pan-emirate ighway, stuck in traffic in Rio or starting every morning in Helsinki. They have to allow for massive variations in air density and fuel quality, speed restrictions (compromise for economy at 56/70 etc), emission regulations and attractive service schedules. On top of that, some maps are fettered to allow a range/model variance and future upgrades at reduced costs to the manufacturer.

With so many constrictions on a global-friendly map, there is a lot of room to refine it and extract power if you can knock out some of the safety net that the car doesn't need, as pretty much every manufacturer map is a compromise of the above.

I don't know if every manufacturer allows for the variations above if a car is country specific, but thats how one of the fellers who worked on the GT-R EU map explained it to me. Thats a map that changed to ensure Euro emission compliancy and gained a few extra ponies along the way.

 

[[TW]Fox]

The way it was explained to me was reliability and usability throughout a huge range of variables. A manufacturer has to ensure the car will run all day without a hitch in extreme conditions, whether its bombing down a pan-emirate ighway, stuck in traffic in Rio or starting every morning in Helsinki. They have to allow for massive variations in air density and fuel quality, speed restrictions (compromise for economy at 56/70 etc), emission regulations and attractive service schedules. On top of that, some maps are fettered to allow a range/model variance and future upgrades at reduced costs to the manufacturer.

This suggests the manufacturers sell exactly the same model right down to the ECU map all over the world.

They don't. You will never find, for example, a 320d Coupe bombing down a pan-emirati highway just as you wont find an E60 BMW 535i driving down the M25.

 

[Fett]

I don't know if every manufacturer allows for the variations above if a car is country specific...

Take something like an X5. I wouldn't have thought there is a Peruvian specific map nor one for the Netherlands, but the car has to operate without a hitch despite the atmospheric levels and fuel quality issues.

Point is, these generic maps have a wide tolerance margin for obvious reasons, including reliability. The manufacturers themselves will happily allow the power to be increased within those tolerances. You could buy a vanilla STi with 265bhp, or pay your money and have a Prodrive pack with 305bhp via remap. The internals and clutch remain the same. Evos come in differnt flavours as well, from 300 to 340bhp, the internals remain the same etc. All with full manufacturer warranty.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

Not convinced about emissions being the cause. All the diesel boys claim better mpg so this would reduce emissions as less fuel is being burnt.

I think its a reliability thing.

Not nitrous oxide emissions though, or higher sulphur content fuel back when they were developed and engine map calibrated.

 

[Fr0dders]

Not convinced about emissions being the cause. All the diesel boys claim better mpg so this would reduce emissions as less fuel is being burnt.

I think its a reliability thing.

thing is one of the first modifications made to most cars is to bin some of the catalytic converters.

Most modern cars have a pre cat, and a main cat, which are required in the EU type approval tests (i believe thats their name) but arent required to pass a UK MOT emissions test.

Take the Astra VXR nurburgring edition. It was fitted with a remus race exhaust system which bypassed the pre cat and removed one of the silencers. It wasnt legal to sell it as a new car with it on, so vauxhall "modified" all the cars once imported into this country.

So binning one of the cats, generally making the less restrictive and bigger, you can usually free up quite a few ponies.

Also, didnt we have a discussion a while back that technically any modified exhaust makes the car illegal ? which is why cars like the Astra VXR nurburgring cant be sold with exhausts like the remus one from the factory. Despite the fact they will all pass MOT emissions tests.

would be interesting to see the difference in emissions between stock exhaust with 2 cats, and most modified exhausts that have a 100 cell sports cat and no precat. They most probably dont meet the Euro V or whatever emissions standards that the stock cars meet.