Caporegime
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I know from experience never to boast about how reliable my German car is, it always ends in an expensive pool of tears.
Only Person with a clutch problem eh ?
- Thread starter Fr0dders
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Any German or Korean junk will not last over its rated specs, to say everything else is rubbish and buy German is bias and clueless.
with the golf i dont give a damn. i know that car will last. remember the audi S2 cyl5 turbo thing? thats basically a gti 16v lump with an extra cylinder on the end. you know how much power those things make, well mine has the same bottom end. same shells, bearings, (may be slightly different rods though). mine is on 217k now and still runs fantastic
the gearbox, not sure what else thats shared with, but its an evolution on from the mk2 gti boxes (which themselves lasted well) but these are bomb proof. clutches last 150k. i know a mk3 breaker, the only time he sells gearboxes are when people put them on 20vt lumps in mk2s
as for the s4. i wont boast, but i know people dont uprate the drivetrain until wellllll past 400bhp
the gearbox, not sure what else thats shared with, but its an evolution on from the mk2 gti boxes (which themselves lasted well) but these are bomb proof. clutches last 150k. i know a mk3 breaker, the only time he sells gearboxes are when people put them on 20vt lumps in mk2s
as for the s4. i wont boast, but i know people dont uprate the drivetrain until wellllll past 400bhp
Oh my - How many peoples gearboxes have gone bang then MrLOL? You keep mentioning what the gearbox is rated to, yet I've never seen anyone have a problem with either M32 or M40 box?
That said, you clutch may go, thats the price you pay for tuning - 4 owners with bad clutches out of hundreds tuning suggests driver error rather than the clutch not being strong enough though.
That said, you clutch may go, thats the price you pay for tuning - 4 owners with bad clutches out of hundreds tuning suggests driver error rather than the clutch not being strong enough though.
Soldato
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By the way MrLOL, in that forum you say:
Fitting an LSD will further reduce the life of a clutch, as the clutch will become the weak (or a weaker) link in the powertrain. This is because previously it would have some of the strain reduced by the limited traction offered by the standard open differential. If you fitted an LSD and a new 'standard clutch', it's lifespan would be even shorter than it was previously.
You could also find that you start finding other weak links then, as mentioned, like driveshafts, CV joints, differential casings, things like that....
Just thought I'd point that out for future reference
Fitting an LSD will further reduce the life of a clutch, as the clutch will become the weak (or a weaker) link in the powertrain. This is because previously it would have some of the strain reduced by the limited traction offered by the standard open differential. If you fitted an LSD and a new 'standard clutch', it's lifespan would be even shorter than it was previously.
You could also find that you start finding other weak links then, as mentioned, like driveshafts, CV joints, differential casings, things like that....
Just thought I'd point that out for future reference
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This is kind of interesting.
As manufacturing is conducted with greater precision and as mechanical developments progress further, we've come to expect more and more from the drivetrain components of the everyday car.
Today, a manual transmission is expected to last, literally, forever on a car of standard tune. Even with "light" tuning (say +20%), there's still a perception that it should be able to just take that on without breaking a sweat. In many cases it's true, and a transmission will be rated for a constant torque quite a bit higher than the standard tune. In addition, the rating itself is probably conservative, and the reality is that it can reliably take even more. This gives a pretty good scope for tuning without having to worry.
I think situations like the VXR arise when the transmission is actually rated quite closely to the output of the standard engine tune, and the rating itself is unusually close to the line. Then you tune it up by 50%, it goes bang after thousands of miles of pretty hard driving, and people wonder why!
As manufacturing is conducted with greater precision and as mechanical developments progress further, we've come to expect more and more from the drivetrain components of the everyday car.
Today, a manual transmission is expected to last, literally, forever on a car of standard tune. Even with "light" tuning (say +20%), there's still a perception that it should be able to just take that on without breaking a sweat. In many cases it's true, and a transmission will be rated for a constant torque quite a bit higher than the standard tune. In addition, the rating itself is probably conservative, and the reality is that it can reliably take even more. This gives a pretty good scope for tuning without having to worry.
I think situations like the VXR arise when the transmission is actually rated quite closely to the output of the standard engine tune, and the rating itself is unusually close to the line. Then you tune it up by 50%, it goes bang after thousands of miles of pretty hard driving, and people wonder why!
the diesel and 20vt golfs start to suffer that when the clutches start to become old, but thats mainly down to the power delivery delivering the torque in a sharp spike.
spikey torque plots make cars feel nippy but cause mechanical mayhem and lots of wheelspin
There's a decent sized spike low down, a little under 3000RPM, which is where people get the slip yes, but as for wheelspin; on a run, you'd normally keep it "in the powerband" so that torque spike isn't really a problem.
Superchips have designed their map with "launch control" (First gear, clutch down, accelerator to floor holds revs) at 3500RPM - I haven't experienced a dry day to try it (Gotta be done once!), but I assume they would have tested that, and if it can launch at 3500RPM, my guess is the chassis/drivetrain can take it without spinning too much.
Superchips have designed their map with "launch control" (First gear, clutch down, accelerator to floor holds revs) at 3500RPM - I haven't experienced a dry day to try it (Gotta be done once!), but I assume they would have tested that, and if it can launch at 3500RPM, my guess is the chassis/drivetrain can take it without spinning too much.
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Caporegime
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The joys of everything being built down to a low cost, nothing on the Vectra VXR screams quality engineering to me, to sell such a powerfull car so cheaply you need to cut corners.
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It's hardly surprising. I'm not aware of anyone in the Vauxhall tuning community who's got a good reputation. Courtney certained used to be a bunch of cowboys so it's hardly likely they'd mention any problems.
This is exactly my issue
It seems obvious now, remap the car beyond what the gearbox will cope, and the clutch is gonna fail earlier than usual. Remap it some more, and lasts even less (Thorney Stage 2 with 325bhp lasted 3-4 months !!)
But with 2 well respected tuners telling me i didnt need one, i was inclined to think i was worrying un-necessarily and i didnt know as much as they do, so it must be safe. Perhaps i'm too gullible, but when you dont know enough about cars, you never know who to believe
Muncher swears by them, as do plenty of other VX220 owners. Some of the major criticisms aimed at tuners, of offering products you dont need - they dont do. They also dont fudge dyno results to make their results better. Their dyno is deliberately one of the harshest around and is most certainly not know for over reading. What "cowboy" antics have they been known for in the past ?
Daft thing is, courtenays remap is written for them by Klassen motors in Germany, and thats technically all thats on my car. I didnt change any hardware.
my gearbox didnt go "bang" as such. I lost 6th gear, and this was whilst standard too. Bit of an odd gear to loose as its not one you often change into.
its clutches that are getting chewed, not gearboxes.
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Using multiple head gaskets to lower the compression ratio with their turbo conversions rather than doing the job properly. They also went bust (and changed their name) after being sued for fitting dodgy rear disk conversions to Nova's that caused a few crashes.