And just watched the rest of that game..so it turns out roaches are pretty good
Roaches, pretty good unit.
Get on for teams you noob.
**** Original Starcraft 2 Thread ****
- Thread starter mohawk
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Roaches, pretty good unit.
Get on for teams you noob.
Infestor broodlord will be excellent. If you can keep protoss on 2 bases then they'll have about 1.5 max armies, so if they're terrible this shouldnt be too much trouble while you expand over the map. What are your current compositions like?
If you're using roach heavy armies atm, try adding a few more infestors as well as your corruptors in to practice your micro. Remember they can immobilise collossi so you should be able to get really good surrounds and punish protoss really hard if they're caught out of position. Don't just a-move roaches in or they will get forcefielded and deadified in seconds. Choose your moments carefully and attack when you have a good position. Remember that with correct positioning you can force them -NOT- to engage while you're still working on your ultimate deatharmy
If you're a lighter player, with lair using mutas and lings, then again add some infestors and try to work on your positioning and flanking. Remember that the idea of this composition is to never let your opponent get to their deathball, because they just wont have the production since you're harassing all the time. This buys you time to expand and take decent control over the map while your opponent's trying to deal with your harassment, stuck in their base.
Eventually though either way you're looking for the unstoppable zerg push with a maxed army of broods/infestors and a remax on other units depending on what protoss has left. GL!
you around tonight?Unless your positioning and sense of where to take an engagement is good then Baneling Drops is something that has always worked. No idea why pros stoppd using it.
What league are you? That comp seems very bad and if his control isn't good it'll just be over run easily with Roaches if you engage in the open. You could drop half of them also which works well.
Mutas is also another option against anyone who goes Robo tech but be aware of a tranition to high Templar and Archons.
I don't think so Alex T_T
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Thanks for the advice Alex. Finding that roaches are pretty weak in the face of the big balls of protoss.
The reason this came up was because i just lost a game i was dominating (http://drop.sc/294893). I was just taking my 4th and harrassing with mutas and lings on his 2nd (no 3rd). When his army came out i pumped roaches to block it but that seemed to fail.
I put my replay in to see if you had any ideas. I am in silver by the way.
The reason this came up was because i just lost a game i was dominating (http://drop.sc/294893). I was just taking my 4th and harrassing with mutas and lings on his 2nd (no 3rd). When his army came out i pumped roaches to block it but that seemed to fail.
I put my replay in to see if you had any ideas. I am in silver by the way.
I'll have a watch when i'm back home if Kamwah's being gay with his gf and not playing starcraft tonight
¬_¬
Roaches are probably the best all round ZvP unit. You should be able to win with just them if you hit your injects on 2/3 hatches and get your upgrades!
Ahhh yes the old 2 base 10 gate + collossus build, classic. Seriously though:
Were you intending on mutas from the start of the game? I reckon you could have had a reasonable amount earlier, and you certainly didnt need 23 of them before attacking!
Quick note on control while we're talking mutas, remember that there's absolutely no shame in just going away. You dont have to kill every probe, or destroy both extractors or even the nexus in order to have done good damage. The whole point of muta harass is that they're superfast and reasonably easy to control, so you can keep your opponent running their stalkers around their base trying to keep up with you. This tends to lead to mistakes on their part, which will push you ahead. Yes you did do a lot of damage with your mutas in that one attack, but you lost far too many in the process and were unable to continue your harassment, going so far as to just force him to attack with an army that you didnt have the units to defend with. A better strategy is to say
"ok, I see he's moving all of his stalkers and his collossi to deal with these mutas, so instead of trying to do any more damage here i'll pull out, macro while half of my mutas are going to his expansion, then attack with those to take out some probes. He'll probably move all of his units to defend that, and because they're superslow I can bug out without losing more than 1-2 mutas and reattack the main with the other half of my mutas handily left behind, then repeat ad nauseam until I can't harass any more. At that point I'll just poke around his base and try to find any weaknesses. If he moves out I'll just send all of the mutas to destroy his production so he can't reinforce, then pull them back to help defend my base!".
This way you're constantly doing damage not only in small amounts to his economy (unless he's really terrible), but also by stressing his focus and actions, making him worry more about your mutas than anything else..
Second thing to mention is your attack angle. If you notice in the battle, your roaches and lings all sorta filter through over the course of a few seconds, so they all die before you get any real dps down on the protoss army. As soon as they move out from their base you should instantly be able to scout it (and you knew they were going to attack as well), you should be able to start thinking about setting up a surround at some point in the map and also start spamming reinforcing units. Sure this sounds easier than it maybe is, but that's the only real challenge with zerg these days imo
What you're ideally looking for (in this case) is to have a nice huuuge arc in the course of about 1-2 seconds when you engage with damage upgraded speed roaches, with reasonable access to the collossi, or just so many that you can slowly move forward ploughing through the stalkers (hence the damage upgrade, seriously i hate upgraded roaches..). To be fair your opponent didnt have that many forcefields running in that game, your weakness in that battle was in unit count and positioning. Both of which I think you can easily improve
What else...general macro i guess, having a stronger sense of direction..I personally think you overcommitted to mutas in that game, there wasnt much in the way of a decent transition in mind as far as I could tell. Think about where you want to go a bit later on. Would it be better not to cut 2-3 mutas and start investing in infestors for hive tech and full upgrades on your units for example?
Oh and finally, near the start there was a nice big cluster of lings near your base. Try to make a habit of spreading more them out over the map, get a sense of what's actually going on, scout bases, poke the front with individual lings etc.
As an example, just running all of your lings into the third is a good way to instantly lose 600 minerals if you're unlucky when you only needed to lose 25. Yea you can have a nice group nearby if there's an undefended nexus or probes there, but it's not worth the risk of just blindly running in. Honestly you should have a ling there as standard anyway to scout when it gets placed, and even block it for a while if you can by just being in the way or killing the probe etc.
Hope there's something useful in there, not written one of these posts in a while..
Alex thanks for the feedback on my tactics. I have only just started using Mutas for harrassment after watching NesTea in Iron Squid. Its like using light cavalary in games like TW. So far it does work really well because my most opponents are not prepared. I realised as i harrassed that i went too far.
I will try and set up the arc with my land forces. I think i know what you mean from the vods i have seen. Though i think that will require some new micro skills.
What are your feelings on learning infestor micro? Are there any basics i should understand? What about the nerfs incoming over the next week.
Thanks for taking the time again.
I will try and set up the arc with my land forces. I think i know what you mean from the vods i have seen. Though i think that will require some new micro skills.
What are your feelings on learning infestor micro? Are there any basics i should understand? What about the nerfs incoming over the next week.
Thanks for taking the time again.
It's not the fact they're unprepared, it's just that at your level they're pretty clueless so if you have even a slight understanding of what you're doing then you're already ahead. Mutas are great because they can easily run away, Nestea has showcased many times a kind of mass Muta style against Protoss which in the end only loses to Templar/Archons.
You don't need to create an arc at your level, not even Masters Zergs do that. It's more about engaging in the correct locations.
You also don't need any specific micro, Zerg is nearly all about positioning and surrounds so that you can get the most out of your very cost-inefficient units (par Winfestors).
Infestors are units that can fill any role in an army, there's not really anything you need to know except to start your Infestors when Pathogen Glands is half done so your Infestors pop out with the upgraded energy. The nerfs incoming will make Infested Terrans unaffected by upgrades so that Infestors can't be an army by themselves (Freaky in the GSTL last year showcased a few games with pure Infestors and a few lings).
At your level and playing Zerg it's probably the best to aim on understanding all the units and BOs.
Soldato
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Jesus, I don't know why I continue to read Team Liquid. TLO is losing to First and people are talking about how zerg were nerfed too much because of it.
No, TLO is losing because he's ****ing ****.
I really should stop reading that site :/.
No, TLO is losing because he's ****ing ****.
I really should stop reading that site :/.
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Starcraft 2 - First time
Hey guys, been looking at starcraft 2 vids and reading up on it, and it looks pretty good, it isnt my usual sort of game but i would like to give it a go, i was wondering if it was a hard game to get into and understand what to do. When i cant understand a game i cant be bothered to find out how and what to do, like EVE awesome looking game but just couldnt understand it. Id also like to know, how many expansions are there to this game? Is there a monthly fee?
Hey guys, been looking at starcraft 2 vids and reading up on it, and it looks pretty good, it isnt my usual sort of game but i would like to give it a go, i was wondering if it was a hard game to get into and understand what to do. When i cant understand a game i cant be bothered to find out how and what to do, like EVE awesome looking game but just couldnt understand it. Id also like to know, how many expansions are there to this game? Is there a monthly fee?
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Yeah it balances you against equally matched opponents... so you're destined to lose half the time.
bit of a downer
bit of a downer
For multiplayer; No matter how good you are, the matchmaking system is the best I've ever come across and your win/loss ratio will be about 1:1.
It's very easy to get into, and very hard to master.
1 Expansion due in March.
You can always play 3v3 or 2v2 with the OcUK chaps for a much more relaxed environment to learn in.
When you first setup your account you also get 50 games where your base is walled off by rocks you can destroy so even if your opponent is far better than you, you always get to play the start of the game and get an army before getting destroyed.
Edit: I have a spare account I can let you borrow if you want to try it out, but if you play multiplayer you will play gold/platinum (middle ranked) opponents so I suggest campaign/playing with bots/playing OcUKers.
It's very easy to get into, and very hard to master.
1 Expansion due in March.
You can always play 3v3 or 2v2 with the OcUK chaps for a much more relaxed environment to learn in.
When you first setup your account you also get 50 games where your base is walled off by rocks you can destroy so even if your opponent is far better than you, you always get to play the start of the game and get an army before getting destroyed.
Edit: I have a spare account I can let you borrow if you want to try it out, but if you play multiplayer you will play gold/platinum (middle ranked) opponents so I suggest campaign/playing with bots/playing OcUKers.
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