Players who should be good, but aren't...

Gilly

Gilly

Gilly

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Bring your players in here. Those who used to be good, those who are believed to be good but aren't, and those playing for decent teams that don't deserve to be. Along with, of course, those players that ARE good players. Not players that WILL be good, or COULD be good, or blow hot and cold, but play well all the time :)

There's quite a few if you think about it.

Believed to be good but aren't and never were:

Wes Brown
Nicky Butt
Ashley Cole
Paul Okon
Nick Barmby
Stephane Henchoz
Olivier Bernard
Emile Heskey
Kieron Dyer
Danny Murphy
Kevin Phillips
Tore Andre Flo
Marcus Stewart
Noel Whelan
Jonothan Greening
Mario Stanic
Jesper Gronkjaer
Jamie Carragher
Celestine Babayaro

Were good but not any more:

Stephen Gerrard
Michael Owen
Ian Harte
David beckham
Paul Scholes
Eirik Bakke
Rio Ferdinand
Mark Viduka
Harry Kewell
Roy Keane
Michael Ricketts
Darius Vassell
Lee Bowyer
Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink
John Arne Riise
Juan Sebastian Veron
Marcel Desailly
David Seaman

Players that teams couldn't do without:

Ruud Van Nistelrooy
Thierry Henry
Danny Mills
Gianfranco Zola
Alan Shearer
Gary Speed
Jonothan Woodgate
Damien Duff
Sami Hyypia
Gareth Southgate
Sorele Geremi
Patrick Vieira
William Gallas
Shay Given
Paul Robinson
Ryan Giggs


Also interested in hearing your guesses as to who will be joining the ranks of these lists next season and the season after. Mssrs Jamie Milner and Wayne Rooney par example.

So these are a list compiled entirely by atpbx and I. Tell us why we are wrong, Tell us where we are wrong. Tell us where you agree and tell us players you would put in your lists.
 
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Ashley Cole? he is excellent...one of the best left backs in the premiership if you ask me. Puts 100% into every game he plays, and if you disagree with that then you've never seen him play.

EDIT: Players that teams couldn't do without:

you missed Dennis Bergkamp ;)
 
Originally posted by PAz
Ashley Cole? he is excellent...one of the best left backs in the premiership if you ask me. Puts 100% into every game he plays, and if you disagree with that then you've never seen him play.

EDIT: Players that teams couldn't do without:

you missed Dennis Bergkamp ;)
Click to expand...

I think you are missing the point, ACTUALLY good players, not players, who are petulant, not players who are OK.
Actually, week in week out, the actuall good players in the premeirship.
 
Half those players in the 'were good but not any more' are still top players - by not good any more do you mean going through a temporary loss of form, or that they're past their best and will never regain it?

Owen - temporary loss of form, not helped by playing in a crap team

Scholes - :confused:

Rio - been out most of the season so :confused:

Roy Keane - how is he not good any more apart from being out with injury for ages and just feeling his way back?

And I agree that Ashley Cole is a great player btw.
 
Originally posted by dirtydog
Half those players in the 'were good but not any more' are still top players - by not good any more do you mean going through a temporary loss of form, or that they're past their best and will never regain it?

Owen - temporary loss of form, not helped by playing in a crap team

Scholes - :confused:

Rio - been out most of the season so :confused:

Roy Keane - how is he not good any more apart from being out with injury for ages and just feeling his way back?

And I agree that Ashley Cole is a great player btw.
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Okay.
Scholes- could you see him getting a hat trick against poland again? could you see him hitting those 20 yard screamers that seemed to be there every week? could you see him executing the kind of quick passing give and go runs that used to be his forte?
No, becasue he doesnt do that anymore.

Owen- Hat triack against germany, see him doing that again? beating 3 or 4 players before slotting one away, sensational burst of pace before lobbing the keeper..............No becasue he doesnt do it anymore, this season or last.

Roy keane- Treble winning season, immense player, tough uncomplicated, commanding, chipped in with goals.
Where has he been since then?...........................

Rio.............In the games he has played, when as he been any better than brown or o'shea? where has his "Bobby Moore" of the naughties footballing brilliance gone.???

Its a debate.
Tell us WHY Ashley cole isnt an overated diver, not we say he is, you say he isnt.
WHY do you think hes good, and do you think that in a team of all the ACTUALLY good players in the premiership, you would put him in and loose for instance, a Zola, or an Henry................
Tell us.
 
I don't agree with your position of Stevie G, he is just suffering a lapse which he is coming out of.

His passing is still superb (ala pass which put Baros through against Arsenal for the pen to name one)

His tackling is still good (though a little rash at times;) )

His head is just down at the moment

He is still only young

Hence my disagreement with your positioning of "were good but not any more"

My two penneth:)
 
Ashley Cole

i told you, every game he puts 110% into it...his heart is with Arsenal and even if everyone else plays poorly HE puts everything into his game.

Pfft, he dives just as much as anyone else if you ask me...its just he plays for Arsenal...so everyone pounces on it.
 
Maybe the Gerrard one is a false position. I've swung a long way from believing he could be the biggest loss to England before the World Cup. he just seems to lack the motivation right now. maybe he's only lost it for a short period, but lost it he has.

I've not rated Ashley Cole ever. And even if he does give 110% (something I've never seen evidence of all the way though a match) he's just not that good a player.

I've also noticed that you're only talking about Arsenal players PAz. Can't you bring any more to the discussion?
 
Originally posted by Gilly

Wes Brown - Very Good player at the tender age of about 22 how can you say supposed to be good but never were ?

Nicky Butt - Disagree

Ashley Cole - Disagree
Paul Okon - Agree
Nick Barmby Agree
Stephane Henchoz - Disagree
Olivier Bernard- Agree
Emile Heskey-Agree
Kieron Dyer - Dont make me laugh Dyer is an world class player
Danny Murphy - debatable
Kevin Phillips - Disagree
Tore Andre Flo - Agree
Marcus Stewart - debatable
Noel Whelan - Agree
Jonothan Greening - Disagree
Mario Stanic - Agree
Jesper Gronkjaer - Debatable
Jamie Carragher - Disagree
Celestine Babayaro - Agree

Were good but not any more:

Stephen Gerrard - Disagree
Michael Owen - Agree
Ian Harte - Agree
David beckham LOL LOL LOL DISAGREE
Paul Scholes - DISAGREe
Eirik Bakke - Agree
Rio Ferdinand - DISAGREE
Mark Viduka - Agree
Harry Kewell - Disagree
Roy Keane - Disagree
Michael Ricketts - Agree
Darius Vassell - Agree
Lee Bowyer - Agree
Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink - Disagree
John Arne Riise - Disagree
Juan Sebastian Veron - Disagree
Marcel Desailly - Debatable

Players that teams couldn't do without: mainly agree

Click to expand...
 
Originally posted by JohnnyG
Believed to be good but aren't and never were:

Joe Cole...
Click to expand...

Good one that. Forgot about him. Just shows how much he does ;)

Oh, and Memphisto, all of those Manyoo players you don't agree with were chosen by atpbx. A manyoo fan :) So don't think it was my Leeds bias getting in the way.
 
Originally posted by Gilly
Good one that. Forgot about him. Just shows how much he does ;)

Oh, and Memphisto, all of those Manyoo players you don't agree with were chosen by atpbx. A manyoo fan :) So don't think it was my Leeds bias getting in the way.
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ok mate was getting worried and well I'm not going to say anything about atbx.

I'm on compiling my lists now
 
Originally posted by JohnnyG
Believed to be good but aren't and never were:

David James...

There's tons of 'em at The Boleyn Ground:D
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Someone believed he was good? :confused:

Originally posted by memphisto
ok mate was getting worried and well I'm not going to say anything about atbx.

I'm on compiling my lists now
Click to expand...

no need to worry. He suggested them and I agreed with them all :)
 
believed

Massimo Taibi
Mark Bosnich
Seth johnson
Gilles Grimandi
Nwanko Kanu
Laurent Blanc
Nicolas Medina
Slaven Bilic
Alex Nyarko
Igor Biscan
Phil Neville


were, no longer

Joe Cole
Robbie Fowler
David batty
Ryan Giggs (On Current Form)
Michael Carrick
Teddy Sheringham
Darren Anderton


that will have to do for now
 
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