Potential PS4.5 With Better CPU+GPU ?

Psycho Sonny · 14 Nov 2015 at 14:36

malachi said:
Depends, this gen is the most expensive for console manufacturers and games development getting expensive too. So I won't be surprised if this gen last longer than the PS3/360.

lol wut?

this year is the first time manufacturers haven't made a loss on their consoles iirc.

so your completely off the mark with that one.

just let this thread die a ps4.5 is never going to happen.

krisboats · 14 Nov 2015 at 14:58

RedStarRiot said:
It's apparently on a profitable scale at the moment. The manufacturer does not usually make money on the console well into it's life span so to be making money already is a massive bonus for Sony and Microsoft.

Sony already has the most capable machine, fanboys have rejoiced over this for a while now

No it doesn't, they already have record console sales. It would be stupid to rock the boat to be honest.

That is a tiny proportion of the market. To be honest they need to cater towards the more casual gamer market than the console enthusiast.

We have always upgraded our phones on an 12 month - 18 month basis. We look forward to upgrading these. With console we have an expectation of a set life span of 5+ years. We have more or less been conditioned that way!

I think people are justified to feel uneasy if Sony were to release a PlayStation 4.5, it would be the first time a manufacturer has release an incremental upgrade and then you would be thinking about the 5 then the 5.5 etc. When would the support for the PS4 stop? when we got onto the PS5? Also, the games they are releasing right now are great looking. This will likely be the shortest console cycle this time but I'm not ready for a new console every 2 years as you usually find the best looking and performing games coming out later in the consoles life.

Think you missed most of the points there and went off on a bit of a tangent. You also didnt clarify why you are annoyed at such an idea. How is it rocking the boat? A few snotty nosed/immature players who cant handle change isnt rocking the boat. I'll reword it to make it easier for you to grasp.... If sony can make a higher spec console than the ps4 and they can make the newer console at a profitable margin, then it would make sense for them to do it. Like you said yourself, the consoles are very off the shelf as it is right now, so if they can stick a 300mhz faster cpu and quicker/more ram in there and still have a profitable machine then they would. They get to reintroduce said console and can sell it at the original price point again instead of the deflated point its at now.

Fanboys (as in people who have to have the best version of their console at all costs) will rebuy without even thinking about it. Lets face it most would have done for a slim model anyway but at least now the extra upgrade is justifiable. People new to consoles will get whichever they can afford so makes no difference if both make a profit.

I dont get why people presume a faster machine means lack of support for the original console. If i change my graphics settings on a pc game from low to high it'd be the same as a differencw between an original ps4 and a ps4.5. So long as both hit 30/60fps there'd be no competitive difference so wouldnt need segregation for online play.

Your mistake is thinking a ps4.5 would end the support for the ps4 but they would be one in the same, only one has the graphics settings on high by default where as current consoles have them on low-medium.

You said yourself you've been conditioned to have the opinion you hold. Why not break the mould and think for yourself? Its better than getting angry and annoyed, especially if you get some benefits with the changes!

Psycho Sonny · 14 Nov 2015 at 15:12

i'll say it again let the thread die.

it's never going to happen.

developers wouldn't like it for a start, neither would the gamers or retailers. parents would just buy the cheapest one as they don't have a clue and then their kids would complain they cannot play at highest settings.

also it wouldn't be as simple as flicking a switch to change between them the games are coded to run on a specific sku introduce more sku's and that takes the efficiencies out of the equation.

do they design for 1 then upscale to the other or design for the more powerful then downscale it?

what would happen with promotional videos, showcasing gameplay on s ps4.5 then someone sticks the game in their ps4 and it looks like ****?

never going to happen. stupid retarded idea which gets mentioned every console generation yet has no chance in ever happening.

you may not even see a ps4 slim never mind this.

RedStarRiot · 14 Nov 2015 at 15:14

krisboats said:
Think you missed most of the points there and went off on a bit of a tangent. You also didnt clarify why you are annoyed at such an idea. !

Why do you think I'm annoyed? I was simply responding to a few of your points in which I stand by. You have also accused other of being annoyed when they have responded to you as well. I think you are actually mental mate

Jae-So · 14 Nov 2015 at 16:32

Psycho Sonny said:
i'll say it again let the thread die.

You keep saying this, then post again, make your mind up

I'm enjoying the debate personally, interesting to see the perspectives.

RedStarRiot · 14 Nov 2015 at 16:34

Agreed, its been mostly a good discussion.

Plainsong · 14 Nov 2015 at 16:56

Also agree. RedStarRiot is getting rather annoyed though. Needs to chill out

RedStarRiot · 14 Nov 2015 at 17:46

Plainsong said:
Also agree. RedStarRiot is getting rather annoyed though. Needs to chill out

somebody hold me back :mad:

krisboats · 14 Nov 2015 at 23:46

Plainsong said:
Also agree. RedStarRiot is getting rather annoyed though. Needs to chill out

Haha, I was hoping someone would take the bait but everybody is being boring in this thread.

krisboats · 14 Nov 2015 at 23:53

Psycho Sonny said:
i'll say it again let the thread die.

it's never going to happen.

developers wouldn't like it for a start, neither would the gamers or retailers. parents would just buy the cheapest one as they don't have a clue and then their kids would complain they cannot play at highest settings.

also it wouldn't be as simple as flicking a switch to change between them the games are coded to run on a specific sku introduce more sku's and that takes the efficiencies out of the equation.

do they design for 1 then upscale to the other or design for the more powerful then downscale it?

what would happen with promotional videos, showcasing gameplay on s ps4.5 then someone sticks the game in their ps4 and it looks like ****?

never going to happen. stupid retarded idea which gets mentioned every console generation yet has no chance in ever happening.

you may not even see a ps4 slim never mind this.

Well pc games are coded to enable play on an infinitely variable amount of setups so i'm sure a developer could handle two for a console

Also, i'm not sure how much extra visual processing you think they'll get from some slight clock gains. It'd be a better draw distance and a bit more aliasing at best.... it wouldn't look like **** at all. Everyone bangs on about how much better the ps4 is but the difference in quality of multi platform titles is miniscule at best.

But yeah, lets not have people discussing things while putting it across in a well versed manner. You're the big boss of the internet... we must obey and let the thread die!!!

krisboats · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:04

RedStarRiot said:
Why do you think I'm annoyed? I was simply responding to a few of your points in which I stand by. You have also accused other of being annoyed when they have responded to you as well. I think you are actually mental mate

Maybe not annoyed in general, but opposed to the idea would fit better. The reason i mention annoyance though isn't to do with my mental state, more this.....

Jae-So said:
Hmm neve happen. It would **** too many people off.

Trick said:
I would be absolutely fuming if this were to happen.

Semiskimmed said:
Id be peeved too!

grudas said:
sony would shot it self in the foot if they did it! I'd be very very peeved.

I just don't get it. Evolution is a good thing, stagnation is bad. Having the same hardware dor so many years just doesn't happen in any other type of entertainment sector. Netflix is 4k now, how many nintendo DS things have come out? Tv's are constantly evolving, tablets, phones. All ever increasing. But consoles are stuck in the old cycle of one update per generation.

Does nobody remember the N64 RAM expansion pack that some games required and allowed playback at a higher resolution (albeit still SD). Nobody went crazy about that.

Fr0dders · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:16

krisboats said:
Does nobody remember the N64 RAM expansion pack that some games required and allowed playback at a higher resolution (albeit still SD). Nobody went crazy about that.

that's because it was an optional upgrade to your existing console, not a whole new console.

Its more like the 1tb vs 500gb PS4 console rather than a whole new PS4.5

malachi · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:26

Psycho Sonny said:
lol wut?

this year is the first time manufacturers haven't made a loss on their consoles iirc.

so your completely off the mark with that one.

Go into to game development and you know that isn't necessarily true.

Why do you think companies like Komani rather develop games for mobile and not consoles?

krisboats · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:35

Fr0dders said:
that's because it was an optional upgrade to your existing console, not a whole new console.

Its more like the 1tb vs 500gb PS4 console rather than a whole new PS4.5

Well yeah, but it was like 300 years ago!!! An upgrade back then was like fitting an extra resistor somewhere!!

Nowadays it should be a case of just swapping out a cpu with a higher clocked model (i get that i'm simplifying it massively) and whacking on higher detail shadows/lighting. Everyones saying it's going to be so much harder for development but i thought the whole idea of this generations architecture was so that pc/console ports were a lot easier on developers. The development is getting done for pc versions of a lot of games anyway so clearly the higher detail shaders/textures are already in place.

TheVoice · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:41

For an updated model to be remotely worthwhile it'd need to offer more than just slightly better shadows and lighting. If it's only going to be marginally more powerful then why even bother?

krisboats · 15 Nov 2015 at 00:43

TheVoice said:
For an updated model to be remotely worthwhile it'd need to offer more than just slightly better shadows and lighting. If it's only going to be marginally more powerful then why even bother?

And yet the internet war rages aboput precisely that minute level of detail change with the xbox/ps4 differences...

People fight tooth and nail over such little differences between graphics cards in the pc world. the 7***gfxlol can do 60fps with shaders on high instead of medium. etc etc.

Jae-So · 15 Nov 2015 at 07:15

krisboats said:
Well yeah, but it was like 300 years ago!!! An upgrade back then was like fitting an extra resistor somewhere!!

Nowadays it should be a case of just swapping out a cpu with a higher clocked model (i get that i'm simplifying it massively) and whacking on higher detail shadows/lighting. Everyones saying it's going to be so much harder for development but i thought the whole idea of this generations architecture was so that pc/console ports were a lot easier on developers. The development is getting done for pc versions of a lot of games anyway so clearly the higher detail shaders/textures are already in place.

Yeh I originally thought this would never happen but the more I read this thread the more I think hmm maybe - still unlikely I would say though. I still think you have to have enough upgrades to entice users to buy. When you buy a phone etc, the software ranges from free to £5 or so, and you have a contract to help you pay. With a console, games are pretty expensive so you expect to at least have the platform for 5 or so years. Personally I would rather have paid £400/£500 for a better spec from the beginning, but we know how that turned out for the PS3.

In relation to PC/console cross development being easier. I don't think it is that simple, otherwise Batman Arkham Knight wouldn't have been the **** it ended up being on PC.

krisboats · 15 Nov 2015 at 11:42

Jae-So said:
Yeh I originally thought this would never happen but the more I read this thread the more I think hmm maybe - still unlikely I would say though. I still think you have to have enough upgrades to entice users to buy. When you buy a phone etc, the software ranges from free to £5 or so, and you have a contract to help you pay. With a console, games are pretty expensive so you expect to at least have the platform for 5 or so years. Personally I would rather have paid £400/£500 for a better spec from the beginning, but we know how that turned out for the PS3.

In relation to PC/console cross development being easier. I don't think it is that simple, otherwise Batman Arkham Knight wouldn't have been the **** it ended up being on PC.

But the games wouldn't be different. If it was going to happen i'd imagine it being in this way...

You have the original ps4 console or you have the newer ps4.5 console with 500mhz faster clocks all round. 20% more powerful than the original.

You go to the shop and buy a new game, when you put the disc in the console it looks at which version you have and displays the appropriate level of graphical settings (predetermined by developer). Old ps4 games work on ps4.5 just as if it was a ps4. New games work on a ps4 just as if the ps4.5 never existed and new games work on the ps4.5 the same as the ps4.... but better graphics. They'd use the same disc for every console, but the ps4.5 gets what would effectively be the HD textures dlc add on for all new games. They would be the same console and the same discs. But the new console would have a slight graphical edge. No fragmentation of the game sales, no need for making the original ps4 obsolete. Both get full compatibility until the ps5 is released.

Jae-So · 15 Nov 2015 at 12:34

Yeh I suppose when you put it that way it would be fine. We all understand this concept from PC gaming though (we are a tech forum after all) but interesting to see if the average gamer sees this as a positive or a negative.

krisboats what do you reckon about the Xbox approach where they will use server side GPU/CPU power to make verso game effects better. I like it but again you have to always be connected to take advantage.

Fr0dders · 15 Nov 2015 at 16:56

krisboats said:
Well yeah, but it was like 300 years ago!!! An upgrade back then was like fitting an extra resistor somewhere!!

Nowadays it should be a case of just swapping out a cpu with a higher clocked model (i get that i'm simplifying it massively) and whacking on higher detail shadows/lighting. Everyones saying it's going to be so much harder for development but i thought the whole idea of this generations architecture was so that pc/console ports were a lot easier on developers. The development is getting done for pc versions of a lot of games anyway so clearly the higher detail shaders/textures are already in place.

the development difficulties are just different now.

Now developers are struggling to get parity in performance between the two platforms and working out what compromises each version needs.

You could easily have a modular upgradeable console but then the developers would always be making use of the newest upgrades making each one mandatory, and before you know it you've got a glorified crap PC.

The only way consoles work is if the specification stays the same so customers don't have to keep upgrading and developers know what available limits they have to work with when making the games.