Pre-season Football 2011/2012 Season

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:22

Pigeon_Killer said:
3-0 Hull

We have big problems in defence.

Thankfully of the 8 defenders used today, I'd be surprised if more than 1 feature on the opening day vs Sunderland.

Been impressed with Henderson in the opening 15 mins of the 2nd half.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:30

BaZ87 said:
Thankfully of the 8 defenders used today, I'd be surprised if more than 1 feature on the opening day vs Sunderland.

Been impressed with Henderson in the opening 15 mins of the 2nd half.

Yeah its part of why I rarely put any weight on preseason friendlies. I mean Poulsen scored the other day but it mattered not because he is never going to get a game in the actual season.

Having said that, I have been saying for a while now that I'd like to see us sign another CB (I'd be happy with Dann) so I still say thats needed and it can never harm to have some nice striking backup

Pigeon_Killer · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:34

BaZ87 said:
Thankfully of the 8 defenders used today, I'd be surprised if more than 1 feature on the opening day vs Sunderland.

Was talking more about our overall situation in defence. Agger's always injured, Carragher's getting on, Wilson looks terrible, the Greek isn't good enough to be a first team player and I don't know where Skrtel is. Really need another reliable CB before the season starts unless we're going to try Kelly in the centre.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:40

Pigeon_Killer said:
Was talking more about our overall situation in defence. Agger's always injured, Carragher's getting on, Wilson looks terrible, the Greek isn't good enough to be a first team player and I don't know where Skrtel is. Really need another reliable CB before the season starts unless we're going to try Kelly in the centre.

Did Wilson go out on season loan in the end? I remember reading a couple of weeks ago that we were going to send him out on season loan back to scotland.

I think Skrtel is off having a tattoo done at the moment.

I do think we need a LB and a CB (preferably a long term replacement for Carragher, who I'd like to see move onto the staff as a coach sooner rather than later), needing 2 more defenders out of 4 is somewhat of a kerfuffle I think.

drunkenmaster · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:42

Did Joe cole start upfront, any good or completely rubbish?

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:46

Pigeon_Killer said:
Was talking more about our overall situation in defence. Agger's always injured, Carragher's getting on, Wilson looks terrible, the Greek isn't good enough to be a first team player and I don't know where Skrtel is. Really need another reliable CB before the season starts unless we're going to try Kelly in the centre.

Agree that we need another CB however I get the impression that the club don't want to sign somebody that just bolsters the squad; it's got to be somebody that is either a noticeable improvement on Agger/Carra/Skrtel or somebody that's a big prospect for the future but can also do a job now.

I wouldn't be surprised if somebody like Scott Dann is seen as a fall back option if we can't sign somebody better.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:51

BaZ87 said:
Agree that we need another CB however I get the impression that the club don't want to sign somebody that just bolsters the squad; it's got to be somebody that is either a noticeable improvement on Agger/Carra/Skrtel or somebody that's a big prospect for the future but can also do a job now.

I wouldn't be surprised if somebody like Scott Dann is seen as a fall back option if we can't sign somebody better.

I'd be happy with that, I recall at the end of last season saying that Dann should be a summer target for us. Young (for a defender), good degree of first team experience, good performances, should be priced reasonably given Birminghams relegation and a lifelong Liverpool supporter (a proper one, not a Keane one

) so should give his all for the club.

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:55

I think Dann's a decent player but I wouldn't say he was a great deal (if at all) better than any of Agger, Carra or Skrtel and while he's still fairly young, I can't see him improving a great deal more. As I said, I get the feeling the club would rather spend £15m on somebody that would be an improvement on what we have than spend £8-10m on somebody like Dann.

As for your question about Wilson above; there was talk that he might go back to Rangers but nothing (yet) has come of it. He played the 2nd half today.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 16:59

BaZ87 said:
I think Dann's a decent player but I wouldn't say he was a great deal (if at all) better than any of Agger, Carra or Skrtel and while he's still fairly young, I can't see him improving a great deal more. As I said, I get the feeling the club would rather spend £15m on somebody that would be an improvement on what we have than spend £8-10m on somebody like Dann.

As for your question about Wilson above; there was talk that he might go back to Rangers but nothing (yet) has come of it. He played the 2nd half today.

I could actually see Dann improving quite a bit under our coaching rather than Birminghams. I already consider Dann to be at least the equal of Skrtel and with Carra's age effects increasing each month I dont think it would be too long before Dann is passing Carra for effectiveness. Most of all, I think Dann would be available and easy and quick to sign, something that might not be the case with the £15m player thats already the finished article. I'm not even sure who else would be a feasible target at this point.

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:08

Your comparision of Dann to Skrtel/Carra just goes to show that he'd be a squad player that's competing for a first team spot. And being quick and easy to sign shouldn't be a priority to us. We need to look to sign the best possible signing for the long term. If we can't sign whoever that player might be then we should move for somebody like Dann.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:12

BaZ87 said:
Your comparision of Dann to Skrtel/Carra just goes to show that he'd be a squad player that's competing for a first team spot. And being quick and easy to sign shouldn't be a priority to us. We need to look to sign the best possible signing for the long term. If we can't sign whoever that player might be then we should move for somebody like Dann.

Thats all I would expect of Dann this year if we signed him, next year I'd expect him to be a first team player rather than a squad player. For the long term, we'd need a young defender, preferably one thats proven his worth in the league already, would be a good team player and is available and wants to join us. Dann imo fits all of those factors and as I say, I cant think of all that many other defenders who do.

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:22

Tombstone said:
Thats all I would expect of Dann this year if we signed him, next year I'd expect him to be a first team player rather than a squad player. For the long term, we'd need a young defender, preferably one thats proven his worth in the league already, would be a good team player and is available and wants to join us. Dann imo fits all of those factors and as I say, I cant think of all that many other defenders who do.

But would Dann become first choice because he's developed into a top CB or because Carra's aged and Agger's injured?

Unless the club feel he's capable of going on and becoming a better CB than what the likes of Skrtel and Agger are now, he shouldn't be our priority target this summer.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:29

BaZ87 said:
But would Dann become first choice because he's developed into a top CB or because Carra's aged and Agger's injured?

Unless the club feel he's capable of going on and becoming a better CB than what the likes of Skrtel and Agger are now, he shouldn't be our priority target this summer.

Well my personal opinion (not that it matters of course as I'm not making the buying decisions

) , is that Dann would develop into a top CB.

I'd happily take someone else if I thought there was someone else out there who filled the list of things I mentioned above, but I cant think of anyone who does and ultimately I think we need another CB and would rather get one than not get one. If there is someone else out there who fits what I deem to be the requirements then thats fine, its just I cant think of anyone

BaZ87 · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:34

I'm sure we'll sign another CB one way or another, I just get the feeling the club see Dann as back up if they can't sign somebody that is more likely to command a first team spot from day 1.

edit: and maybe we should take this to the transfer thread. We've nearly taken this thread as off topic as that thread has.

Tombstone · 23 Jul 2011 at 17:37

BaZ87 said:
I'm sure we'll sign another CB one way or another, I just get the feeling the club see Dann as back up if they can't sign somebody that is more likely to command a first team spot from day 1.

I cant see who we could feasibly sign who would command a first team spot from day 1. Wish I could.

EDIT : whoops, you're quite right

footman · 23 Jul 2011 at 19:17

Brentford vs Stoke

Last night in our first real pre-season match against league opposition we beat Stoke 1-0.
http://www.brentfordfc.co.uk/page/LatestNews/0,,10421~2399715,00.html

It wasn't as if they put out a weak side, apparently much the same side as they intend to put out against Hajduk Split in the Europa League 3rd round.

Can't say I've enjoyed Brentford play as well as this in all the years I've been going. I actually put some money on them today, 25-1 automatic promotion, 8-1 promotion through play-offs.

Tom84 · 23 Jul 2011 at 22:02

Any United fans got a stream for tonight's game?

Shamikebab · 23 Jul 2011 at 22:08

Obertan and Welbeck on the wings :/

stoke1863 · 23 Jul 2011 at 22:10

yay we lost to both Brentford and Aldershot town in two days

while our Europa cup opposition played Barcelona and drew 0-0

pre season means nothing we didnt win one game last season.

syke · 23 Jul 2011 at 22:12

Shamikebab said:
Obertan and Welbeck on the wings :/

Diouf on the left, Welbeck up front. Pitch looks a bit shoddy :/