Questions on racism

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:27

Kronologic said:
Umm yes he does and he did not get "roasted" for the word ******, he got "roasted" for all the other words around the word ******.
IIRC he made 2 raps which were construed as minorly racist and when they appeared in the public domain he immediately apologized.

In fact going further they were only released into the public domain as an attempt to discredit him by the vindictive source editor Benzino<sp?>. The Hip-hop community by in large sided with eminem as they are well aware that he is not a racist person. But that is completely off topic.

Quote me his lyrics then, right now, of Eminem using the word ****** over and over in his music. Should be easy to find, and it will revoke what I said.

cleanbluesky · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:27

Depth said:
No, I wouldn't find it cool at all, so it's a stupid question. I have never referred to any of my family of friends as ******.

Then why did you say you wouldn't care if a polynesian called you a ******?

You said:
Im from Samoa, and if you casually called me an "island ******" I would not find it amusing at all. I couldn't care less if another Polynesian said it though, because they are the same ethnicity as I am, thus it cannot be offensive.

So which is it?

You want me to post a pic to see if Im a ****** or not?

No. I don't care. You asked me if I thought you were a ****** and I said I can't tell unless you post a picture.

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:29

cleanbluesky said:
Then why did you say you wouldn't care if a polynesian called you a ******?

So which is it?

No. I don't care. You asked me if I thought you were a ****** and I said I can't tell unless you post a picture.

I wouldn't care. They can't insult my race, because they are of the same race as me. It would just be a stupid, pointless thing to say. Im not white, so a white person referring to me like that is different, and I would find insulting and offensive.

Manlove is my forte · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:29

Depth said:
Quote me his lyrics then, right now, of Eminem using the word ****** over and over in his music. Should be easy to find, and it will revoke what I said.

I'm going home from work in 10 min, but when I get home Bam!! your getting some White ****** quotes!

cleanbluesky · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:30

Depth said:
I wouldn't care, it would just be a stupid, pointless thing to say. Im not white, so a white person referring to me like that, I would find insulting and offensive.

You said:
No, I wouldn't find it cool at all, so it's a stupid question. I have never referred to any of my family of friends as ******.

Runbalk · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:31

cleanbluesky said:
Insults tend to sting more when the person feels insecure about it.

For example, I wouldn't care if you called me a ****** - regardless of whether you were polynesian or not.

But being a ****** isn't just being black is it? I thought the word referred to black people as "sub-human," which we know isn't true.

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:31

cleanbluesky said:

What are you confused about? I don't like the term at all, but if a polynesian said it to me, I wouldn't find it insulting, where as if a white person did I would.

So because I don't find something insulting, I would think it's cool? If you mean "am I cool with it" then thats different, as it wouldn't really bother me, I just think it's pointless. But if you mean do I find it a "cool" thing to say, then not at all.

firewallblocked · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:33

I think sometimes things like this are made worse when some idiot jumps up screaming out this word was said, almost waving a big banner saying emily used this word plastering it all over the papers and in the news so if you did miss it they want to make sure you get to hear it.

It feels very much like going up to a disabled person perhaps using a atm and screaming at the top of your voice "This person is disabled, they can't walk and this atm isn't easy for them to use!" A disabled person would know this if this was the case and doesn't need you to point it out as if they are stupid or unable to help themselves. It would be patronsing and the one thing any disabled person will tell you is they don't want your sympathy.

I still think it was right to remove emily, but how the media circus will whip it up into a frenzy may cause more offence and racism on both sides. If she had said you a stupid ***** that would have course be very different. Context is everything when applied to language.

The very fact that a white person using the n word in any context is offensive also shows some people still see a difference between black and white and you have to be very careful not to create racism. Take for example all the media coverage about immigrants getting free nhs, cars, or housing and UK citizens having to wait, this doesn't help and only breeds dislike for immigrants with a different culture.

cleanbluesky · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:34

Depth said:
What are you confused about? I don't like the term at all, put if a polynesian said it to me, I wouldn't find it insulting, where as if a white person did I would.

So because I don't find something insulting, I would think it's cool?

So why isn't it cool for a polynesian to call you an island ****** yet simultanously you wouldn't care?

How can you do that?

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:35

cleanbluesky said:
So why isn't it cool for a polynesian to call you an island ****** yet simultanously you wouldn't care?

How can you do that?

Pretty easily mate, it just wouldn't get under my skin as it's not insulting, just stupid. I don't want to be called it by anyone, but a guy of my ehnicity saying it can't be used as a racial insult to me, were as from the mouth of a white person, it is.

Is that so hard for you to understand?

cleanbluesky · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:36

Depth said:
Pretty easily mate. I don't want to be called it by anyone, but a guy of my ehnicity saying it can't be used as a racial insult to me, were as from the mouth of a white person, it is.

Insult is in the intent, not skin colour.

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:38

cleanbluesky said:
Insult is in the intent, not skin colour.

Go and refer to a group of young black men in a friendly manner then as ******, and see how they feel about it.

After all, you would have no intent to insult them, so there skin colour wouldn't matter.

I wouldn't refer to a white person as "cracker", as Im not white, and it is a racial slur.

Runbalk · 7 Jun 2007 at 16:39

Depth said:
Pretty easily mate, it just wouldn't get under my skin as it's not insulting, just stupid. I don't want to be called it by anyone, but a guy of my ehnicity saying it can't be used as a racial insult to me, were as from the mouth of a white person, it is.

Is that so hard for you to understand?

The problem is that THAT isn't always the case. It's not as black and white as that (no pun intended).

the-void · 7 Jun 2007 at 17:35

Depth said:
Go and refer to a group of young black men in a friendly manner then as ******, and see how they feel about it.

I can assure you if did the same to my friends and they didn't know you then you would get a beating. Regardless of how friendly you were or even if you were black yourself.

You cannot say they won't be offended just because another black person said it to them. All black people are not the same you know.

Runbalk · 7 Jun 2007 at 17:37

the-void said:
I can assure you if did the same to my friends and they didn't know you then you would get a beating. Regardless of how friendly you were or even if you were black yourself.

That was exactly his point...

the-void · 7 Jun 2007 at 17:44

Runbalk said:
That was exactly his point...

No, it wasn't. He was saying it isn't racist if it was a black person saying it to another black person. He said it is only racist is a white person said it.

Personally I find that last comment itself racist.

As surely it is equally as racist for a Chinese or a Middle Eastern person to say that word to a black person, and not just because a white person said it.

I also know that Africa is made of many different countries. Some of those countries don't get on with each other. Some are even at war with each other. So I imagine that a black person calling another black person from a different country then his own a ****** is equally as racist. Is he not?

So the excuse that its ok for black people to say that word in front of other black people is just a myth surely. :confused:

Millwall.FC · 7 Jun 2007 at 17:57

one rule for racism.

only white poeple can be racist. FACT.

Runbalk · 7 Jun 2007 at 17:59

the-void said:
No, it wasn't. He was saying it isn't racist if it was a black person saying it to another black person. He said it is only racist is a white person said it.

You're right, he did make that point - but you quoted a completely different point that he made:

Depth said:
Go and refer to a group of young black men in a friendly manner then as ******, and see how they feel about it.

His point HERE was that if you did what he said above, those people would feel insulted. Then you responded with the exact same point, as if he said otherwise:

the-void said:
I can assure you if did the same to my friends and they didn't know you then you would get a beating. Regardless of how friendly you were or even if you were black yourself.

Depth · 7 Jun 2007 at 18:08

the-void said:
No, it wasn't. He was saying it isn't racist if it was a black person saying it to another black person. He said it is only racist is a white person said it.

Personally I find that last comment itself racist.

As surely it is equally as racist for a Chinese or a Middle Eastern person to say that word to a black person, and not just because a white person said it.

I also know that Africa is made of many different countries. Some of those countries don't get on with each other. Some are even at war with each other. So I imagine that a black person calling another black person from a different country then his own a ****** is equally as racist. Is he not?

So the excuse that its ok for black people to say that word in front of other black people is just a myth surely.

It's not racist to say ******, if you are black yourself. How can you be racist, to your own race? Of course if one black man approached another black man by calling him a ******, he might get a beating, but certainly not because the second guy felt he was being insulted because of his race.

And yep, it is equally as bad if any non black person says the word, it's not magically worse because white people say it. You shouldn't use racial slurs at all, why is there a need to? As I said, I wouldn't find it acceptable for me to call my white friends cracker or honky etc

SexyGreyFox · 7 Jun 2007 at 18:50

the-void said:
Speaking from someone who is certainly not racist

You lost my interest right there.