Radeon VII

[Panos]

No this is the same mistake panos made, and remained quiet and pretended to let it go un-noticed. It's not a rebadged instinct card.
V7 has it's own pcb, different voltage regulation and had to put back on the display I/o.
Aswell as the pcb design cooler and shroud.

Panos was trying claim they are all the same card, and it would be a $50 loss .
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/32458007/

16GB HBM alone cost $320 for AMD to buy. That's almost half the price of the card.

https://www.fudzilla.com/news/graphics/48020-radeon-vii-production-cost-650

And in the future when you want someone to reply, please quote their with @ in front

On you reply your other post. The package is tested. HBM+GPU+Interposer.
If some of it cannot go to MI60/MI50 due to error, AMD has something to do with it or throw it into the bin. As it cannot remove the parts and re-purpose them. Especially the expensive HBM.

Add also the $150 worth of games attached to it, which lets say AMD buys for $50 in total all 3, you will see that they might break even at $699 over BOM. Let alone marketing etc costs on top.

 

[DarrenM343]

I'm sure they weren't intending to release it as it wouldn't have been economically viable.
Then they saw the pricing of RTX cards.
A card with 16gb of hbm2 shouldn't be able to compete with a card with 8gb of ddr6, but that's all down to Nvidia's short-sighted and greedy price strategy.

Depends how you look at it. 16GB of expensive ram I'd expect to be much faster than a 2080. Also cannot forget there's no RT/dedicated RT cores or DLSS. The latter is going to give a 2080 a 25% boost in performance, when EVER it gets used .
Will be interesting to see the price. It won't be cheap. Anywhere around £700 and it's for the AMD fans mostly I think, although will reserve opion until it's released .

I'm looking forward to their new CPU's more. I still don't think they're competitive with Nvidia. Imagine what NV would do on 7nm, apart from double the price . Next gen AMD CPU is on my shopping list anyway.

 

[Gerard]

16GB HBM alone cost $320 for AMD to buy. That's almost half the price of the card.

https://www.fudzilla.com/news/graphics/48020-radeon-vii-production-cost-650

Doubtful, they're guesstimates as always. AMD will be buying this ram in large quantities so its not likely to be near the price they're quoting.

 

[Vince]

Depends how you look at it. 16GB of expensive ram I'd expect to be much faster than a 2080. Also cannot forget there's no RT/dedicated RT cores or DLSS. The latter is going to give a 2080 a 25% boost in performance, when EVER it gets used .
Will be interesting to see the price. It won't be cheap. Anywhere around £700 and it's for the AMD fans mostly I think, although will reserve opion until it's released .

I'm looking forward to their new CPU's more. I still don't think they're competitive with Nvidia. Imagine what NV would do on 7nm, apart from double the price . Next gen AMD CPU is on my shopping list anyway.

I'm not sure, if you can do something to unleash the compute power that the MI50 possess then these could be very sort after by professionals looking for an MI50 alternative. I looked for MI50 pricing and couldn't see it anywhere so by that I am guessing that the card is either hard to come by or very expensive. If you could flash this thing to MI50 then you might even see these in the hands of people with no intention of gaming on them. Ill be buying one for a mix of gaming and compute.

 

[LePhuronn]

Also cannot forget there's no RT/dedicated RT cores or DLSS. The latter is going to give a 2080 a 25% boost in performance, when EVER it gets used .

By the time it gets used we'll have either a Big Navi or Arcturus from AMD and Nvidia will have moved to 2nd generation RTX on 7nm; whatever potential the current RTX cards has is just a non factor for me.

 

[Scougar]

Yup. Rt stuff is proof of concept and no real worthwhile usage right now.

 

[Davedree]

16GB HBM alone cost $320 for AMD to buy. That's almost half the price of the card.

https://www.fudzilla.com/news/graphics/48020-radeon-vii-production-cost-650

And in the future when you want someone to reply, please quote their with @ in front

On you reply your other post. The package is tested. HBM+GPU+Interposer.
If some of it cannot go to MI60/MI50 due to error, AMD has something to do with it or throw it into the bin. As it cannot remove the parts and re-purpose them. Especially the expensive HBM.

Add also the $150 worth of games attached to it, which lets say AMD buys for $50 in total all 3, you will see that they might break even at $699 over BOM. Let alone marketing etc costs on top.

When you click quote it's the same, you still get an alert,
In my post https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/32458007/ you said this

''AMD. It costs around $750 to make the RVII, MI50, MI60. As they are all the same card.
And failed MI50 & MI60 becoming RVII at $699.

So for AMD is a win, because doesn't have to throw to the bin $750 but $50 on the loss accounts.
Or $100 if we add the games it is coming with. (which they will buy licences with huge discount).
''​

​

That's where I disagreed, they are not all the same card, the Pcb is totally different for V7 to the instinct.
V7 Pcb,

Instinct Pcb

Secondly the Mi60 is paired with 32gb, and you can't disable 2 hbm modules to get down to 16gb or you would lose half the bandwidth of the memory controller.

It means V7 is only Mi50 based 50, and unless there's some further logic in the chip that has errors like ability for Fp64 etc. then I'd say it's more a case of that's the only viable way to spin off 2 production lines and keep costs down. There's no way Amd would give away a 32gb V7 and so they won't salvage the MI60 32gb package into a V7 if the Mi60 has defective cu's.
If you add the cost of the r&d for the cooler, heatsink, shroud, custom pcb with display I/O traces, it starts getting expensive for a very niche sidelined card.
I don't see how the games will offset the manufacturing costs of V7, I think you are spinning it on the basis of value for the buyer. But then I don't know Amd's BOM and construction costs.

 

[Stephanie Peterson]

I wonder why they are doing this...
I mean, it doesnt matter if they are playing at the high end at the moment, most folk buy nvidias PR nonsense and go green... heck i did but then the 1080ti was the fastest card at the time.
They are doing great in the low to mid to lower high end with there current stuff, i just dont get it.
Pipecleaner for 7nm... doubt it.
Reclaimed cores .. could be.


Unless they saw nvidia really had hit a big pothole with RTX and decided they needed to keep at least a token showing at the top end, bit like intels laughable 28 core fusion reactor.

 

[Nasher]

I don't think ray-tracing in games is really going to go anywhere until there is an open source and software driven alternative.

Exclusive, hardware accelerated things never last. As we're seeing with gsync and previously physx, 3d vision.

 

[D.P.]

I don't think ray-tracing in games is really going to go anywhere until there is an open source and software driven alternative.

Exclusive, hardware accelerated things never last. As we're seeing with gsync and previously physx, 3d vision.

Ahh,
There is open source support in Vulan and industry standard support in DX.

Nvidia language a proprietary RT standard. They support the Microsoft DX standard. This standard doesn't require any specific hardware.

Nothing stops AMD writing a software driver for DXR. They already have have code in place with Radeon Rays.


The only reason AMD don't support DCR is precisely because they do t have hardware support so would be 20-50x slower than Turing.

Requiring hardware is irrelevant. Is DX11 dead because it requires hardware to be be accelerated?

 

[Illuminist]

When you click quote it's the same, you still get an alert,
In my post https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/32458007/ you said this

​

That's where I disagreed, they are not all the same card, the Pcb is totally different for V7 to the instinct.
V7 Pcb,

Instinct Pcb

Secondly the Mi60 is paired with 32gb, and you can't disable 2 hbm modules to get down to 16gb or you would lose half the bandwidth of the memory controller.

It means V7 is only Mi50 based 50, and unless there's some further logic in the chip that has errors like ability for Fp64 etc. then I'd say it's more a case of that's the only viable way to spin off 2 production lines and keep costs down. There's no way Amd would give away a 32gb V7 and so they won't salvage the MI60 32gb package into a V7 if the Mi60 has defective cu's.
If you add the cost of the r&d for the cooler, heatsink, shroud, custom pcb with display I/O traces, it starts getting expensive for a very niche sidelined card.
I don't see how the games will offset the manufacturing costs of V7, I think you are spinning it on the basis of value for the buyer. But then I don't know Amd's BOM and construction costs.

I'm going to do that thing that they did with the Zen 2 picture and point out that there is a gap here ! lol




Infinty woven Vega 2 Duo ? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[Illuminist]

Also It looks similar enough to the reference 64, i.e everything is in the exact same place as the 64 PCB that the water blocks might fit, maybe.. maybe.

 

[willhub]

I'm going to do that thing that they did with the Zen 2 picture and point out that there is a gap here ! lol




Infinty woven Vega 2 Duo ? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

That's clearly not a gap and the same looking die as the comparison shows except one has a logo on it.

 

[Illuminist]

That's clearly not a gap and the same looking die as the comparison shows except one has a logo on it.

Oh cmon man, let me have my fun, it was a joke

 

[nashathedog]

Do AMD still lock the free games into your account or can they be sold on ?

You can sell them on

If it is like far cry 5, you need to have a graphic card running the offer when you register the code.
So RX500s and Vega only.

Far Cry 5 wasn't AMD was it?

 

[nashathedog]

They were making the cores but not with that type of heatsink and shroud assembly. And the story wccftech posted about the guy in question is at odds with other stories that say he simply retired. That site posts more bs than facts, i'm surprised anyone bothers to post their news anymore as its always treated with a raised eyebrow.

The saddest bit is how people like that actually use fake news and more than likely stuff they've made up themselves to get a leg up in the industry & make a living out of it.

 

[Panos]

You can sell them on



Far Cry 5 wasn't AMD was it?

What you mean?

 

[MyBrainz]

You can sell them on

I used to see keys for Steam, now i see this..



Luckily i saved the Steam codes to notepad which i havnt activated yet so i'm not sure if the keys i have will still work, i assume they will but it looks like they're not giving out codes anymore by looking at this.

 

[nashathedog]

When you click quote it's the same, you still get an alert,
In my post https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/32458007/ you said this

​

That's where I disagreed, they are not all the same card, the Pcb is totally different for V7 to the instinct.
V7 Pcb,

Secondly the Mi60 is paired with 32gb, and you can't disable 2 hbm modules to get down to 16gb or you would lose half the bandwidth of the memory controller.

It means V7 is only Mi50 based 50, and unless there's some further logic in the chip that has errors like ability for Fp64 etc. then I'd say it's more a case of that's the only viable way to spin off 2 production lines and keep costs down. There's no way Amd would give away a 32gb V7 and so they won't salvage the MI60 32gb package into a V7 if the Mi60 has defective cu's.
If you add the cost of the r&d for the cooler, heatsink, shroud, custom pcb with display I/O traces, it starts getting expensive for a very niche sidelined card.
I don't see how the games will offset the manufacturing costs of V7, I think you are spinning it on the basis of value for the buyer. But then I don't know Amd's BOM and construction costs.

I think his point was that you shouldn't call him out in that way when you're also making assumptions, you said it like you corrected him & he purposely ignored your correction, which yes does happen on this forum but it's besides the point. Unless I'm also mistaking what he thinks he was talking about the core & HBM package used for the VII being repurposed from the Instinct range (MI50), Not that they had the same pcb & the only thing changed was the heatsink & shroud.

As for how & when the cores are tested & spilt between the MI60 & MI50, To me it looks like the core is tested before the memory is added, If it wasn't they'd have to have a lot of failed cores with 32gb's of HBM on them which doesn't make sense to me due to the costs so maybe they do test & split the cores into two piles before adding the HBM, one pile for MI60 & the other pile for MI50, then they add the memory and maybe at that point they test the MI50's again (or don't) and divert some of them to the VII range.

@Panos I don't like making presumptions so correct me where I'm wrong.

 

[nashathedog]

I used to see keys for Steam, now i see this..



Luckily i saved the Steam codes to notepad which i havent activated yet so i'm not sure if the keys i have will still work, i assume they will but it looks like they're not giving out codes anymore by looking at this.

That's definitely new, I had the same games package which gave me codes for them and something similar to what you're seeing here for the third game Assassins Creed Oddessey that had to be redeemed on Uplay.

Can you still give the rewards account to someone else? That's how I sold the Assassins Creed game. It was simple enough just give the password for that rewards account to someone and you change the email account it's attatched to to there's then they just sign in with the password you gave them and follow the redeem instructions from there.