Road Cycling

Berger · 13 Mar 2015 at 09:52

Rode like crap today, oh well.

Going to try and get an easy 100 in tomorrow and race Sunday, sure the legs will come good again!

topgun06 · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:07

FrenchTart said:
As you say, a good portion of it is down to shiny gadget desires. I could get by with a lot less than I currently have or plan to buy this year but as this is my major hobby outside of cooking and I don't have any mortgage/child responsibilities...why not?

Entirely up to you. If you can afford it, they hey, why not?

I'm careful when it comes to money. Always try to get the best deals, will only buy if I need it, weigh up the pros and cons, do all the research etc. But I do find that my heart has more influence when it comes to bikes.

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:08

daveski said:
Hiring one is £99 for 3 months and comes with a wheel...

Just sayin'

I didn't realise it came with a wheel. That's a bit more tempting.

The 4iiii will hopefully come in at £300 or less to own a meter though.

I'm not going to be looking to purchase or spend money on power-related stuff for a couple of months either way though as my bike build will be eating up my spare income in April and possibly May.

edit: Looking at the hire site that was linked to earlier the options for disc bikes seem kind of limited - unless I'm missing something?

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:10

topgun06 said:
Entirely up to you. If you can afford it, they hey, why not?

I'm careful when it comes to money. Always try to get the best deals, will only buy if I need it, weigh up the pros and cons, do all the research etc. But I do find that my heart has more influence when it comes to bikes.

I'm more spendthrift than I should be but generally speaking I will research things to make sure I'm getting value for money. I would never have considered purchasing a power meter until the new generation of cheaper meters were announced (and also before I got to a decent level of fitness, which I'm approaching now).

touch · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:16

Are there no local gyms with wattbikes? Surely the velodrome has some?

SDK^ · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:18

tedmaul said:
I think unless you're racing it's probably a waste of money for most people. You'd see similar improvement in general cycling by creating a structured training plan and just following it on the road based on perceived effort or heart rate zones.

Heart Rate is too slow to react - usually 5mins+ before it's indicating a significant change in effort. A power meter tells you what you are putting to the pedals at that moment - it's the perfect pacing tool.
I've tried pacing based on perceived effort, HR, cadence etc and it's difficult to do it whilst out on the ride against your own FTP and power zones. So you end up going too hard and burning out before the end of the segment or ride.

A PM also really helps when going into strong headwinds; you will be going going slow but you can see that you are maintaining 'x' percentage of FTP.

Instead of upgrading to a Carbon Frame I got a PM, as I see it'll provide more real world benefits. Now I have it, it's the best cycling decision I ever made.

Saytan · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:18

I get involved in all kinds of cycling discussions on all kinds of forums, this one has the highest pro-rata interest in power meters, bar one where virtually everyone races

the intersection of geeks and cycling I guess

tedmaul · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:25

topgun06 said:
Entirely up to you. If you can afford it, they hey, why not?

I'm careful when it comes to money. Always try to get the best deals, will only buy if I need it, weigh up the pros and cons, do all the research etc. But I do find that my heart has more influence when it comes to bikes.

It's true. As much as i love my 'good' bike, my performance is not hugely different from that to the winter bike. There's not a huge amount of extra kudos for finishing second last rather than last. Or a slow 10 mile TT time and an extra slow 10 mile TT time.

But i do enjoy riding it that bit more regardless.

What i would say though is that most of the guys i know that are racing are not using power meters. They just ride a lot and work bloody hard to get their fitness to that level. The difference fancy equipment makes is marginal for the most part.

SDK^ said:
Heart Rate is too slow to react - usually 5mins+ before it's indicating a significant change in effort. A power meter tells you what you are putting to the pedals at that moment - it's the perfect pacing tool.
I've tried pacing based on perceived effort, HR, cadence etc and it's difficult to do it whilst out on the ride against your own FTP and power zones. So you end up going too hard and burning out before the end of the segment or ride.

A PM also really helps when going into strong headwinds; you will be going going slow but you can see that you are maintaining 'x' percentage of FTP.

Instead of upgrading to a Carbon Frame I got a PM, as I see it'll provide more real world benefits. Now I have it, it's the best cycling decision I ever made.

I get all that. I understand how they work and the areas they can help with.

But i still think for most folk racing at this level, it's just hard work that's making the difference. And if you're not racing at all, it's just a toy.

People love their toys and it's whatever makes each person happy - i don't care what people spend their money on really. I may well buy one myself at some point, who knows. But it's not going to give me the fitness to race. That just takes loads of hours and loads of hard work, however you're gauging your effort. You could argue that you could gauge it in a marginally more consistent fashion using a PM - sure, that's probably right. But for most of us, at the level we're riding, it is just that - marginal.

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:25

touch said:
Are there no local gyms with wattbikes? Surely the velodrome has some?

It does and the Wheelers run regular sessions in there but I'm not so desperate to get an accurate figure that I feel the need to replace my Trainer Road + Kurt Kinetic Road Machine + Virtual Power just yet. If I was desperate to know right now I'd just go out and pick up an InRide (or borrow my friend's).

touch · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:28

FrenchTart said:
It does and the Wheelers run regular sessions in there but I'm not so desperate to get an accurate figure that I feel the need to replace my Trainer Road + Kurt Kinetic Road Machine + Virtual Power just yet. If I was desperate to know right now I'd just go out and pick up an InRide (or borrow my friend's).

Oh, ok. I thought you just wanted a one-off FTP test rather than replacing your TR training plan.

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:29

Saytan said:
I get involved in all kinds of cycling discussions on all kinds of forums, this one has the highest pro-rata interest in power meters, bar one where virtually everyone races

the intersection of geeks and cycling I guess

I think you've probably hit the nail on the head here

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:31

touch said:
Oh, ok. I thought you just wanted a one-off FTP test rather than replacing your TR training plan.

Ah, I can see how some of my posts earlier gave that impression

I would like to do a one-off "proper" FTP test with a power meter I know is accurate to get an idea of how far off my current TR FTP is compared to real life but I'd also like to get a power meter that I can use on my bike to play with riding to power when I'm out and about. My patience for sitting on the turbo is already wearing thin and once we hit longer days and nicer weather I'm almost certainly going to be outside more. I guess that'll be good in terms of more miles again (and hopefully more hills than last year) so in terms of training it may not matter that much but in terms of my geekery and looking at numbers, it will

Jonny ///M · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:42

How does that 4iiii compare to the likes of the stages and powertap?

I can't see how it can be as accurate if it's just strapped to the crank arm.

For £500ish I'd get a stages and second in line would be a powertap. Seen quite a few powertaps needing serviced a lot and torque tube? replaced, also they don't seem to like the wet.

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:47

Jonny ///M said:
How does that 4iiii compare to the likes of the stages and powertap?

I can't see how it can be as accurate if it's just strapped to the crank arm.

For £500ish I'd get a stages and second in line would be a powertap. Seen quite a few powertaps needing serviced a lot and torque tube? replaced, also they don't seem to like the wet.

DC Rainmaker has covered it a little and it sounds like it's quite decent:

http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2014/09/4iiiis-introduces-precision.html

http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2015/01/update-4iiii-precision.html

If it turns out that the UK price is closer to £500 then it will kind of defy the point of what the 4iiii is meant to be (for me at least). If that happens I'll definitely reconsider it as an option.

It's also too early to say whether or not it'll be a decent choice even if the price is right really - but I'm hoping that by half way through the year we'll have more info on that.

tedmaul · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:51

If it's around the £300 mark it's worth a punt probably. Much more than that though and personally i'd wait and let others do some real world testing on it before parting with the cash.

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:54

Agreed. As above, the timing should hopefully work out quite well for me and there are also a few other cheap power meters on the horizon so I guess we'll see what happens. Worst case I'll just end up getting a more expensive tried-and-tested technology further down the line.

tedmaul · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:56

FrenchTart said:
Agreed. As above, the timing should hopefully work out quite well for me and there are also a few other cheap power meters on the horizon so I guess we'll see what happens. Worst case I'll just end up getting a more expensive tried-and-tested technology further down the line.

I've never really looked, but do you see many of them come up as second hand sales? Could be worth it for a stages or powertap initially. Then just sell on at a slight loss if it doesn't turn out as useful as you'd hoped.

platypus · 13 Mar 2015 at 10:58

Saytan said:
I get involved in all kinds of cycling discussions on all kinds of forums, this one has the highest pro-rata interest in power meters, bar one where virtually everyone races

the intersection of geeks and cycling I guess

I'm guilty of purchasing gadgets I don't really need. I spent ages scientifically analysing my running until my accident, then when I returned to running did away with all the analysis (other than a casual look at garmin connect) and enjoyed running loads more and also improved.

Would a power meter make me a better cyclist? Probably not really, I'd gain loads more from finally joining a club, but whilst I do probably higher than average annual mileage I just never got round to it/am not sure about it.

Still, power meter = shiny and lots of numbers!

FrenchTart · 13 Mar 2015 at 11:01

tedmaul said:
I've never really looked, but do you see many of them come up as second hand sales? Could be worth it for a stages or powertap initially. Then just sell on at a slight loss if it doesn't turn out as useful as you'd hoped.

That could be a good idea actually yeah. I know a few people have picked them up secondhand for reasonable prices.

I guess I'll see what the situation is in May/June/July. I may have had my decision made for me by then anyhow

Asprilla · 13 Mar 2015 at 11:09

I paid around £250 for my powertap, which is an older model that has been upgraded to G3.

Unfortunately I think it's now borked. I used it last weekend for the first time since September and it calibrated at 665 when it should be no more than 512. Average power for the ride was reported at 750w.

That's a smidgin more than I was expecting.

I've changed the battery and now it won't even sync with my Garmin although it is detected by my PC via USB.

I need to send it to Palligap next week but if it needs new strain gauges then it won't be economically repairable (about £350).