Rugby union?

That game felt more like New Zealand messing up opportunities than England winning. If that makes sense.

You can tell we have a very inexperienced attack coach, as there seems to be no attacking…

Borthwick needs to loose two more games and he’ll be on less than 50 % win rate..

If we are getting hammered in the international space, god help the domestic teams in Europe
 
I think Saturdays game was completley unacceptable. The AB's did not look dominant, especially with the number of errors and penalties they made. However England were worse with a very leaky defensive structure and no signs of any attack with the only try being made from an intercept pass. Borthwick has been head coach for 2 years now, and his win rate is nearly 50%, given the resources at the RFU's disposal and the quality of the players that does not match the expectation of the fans. Worse than this though, is the complete inability of his coaches to win tight games. The game vs AB's was the 3rd game in a row lost to the AB's, all with close ends that England could have won but bottled. Those kind of losses are not an individual player issue but a coaching and selection issue. Our bench has not been up to task since before the WC and it shows.
 
It is odd that the Premiership is now mostly based on attacking rugby but the England team still struggling to play that style. Until Borthwick can get his team to play a certain way, they will always look disjointed. In the past the England coach could justifiably claim that their grinding style is based on what the players are used to. Not the case now.
I do think that unless Borthwick can work out how he wants England to play and gets the players to believe in it then he will stutter on for a year or two, based on credit of the world cup campaign.
Contrast his tenure with Johann van Graan's at Bath. van Graan has got the team, fans and pundits believing in his vision, and result have slowly built. After their home semi final win last year the one image I will always remember is him sitting quietly on the pitch taking in the moment. No big gestures just living the moment.
Borthwick seems not to have a vision for the team, or the players don't believe in it - which is worse. The contrasting styles of Smith and Farrell/Ford means that 2 styles are being coached and neither seem to have players fully committed to it. Worse still the by the numbers replacements on Saturday - he does not seem to have a feel for the game.
 
Alice In Wonderland said:
Really very disappointed and shocked to read this about him.

news.sky.com

Stuart Hogg: Former Scotland rugby captain pleads guilty to domestic abuse

A court hears Hogg, who made 100 appearances for Scotland, berated his wife for "not being fun" after going on drinking binges, and sent "in excess of 200 text messages in a few hours despite having been asked to leave her alone".
news.sky.com news.sky.com
Click to expand...

The court heard Hogg's behaviour was "never intended to be abusive". Like most abusers then...

Always have to remember, how ever famous, they are just as flawed as anyone else at the end of the day
 
Bacon? said:
I think Saturdays game was completley unacceptable. The AB's did not look dominant, especially with the number of errors and penalties they made. However England were worse with a very leaky defensive structure and no signs of any attack with the only try being made from an intercept pass. Borthwick has been head coach for 2 years now, and his win rate is nearly 50%, given the resources at the RFU's disposal and the quality of the players that does not match the expectation of the fans. Worse than this though, is the complete inability of his coaches to win tight games. The game vs AB's was the 3rd game in a row lost to the AB's, all with close ends that England could have won but bottled. Those kind of losses are not an individual player issue but a coaching and selection issue. Our bench has not been up to task since before the WC and it shows.
Click to expand...
I dunno. This is - at the end of the day - the ABs.

Yes, we do have some great players, etc. but the one thing you missed off that list of problems is "teams buying the vision." They can be amazing when training, at warmup, whatever, but can settle back into type when the going gets tough.

New coaches on board? Just another complication for the players to co sides, swallow and adjust to.

How much time do they have to get their stuff together? Dunno. The team seem a lot happier themselves now, but that doesn't win games.
 
That was frustrating. Moments of looking like it's starting to click, but completely outweighed by dropping the ball in attack and messing up in defence. Overall I think England looked better in attack than they did last week, but were far too soft in defence. Perhaps that was skewed by how the opposition played though. No ideea what I might have missed in commentary either, could barely hear it in the pub. Once again managed to pick a seat near the noisy regulars! :cry:

Going to be a rough game against the Boks...
 
breathe3asy said:
The Scots put up a great fight vs. South Africa I thought
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Yeah, South Africa were poor in so many areas, but scrums killed Scotland. Still have no idea why Kinghorn was played on wing when he would have been a far bigger threat as fullback. SA did not play short wingers so not sure if that was the matchup Townsend wanted.
England v Australia was pure comedy gold. England's small victories celebrations does grate - Joseph Suaalii's reaction after Aus' first try was more determination rather than backslapping. He wanted more, not ready to jump around for small victories.
South Africa will need to improve to beat England, with a proper starting 15 unlike the testing out players that was done v Scotland. It is a pity we won't get to see Ox v Marler - would have been fun.
 
England really need to stop this ridiculous "lets sub half the team during the 2nd half" stuff that has crept into the game - both against NZ and the Aussies the team has looked far worse after the subs have come on. Most of these players are quite capable of going for the full 80 mins anyway.

Hopefully the coach will be gone soon, worse than the guy at Gloucester and thats saying something.
 
Quite a few big games this weekend. Interesting to see which Argentina team turn up against Ireland. They beat each team in the rugby championship, including a win in NZ. But then got thumped by NZ and SA the following week.
England v SA is always fun - both teams seem to pick up their games when facing each other. England's defense is porous and if you rewatch the last Aus try it does show that players don't seem to have fitness/commitment to go the full 80 minutes. There were 3 players that should have covered once Smith went into the line, but were just walking. Whilst SA should win I do think England have an outside chance of upset.
France v NZ both teams trying to get back on course. France were a pale imitation of themselves without Dupont and NZ are not the force they were. Both teams need a win to keep upward path.
Wales v Aus after last weeks last minute results with different results will the teams be up for this game? Wales desperately need the result to avoid a winless year (can't see them having any chance v SA best week), and Aus finding a bit of form, though defense is an issue.
 
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