Russell Brand.

Fubsy said:
Oooof, how the hell do you expect that to happen over a life long career? Or is it used as a threat? "Go along with the thing, or we'll end you"

I'd wager there are some nasty stories about much loved public faces that we never got to hear.
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Not soliciting sex with girls hardly over the age of consent and half your age might be one thing to considered. Not acting like a creepy sex pest would be another.

People generally have strong opinions on this type of behaviour.
 
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Colonel_Klinck said:
I'm just using it as an example of how people work and have always worked. This has happened forever. Tescos aren't going to ban him. Though maybe his local corner shop might.
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That isn't quite what I was getting at or was saying would happen, was just a hypothetical scenario in the discussion around private business doing business with whom they please; but it's not important.

I agree it's how people work, and how they always will. I was just exploring how that could look on a national scale with the combined social media outrage, digital transformation of business and payment systems and the introduction of AI.
 
hurfdurf said:
And neither would you be able to take your car back or complain or claim it happened, until of course the courts said he was guilty.
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Correct, I couldn't enact mob justice on the person or have them removed from society.

There's this weird concept where people aren't punished until proven guilty, even if you don't like that person, weird huh?

I'm not suggesting a person can't make claims and I understand that a guilty verdict isn't everything, but when the accusations are this serious and punishment is meted out with such a low burden of proof, recking someone's career and life basically, I think it's wrong and disgusting.

Certainly a lot of people who are going after him are only doing so because of his politics and a personal dislike of him, which is wrong imo, I bet their moral outrage wouldn't be so strong for another person. Heh, maybe I'm not immune to that either.
 
jigger said:
Not soliciting sex with girls hardly over the age of consent and half your age might be one thing to considered. Not acting like a creepy sex pest would be another.

People have generally have strong opinions on this type of behaviour.
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When you put public opinion, I read that as anything the public as a whole goes with (which can be anything and change over the decades), not just creepy sex pest things. Sorry.
 
godinman said:
Correct, I couldn't enact mob justice on the person or have them removed from society.

There's this weird concept where people aren't punished until proven guilty, even if you don't like that person, weird huh?

I'm not suggesting a person can't make claims and I understand that a guilty verdict isn't everything, but when the accusations are this serious and punishment is meted out with such a low burden of proof, recking someone's career and life basically, I think it's wrong and disgusting.

Certainly a lot of people who are going after him are only doing so because of his politics and a personal dislike of him, which is wrong imo, I bet their moral outrage wouldn't be so strong for another person. Heh, maybe I'm not immune to that either.
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Lol, not sure if serious.
 
Dis86 said:
That's not what he's saying at all.
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Well his entire post was irrelevant then. Punished if guilty is also wrong. People can be incarcerated prior to being proven guilty. The word punish is undefined. The whole post was a word salad, weird of you to step out of the reactions world and into posting world on that post.
 
Dis86 said:
That's not what he's saying at all.
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Yet no official punishment has occurred so the criticism can only be about individuals and companies distancing themselves.

If someone you have no unbreakable contracts with and no loyalty to besides making money is accused of something damaging to business you should absolutely drop them. What is your head filled with if you don't?

It is an indefensible position to complain that people are reacting to a warning they consider credible and not waiting until a legal judgement is handed down.
 
Hotwired said:
Yet no official punishment has occurred so the criticism can only be about individuals and companies distancing themselves.

If someone you have no unbreakable contracts with and no loyalty to besides making money is accused of something damaging to business you should absolutely drop them. What is your head filled with if you don't?

It is an indefensible position to complain that people are reacting to a warning they consider credible and not waiting until a legal judgement is handed down.
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And then when it turns out that they've dropped a completely innocent person? That should be remembered in my eyes.

It's incredibly easy to make allegations and a lot of them have been found to be false after other people have been thrown under the bus.
 
jigger said:
Personal actions can have a cost. Reality is a thing.
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Reality is a thing, not sure that's up for debate.

Personal actions do have a cost.

The reason I apologised was that I read your post as people in the public should be closely aligned to public opinion on everything, and I don't see how that is possible for every action or thought as the public are quite varied on opinions.
 
dlockers said:
Well his entire post was irrelevant then. Punished if guilty is also wrong. People can be incarcerated prior to being proven guilty. The word punish is undefined. The whole post was a word salad, weird of you to step out of the reactions world and into posting world on that post.
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Not really. Thought I'd step out and point out you're either struggling with comprehension or being intentionally disingenuous.
He's saying that your outlook on someone should not temper how you view innocence or guilt.
 
Dis86 said:
And then when it turns out that they've dropped a completely innocent person? That should be remembered in my eyes.

It's incredibly easy to make allegations and a lot of them have been found to be false after other people have been thrown under the bus.
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If someone says a guy **** themselves in say McDonalds... you know what happens?

People avoid them and it's not illegal or immoral to do so.
 
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jigger said:
If your access to work is based on a public persona or particular image then your actions and personal life should probably align with public opinion pretty closely.
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In the example you replied to I was demonstrating that I could lie about @hurfdurf hitting me when he didn't. If that gets spread around town that he hit me for no reason his livelihood could be under threat.

www.bbc.co.uk

Eleanor Williams: Rape lies destroyed me - Jordan Trengove

Jordan Trengove spent 73 days in prison after he was framed for multiple rapes by Eleanor Williams.
www.bbc.co.uk

www.theguardian.com

‘I went downhill’: man falsely accused of rape on becoming a hate figure

Jordan Trengove faced trial after being accused by Eleanor Williams after a night out in 2019
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

The guy she falsely accused of rape had rapist painted on his house. Was he guilty or not guilty of rape?

Jordan Trengove spent 73 days in prison in a sex offenders wing after Williams, then 19, claimed he drugged and raped her after they met in a nightclub in March 2019. She further alleged he came to her flat, threatened her with a knife and attacked her.

Angry locals who believed her lies targeted Mr Trengove, 22, by smashing his window and spray painting the word 'rapist' across his home.
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To assume Brand is guilty at this point is supporting mob rule.

We need a court case, or at least a police investigation to reach a conclusion.
 
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Dis86 said:
And then when it turns out that they've dropped a completely innocent person? That should be remembered in my eyes.
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Nobody is stopping you, or anyone else for that matter, remembering and choosing to avoid those companies in future if you feel they overstepped the mark in their willingness to distance themselves.

They won't care unless the consequences of distancing yourself from someone who later turns out to be innocent equal or surpass the consequences of continuing to support someone who later turns out to be guilty of the crime.

I don't think anywhere near enough people would be remembering these things for businesses to even begin to worry about that yet though.
 
Kenai said:
Nobody is stopping you, or anyone else for that matter, remembering and choosing to avoid those companies in future if you feel they overstepped the mark in their willingness to distance themselves.

They won't care unless the consequences of distancing yourself from someone who later turns out to be innocent equal or surpass the consequences of continuing to support someone who later turns out to be guilty of the crime.

I don't think anywhere near enough people would be remembering these things for businesses to even begin to worry about that yet though.
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Precisely. Which is morally wrong. Yet the people that are painting him as guilty and saying these companies are right to drop him are the ones banging on about morals.
 
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