Ryzen "2" ?

[Zeed]

So maybe @humbug should stop defending crap products sold as better then they really are?? All boards died on me ware supposed to be Mid range good for overclocking and they packed up within 12 months.
Its SOOOO much fun having to RMA board's and gett replacement ones till ya get RMA back and loosing money on shipping and selling temporraty motherboard on.

We are not Spoiled. We want GOOD mid range products. 100 quid boards are low end good for running with no overclock. If You want overclock then You need 200+ board


And yes AIO is crap. Id rather have Noctua d15 than this so called poor liquid cooling imitation that performance is on pair or worse than air and costs MORE !!!

 

[humbug]

@humbug How many boards did died on You ??
So far I had 6 motherboard's VRM sections packing up in my life. One with actual smoke coming out of case with 2500k.

None, not one

As far back as i can remember

MSI Socket 478 Intel Board for the P4
ASRock Socket 939 for the Athlon 3800+
Asus Sabertooth TUF AM3, Phenom II 1090T
Asus X58, i7 930
Gigabyte Z97, 4690K
Current...

Isn't the point being that he knows what he's talking about regarding VRM's as far as the technicalities go, whereas neither you or I do for example?
It's the false marketing he's bringing attention to.

We have has 4 phase VRM's on mid range boards for a lot of years, almost if not all with CPU drawing more power than Ryzen, its never been a problem and no one has ever complained about the 4 Phases on these boards let alone go completely off the deep end with criticism, so i don't see why now anyone including Buildzoid should go on such a hyperbolic rant as if sub £150 boards are almost dangerous, it is extremist ranting and completely untrue.

 

[Zeed]

@humbug so try defending crap boards once you loose over 150 pounds on shipping crap boards back and be without pc for days waiting for temp board ect.
From my perspective i **** on those low/mid end boards. They are USELESS if you overclock system. Going Cheap cost me MORE in the end. Would not run them even if i had em for free.

So maybe for YOU 4phase is not problem for ME it is Massive problem cause i had problems of burning boards due to poor VRM section. And this is not on products that ware older than just a freaking year. Products with 3 year warranty !!! They cant even last a YEAR.

 

[Drollic]

The problem with advertising any board using the word overclocking is that the range of overclocking in terms of speeds, volts, temps and settings is vast. You can overclock a CPU by 100mhz with the worst settings possible in a case with no airflow should you wish. The point being, some people have limited knowledge and expect their kit to do things far from its intended purpose.

@Zeed

Whilst I wouldn't defend the products, from what I've seen you post, it's fair to say you overclock more than mildly. The higher you go, the more risk you take. There's no guarantee and nobody should think otherwise regardless of marketing. Past a point, it's all a lottery.

 

[humbug]

@humbug so try defending crap boards once you loose over 150 pounds on shipping crap boards back and be without pc for days waiting for temp board ect.
From my perspective i **** on those low/mid end boards. They are USELESS if you overclock system. Going Cheap cost me MORE in the end. Would not run them even if i had em for free.

So maybe for YOU 4phase is not problem for ME it is Massive problem cause i had problems of burning boards due to poor VRM section. And this is not on products that ware older than just a freaking year. Products with 3 year warranty !!! They cant even last a YEAR.

I think if you are in the habit of blowing 4 phase VRM's its you that is the problem, not the board.

BTW my current board is actually a 3 Phase.

 

[pandem0nium]

None, not one

As far back as i can remember

Asus Sabertooth TUF AM3, Phenom II 1090T

A solid board, lasted me years an took plenty of abuse. I had the R1. Would easily do over 300 on the baseclock.

I've had a few boards die on me due to the vrms blowing up. I remember a 970 board with 4 phases (I think) dieing the day after I bought it trying a mild OC on an 8350.

 

[humbug]

A solid board, lasted me years an took plenty of abuse. I had the R1. Would easily do over 300 on the baseclock.

I've had a few boards die on me due to the vrms blowing up. I remember a 970 board with 4 phases (I think) dieing the day after I bought it trying a mild OC on an 8350.

Yeah, i ran an FX 8350 and a 9590 @ 5Ghz on that board too, i agree it was solid, ugly green and brown but easily one of the best and most reliable boards of its time.

What i will say is that i would never have overclocked the 8350 on a 4 phase VRM board, but that's a whole different kettle of fish, overclocked it would easily draw 2x as much power as an overclocked 2700X.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

OK,now we are getting somewhere. According to the "experts" on the internet,ANY Ryzen system using a sub £150 motherboard should be avoided:

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/pc-systems/gaming-pc/amd-cpu-gaming-pc?sPage=1&sSort=3

That means all OcUK Ryzen systems under £1160 should be avoided as they are using these motherboards with overclocked Ryzen 5 1400 and 1600 CPUs with a three year warranty:

Asus Prime B350-Plus(4+2 phase VRMs with cooling)
Asus Prime B350M-A(4+2 phase VRMs with no cooling)

Their Ryzen 2200G based APU system uses an A320 motherboard. That will explode before delivery.

Also since HP Omen systems and normal systems use 4+2 phase VRMs,they should be avoided. Looking at many Ryzen systems under £1200,many use 4+2 phase VRMs in their motherboards.

They will all explode hence causing massive losses for OcUK,HP,Acer,etc.

To be safe they should stop selling Ryzen systems which don't at least use £150 motherboards.

So,basically if you want to get a prebuilt under £1200,get an Intel system as all the motherboards will explode in the AMD systems.

OFC none of the Intel motherboards will explode even if it is the cheapest H310.

Also,since we need to spend £150 to £200 on a motherboard to even use a £140 Ryzen 5 1600 or £160 Ryzen 5 2600,this means Ryzen has zero use for an average gamer doing a DIY build,or someone on a budget,since that increases the price to around £290 to £360.

You can get a Core i5 8400 and the cheapest Z370 motherboard(which won't explode) for £250 which is less money. You can go with the cheapest H310(which definitely won't explode),hence pushing the costs down to £200!!

A Core i7 8700 and a £90 Z370 motherboard comes to £370. A £160 Ryzen 5 2600 and a non-explody £150 to £200 motherboard is getting close to the price. Better to go with Intel just in case that £200 AMD motherboard has some hidden VRM pyrotechnics.

This means for the most part Ryzen is also pointless for many people,as Intel is cheaper.

Sarcasm\.

 

[pandem0nium]

Yeah, i ran an FX 8350 and a 9590 @ 5Ghz on that board too, i agree it was solid, ugly green and brown but easily one of the best and most reliable boards of its time.

Great stuff. I was in the 5ghz club as well with the 8350. 5.2 I think, under water in a custom loop.

I also got my phenom II x6 up to 4.3 under water on the same board. I twas the fastest PII on the cine bench thread last time I checked.

 

[humbug]

OK,now we are getting somewhere. According to the "experts" on the internet,ANY Ryzen system using a sub £150 motherboard should be avoided:

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/pc-systems/gaming-pc/amd-cpu-gaming-pc?sPage=1&sSort=3

That means all OcUK Ryzen systems under £1160 should be avoided as they are using these motherboards with overclocked Ryzen 5 1400 and 1600 CPUs with a three year warranty:

Asus Prime B350-Plus(4+2 phase VRMs with cooling)
Asus Prime B350M-A(4+2 phase VRMs with no cooling)

Their Ryzen 2200G based APU system uses an A320 motherboard. That will explode before delivery.

Also since HP Omen systems and normal systems use 4+2 phase VRMs,they should be avoided. Looking at many Ryzen systems under £1200,many use 4+2 phase VRMs in their motherboards.

They will all explode hence causing massive losses for OcUK,HP,Acer,etc.

To be safe they should stop selling Ryzen systems which don't at least use £150 motherboards.

So,basically if you want to get a prebuilt under £1200,get an Intel system as all the motherboards will explode in the AMD systems.

OFC none of the Intel motherboards will explode even if it is the cheapest H310.

Also,since we need to spend £150 to £200 on a motherboard to even use a £140 Ryzen 5 1600 or £160 Ryzen 5 2600,this means Ryzen has zero use for an average gamer doing a DIY build,or someone on a budget,since that increases the price to around £290 to £360.

You can get a Core i5 8400 and the cheapest Z370 motherboard(which won't explode) for £250 which is less money. You can go with the cheapest H310(which definitely won't explode),hence pushing the costs down to £200!!

A Core i7 8700 and a £90 Z370 motherboard comes to £370. A £160 Ryzen 5 2600 and a non-explody £150 to £200 motherboard is getting close to the price. Better to go with Intel just in case that £200 AMD motherboard has some hidden VRM pyrotechnics.

This means for the most part Ryzen is also pointless for many people,as Intel is cheaper.

Sarcasm\.

I don't think its about distinguishing between Ryzen and Intel, Buildzoid did say he has not yet looked at Z370 boards but will get around to it and i get the feeling he will be just as scathing about sub £150 X370's because they also run 4 phase VRM's.

I think that's his problem, its just hardware snobbery, he is very clever and he knows his stuff but no matter how clever someone is it doesn't stop them being a little stupid as well.

 

[Zeed]

@CAT-THE-FIFTH they wont explode if You wont run them overclocked 24/7. But overclocked I'm 90% sure board WILL pack up before warranty expires :/

 

[Zeed]

Great stuff. I was in the 5ghz club as well with the 8350. 5.2 I think, under water in a custom loop.

I also got my phenom II x6 up to 4.3 under water on the same board. I twas the fastest PII on the cine bench thread last time I checked.

Good old boards build like German Tanks. Now instead of extra FUNCTIONAL heatsinks we get...RGB and self overclocking buttons that no one uses... aaaa and loads of stickers....

 

[humbug]

@CAT-THE-FIFTH they wont explode if You wont run them overclocked 24/7. But overclocked I'm 90% sure board WILL pack up before warranty expires :/

Crap! i ran an £85 Gigabyte Gaming 3 Z97, it had 4 + 2 Phases with 4 + 4 Inductors, i ran my 4690K 4.5Ghz on it for years and it never complained.

I sold it on the MM along with the CPU in perfect order.

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/GA-Z97X-Gaming-3-rev-10#ov

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I don't think its about distinguishing between Ryzen and Intel, Buildzoid did say he has not yet looked at Z370 boards but will get around to it and i get the feeling he will be just as scathing about sub £150 X370's because they also run 4 phase VRM's.

I think that's his problem, its just hardware snobbery, he is very clever and he knows his stuff but no matter how clever someone is it doesn't stop them being a little stupid as well.

Sure,we can all see motherboard companies trying to charge more for features,and adding loads of RGB crap - like I said the Z370 equivalent of some Z97 mini-ITX boards I used have gone up from £80 to £90 to £130 to £140.

However, look at the cheapo Z370 boards,they also have paired downed VRMs and cooling over the more expensive ones,but do we hear all this stuff about them "exploding" or "being dangerous". Loads of people running CFL in these fine,even if they just use MCE and don't overclock properly. The same goes with people on forums using B360 boards which probably even have worse VRMs than the cheap Z370 ones,and the fact that loads of OEM CFL systems don't always use high end motherboards. The biggest complaint is that these systems don't have functional MCE due to BIOS limitations and cooling limitations,and are capped at the official TDPs.

The fact is many people who are lurkers will go on forums and see all these talk about sub £150 AM4 motherboards being a risk,AMD needing the most expensive DDR4,etc and just be put off buying a Ryzen based build and then just get a £70 B360,£150 Core i5 8400 and some bog standard RAM and be done with it.

The fact is the biggest risk is always with the highest end parts like the Core i7 8700K or Ryzen 7 2700X which are most likely overvolted,leakier parts which are made for overclocking. The issue there needs to be a distinction between motherboards crap for a Ryzen 7 2700X and someone who wants to buy a £140 to £160 Ryzen 5,maybe see if they want to get a slightly higher clockspeed using the stock cooler and maybe get their RAM to rated speeds.

@CAT-THE-FIFTH they wont explode if You wont run them overclocked 24/7. But overclocked I'm 90% sure board WILL pack up before warranty expires :/

But what Ryzen CPU - an overclocked Ryzen 7 2700X or someone who buys a £140 Ryzen 5 1600 and increases the clockspeed slightly under the stock cooler on stock voltage??

There is a big difference between the two,as a Ryzen 7 2700X is double the price of a Ryzen 5 1600 for example. What is the chance the Ryzen 5 and Ryzen 3 ranges tend to be selling the most in OEM systems and DIY retailers around the world??

If people make general statements about all sub £150 AMD motherboards being crap,it only means people will just not bother with Ryzen as a platform anymore,as it means cheap a CPU,but expensive motherboards and RAM.

 

[Zeed]

Crap! i ran an £85 Gigabyte Gaming 3 Z97, it had 4 + 2 Phases with 4 + 4 Inductors, i ran my 4690K 4.5Ghz on it for years and it never complained.

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/GA-Z97X-Gaming-3-rev-10#ov

Build system on that board for my housemate VRM section went IN A SMOKE on stock 4770k LOL
Just had alook it was actually Gigabyte Z79 G1 Sniper so actually better Still got poster from it on the wall hahahaha At lest poster was good

Gaming motherboard. My mate GAMED on it 2 weeks in WoW and it fried

 

[humbug]

Sure,we an all see motherboard companies trying to charge more for features,and adding loads of RGB crap - like I said the Z370 equivalent of some Z97 mini-ITX boards I used have gone up from £80 to £90 to £130 to £140.

However, look at the cheapo Z370 boards,they also have paired downed VRMs and cooling over the more expensive ones,but do we hear all this stuff about them "exploding" or "being dangerous". Loads of people running CFL in these fine,even if they just use MCE and don't overclock properly. The same goes with people on forums using B360 boards which probably even have worse VRMs than the cheap Z370 ones,and the fact that loads of OEM CFL systems don't always use high end motherboards. The most complaint is that these systems don't have functional MCE due to BIOS limitations and cooling limitations,and are capped at the official TDPs.

The fact is many people who are lurkers will go on forums and see all these talk about sub £150 AM4 motherboards being risk,AMD needing the most expensive DDR4,etc and just be put off buying a Ryzen based build and then just get a £70 B360,£150 Core i5 8400 and some bog standard RAM and be done with it.

The fact is the biggest risk is always with the highest end parts like the Core i7 8700K or Ryzen 7 2700X which are most likely overvolted,leakier parts which are made for overclocking. The issue there needs to be a distinction between motherboards crap for a Ryzen 7 2700X and someone who wants to buy a £140 to £160 Ryzen 5,maybe see if they want to get a slightly higher clockspeed using the stock cooler and maybe get their RAM to rated speeds.



But what Ryzen CPU - an overclocked Ryzen 7 2700X or someone who buys a £140 Ryzen 5 1600 and increases the clockspeed slightly under the stock cooler on stock voltage??

There is a big difference between the two,as a Ryzen 7 2700X is double the price of a Ryzen 5 1600 for example.

Yes, so its upto people who know better to put that straight.

 

[DoneADougalOnSofa]

Build system on that board for my housemate VRM section went IN A SMOKE on stock 4770k LOL
Just had alook it was actually Gigabyte Z79 G1 Sniper so actually better Still got poster from it on the wall hahahaha At lest poster was good

I had a Gigabyte Z87 UD4H board die on me with a 4770K. Ok, it was OCed to 4.5 day-in, day-out, but a 170 quid mobo designed for overclocking shouldn't conk out after two years imho. VRMs just gave up. Wasn't pushing silly volts through anything...
Never bought Gigabyte since.

 

[Zeed]

I had a Gigabyte Z87 UD4H board die on me with a 4770K. Ok, it was OCed to 4.5 day-in, day-out, but a 170 quid mobo designed for overclocking shouldn't conk out after two years imho. VRMs just gave up. Wasn't pushing silly volts through anything...
Never bought Gigabyte since.

Like my MSI x99 motherboards... 3 of them... gying every 6=7 months aimed at OVERCLOCKING

Replaced it with Asrock x99 same overclock running at mate in Manchester till this day NO PROBLEM.
Gigabyte and MSI wont touch ever again. Asrock Asus gets my vote.

 

[humbug]

Like my MSI x99 motherboards... 3 of them... gying every 6=7 months aimed at OVERCLOCKING

Replaced it with Asrock x99 same overclock running at mate in Manchester till this day NO PROBLEM.
Gigabyte and MSI wont touch ever again. Asrock Asus gets my vote.

X99? Christ... You know what i think when i read crap like this, you shouldn't be allowed anywhere near computer hardware.

Build system on that board for my housemate VRM section went IN A SMOKE on stock 4770k LOL
Just had alook it was actually Gigabyte Z79 G1 Sniper so actually better Still got poster from it on the wall hahahaha At lest poster was good

Gaming motherboard. My mate GAMED on it 2 weeks in WoW and it fried

Is that a shrine? You're not right in the head.

 

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Yes, so its upto people who know better to put that straight.

The problem is the damage has been done - remember there is less of this noise about the Intel equivalents and people are just parrot repeating the findings of the video on more than one forum,without stepping back and looking at things in context. I can see by extension plenty of lurkers just getting an Intel system,if they can't afford or justify £150+ motherboards,and that is from my own experience of quite a few people especially gamers. Why bother with Ryzen 5 when you can spend £70 to £120 less on a motherboard for that Intel Core i5 CPU which gets you a nice 500GB SSD or a better graphics card?? Plus Intel is the "trusted" brand too,so this only increases distrust of AMD,especially after all the issues with the FX(it consumes too much power,meaning you need expensive motherboards,etc and Intel can be used in cheap motherboards fine),and this is just making Ryzen look like it has more issues,even if it is a motherboard OEM one.