Siliconslave's how to make espresso thread

Raymond Lin · 13 Oct 2020 at 20:00

mattyg said:
The biggest variable will be with distribution and tamping.

Even my guys can have off days when they are inconsistent in tamping and only get 19 secs. leading to a weak tasting drink

Then we go to the training centre when we take on new staff and their guys are hitting the numbers bang on blindfolded.
But when your doing 3-400 coffees a day the technique gets dialled in. Along with RSI

I have a distributor too, then I tamp.

To reduce that variable further, I am getting a 58.4mm tamper.

mattyg · 13 Oct 2020 at 20:09

Raymond Lin said:
I have a distributor too, then I tamp.

To reduce that variable further, I am getting a 58.4mm tamper.

Its tamping pressure which is a biggy. Too little and you could have fissure's running through the puck. Too hard and the extract time will be an age. The other issue is a tamp not being level. The water will pool to one side giving an inconsistant tasting shot

You mentioned earlier in this thread about it spitting (spritzing) when using a bottomless PF. That hints at distribution and tamping issues..

We get that at our place too more often than I'd like. I want EVERY drink to be the same quality. So much so I've even considered an auto tamp. But at £700 its not cheap.

We bought a https://www.eazytamp.com.au/collections/5-star-pro It kinda takes the thinking out of it but I'm still not convinced

Raymond Lin · 13 Oct 2020 at 20:17

mattyg said:
Its tamping pressure which is a biggy. Too little and you could have fissure's running through the puck. Too hard and the extract time will be an age. The other issue is a tamp not being level. The water will pool to one side giving an inconsistant tasting shot

You mentioned earlier in this thread about it spitting (spritzing) when using a bottomless PF. That hints at distribution and tamping issues..

We get that at our place too more often than I'd like. I want EVERY drink to be the same quality. So much so I've even considered an auto tamp. But at £700 its not cheap.

We bought a https://www.eazytamp.com.au/collections/5-star-pro It kinda takes the thinking out of it but I'm still not convinced

I probably set the distribution tool too deep. I mean sometimes it comes out perfect but it just not consistent enough, not even close.

jpaul · 13 Oct 2020 at 21:23

I'd already consideredposting a video of my tamping technique for critique .... but haven't got round to it ..
but that's one solution Ray ? you're the camera expert

Raymond Lin · 14 Oct 2020 at 00:21

jpaul said:
I'd already consideredposting a video of my tamping technique for critique .... but haven't got round to it ..
but that's one solution Ray ? you're the camera expert

I’m too lazy to set it all up with lights and tripod and pre focus with different angles and whatnot

Siliconslave · 14 Oct 2020 at 11:34

Generally measuring volume out is considered as being inconsistent as the crema can throw things off. If your measuring the volume of liquid pumped through by the machine its a lot more consistent.

You have to remember with home espresso there are so many variables going on and were trying to narrow them down by stabilizing (or trying to at least) a few of them. We're also only pulling a few shots a day so ideally want a way of looking at what's worked in the last shot (or not) and trying to find the right formula to repeat or fix it 12 hours later. Pouring a few starter shots to get things dialed in every morning isn't really viable either

Siliconslave · 14 Oct 2020 at 11:38

... nothing to see here ...

Raymond Lin · 14 Oct 2020 at 12:30

Siliconslave said:
Generally measuring volume out is considered as being inconsistent as the crema can throw things off. If your measuring the volume of liquid pumped through by the machine its a lot more consistent.

You have to remember with home espresso there are so many variables going on and were trying to narrow them down by stabilizing (or trying to at least) a few of them. We're also only pulling a few shots a day so ideally want a way of looking at what's worked in the last shot (or not) and trying to find the right formula to repeat or fix it 12 hours later. Pouring a few starter shots to get things dialed in every morning isn't really viable either

The other problem is I change beans bag to bag. In a coffee shop you buy 1 type in kilos and that is the brand you use and stick to ages. Whereas I change all the time.

Dj_Jestar · 14 Oct 2020 at 12:52

Siliconslave said:
Pouring a few starter shots to get things dialed in every morning isn't really viable either

Speak for yourself.

Siliconslave · 14 Oct 2020 at 13:03

Raymond Lin said:
Whereas I change all the time.

Are you swapping between bags or seeing one bag through at a time?

Dj_Jestar said:
Speak for yourself.

yer, should have said throwing away a few starter shots isn't viable

Raymond Lin · 14 Oct 2020 at 13:34

I tend to stick to the bag. It is always 14g regardless. I might tweak the dial on the Niche by half to 1 notch to suit.

Dj_Jestar · 14 Oct 2020 at 13:43

I mitigated that variable by just buying bigger bags

jpaul · 14 Oct 2020 at 22:18

noticed that wilfa have some scales with an app option to show weight .... but reviews say they are slow reacting so no good under cup

https://beanbros.co/products/wilfa-svart-coffee-scale-wss-2

a tamping video, from after dinner shots.

utube don't have a rotate video option

a precocious pro video https://youtu.be/ho9JXtggDAQ?t=153
looks like she has a pullman wedge distributor - spinning action looks good.

Dj_Jestar · 15 Oct 2020 at 00:45

jpaul said:
a precocious pro video

In methods #1 and #2 he (the author) tamps unevenly in both :/

mattyg · 15 Oct 2020 at 01:44

jpaul said:
I guess I don't know how the volumetric machines, work - they could/can measure a fixed amount of liquid through the grouphead,
but some gets absorbed&sits on the puck ... so you'd need what? 50g of water for a 30g output.

mattyg said:
I'll measure it tomorrow. Were closing for at least a month due to being in a tier 3 location so need to do a proper closedown.

Ok so a straight pull just the PF. Is around 12 sec and 70g. With a 18.5g I got a 40g shot

Dang I really should have weighed the puck too....But I would suspect 48.5g

Might do that tomorrow...

mattyg · 15 Oct 2020 at 01:48

Dj_Jestar said:
In methods #1 and #2 he (the author) tamps unevenly in both :/

Consistency is important though. So if he always tamps like that then at least the pour will be equally poor.....But consistently so

mid_gen · 15 Oct 2020 at 08:00

Raymond Lin said:
The other problem is I change beans bag to bag. In a coffee shop you buy 1 type in kilos and that is the brand you use and stick to ages. Whereas I change all the time.

I usually have 3-4 different bags on the go. Usually takes 1-2 shots max to dial in, as I get all my beans from Neighbourhood and their roasting is pretty consistent so my blackboard of settings gets re-used.

I don't measure every shot, maybe one every couple of days, and just tweak the grind as the settings need to change a little as the beans age.

Raymond Lin · 15 Oct 2020 at 09:57

mid_gen said:
I usually have 3-4 different bags on the go. Usually takes 1-2 shots max to dial in, as I get all my beans from Neighbourhood and their roasting is pretty consistent so my blackboard of settings gets re-used.

I don't measure every shot, maybe one every couple of days, and just tweak the grind as the settings need to change a little as the beans age.

I only have 2 jars so have 2 on the go and I think 2 is enough. I don't drink them fast enough really so more than 2 will mean they are opened for far too long.

Raymond Lin · 16 Oct 2020 at 21:01

I don't understand why on this corner, every single time there is this tear. Why that corner and not all 4 corners?

jpaul · 16 Oct 2020 at 22:46

I didn't know there wasn't a metal grid beneath the dispersion plate (can you add one?) - first googling, to see why not threw this
https://coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/26319-brass-dispersion-plate-yay-or-nay/

Depending on the type of beans, I get jetting marks on the puck surface. The brass puck has smaller outlet holes than the aluminium. I notice it most with the less oily light roasts, but all other beans have been fine. No naked portafilter to verify channelling or poor distribuition

edit : can you get one of his

Dj_Jestar said:
Yes to the iridescent shower screen