Soldato
I wonder if they can humanise the AI system so that when a suitcase falls off the conveyor it is ignored until after the intended plane takes off.
Strikes at Gatwick
- Thread starter something daft already!!
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Soldato
As regards changing jobs i don't know what its like up country but down here there's an unskilled circuit of crappy jobs with poor pay and bad conditions people tend to move sideways, i had a job turning cheese (no i wasn't vegan then) oh my god somebody shoot me was my wish, i have poor pay now but a great place and hours ,moon man drifts off topic
Soldato
That is what dock workers thought before containerisation.
Undoubtedly.
Yes, my point is exactly that. If the job doesn't pay enough for you to live then get another job. There is a shortage of staff across so many industries right now.
Soldato
I was warned that automation would replace me when I left school in 1982. It didn’t. In fact, it made me more valuable to my employer as I was the only one in my region who understood how to configure the equipment, how to deal with the quirky control software and how to analyse the results.
Automation of mobile phone field and lab testing generally made skilled test personnel even more important, rather than less as the automation tools we were given often needed considerable tweaking before they worked as desired and you needed people that knew what they were doing to babysit the tools through this process.
Considering many software drops only got a regression subset of the test campaign executed, being able to automate this type of testing overnight meant that test teams had far more time to focus on functional areas which we knew had issues.
I would imagine that, until we have AI driving the test vehicle conducting testing it has selected based on analysis of previous testing and new requirements that can also swap out the equipment being tested and refuel / recharge the test vehicle, there’s still going to be a requirement for a few humans.
that isn’t ‘AI’, it’s just a camera reading a barcode and diverting the piece down the relevant conveyor. Modern airports already have this like at Heathrow T5.
I still don’t see how ‘AI’ is going to load the waggon, drive it out to the plane (ok, a computer could probably do that part) and then correctly load all the bags into the bottom of the plane, ensuring both the weight distribution is even and the load doesn’t shift in flight on a various aircraft which are all different.
A computer and robot is not going to replacing that work any time soon. Particularly when you see all the things that people take on holiday with them. It’s not just suitcases which come in all different shapes, sizes and materials. They have to deal with wheel chairs, child seats, prams, sports equipment (skis, bikes etc) etc etc etc.
This is what baggage handlers do, loads and unload planes. For the most part, the sorting of luggage and moving to the relevant part of the airport is already automated. That said even on an automated system, you still need people to deal with exceptions/failures and there are always a small % of items that need to be dealt with manually because the barcode couldn’t be read for what ever reason.
Not everything can be done better by a machine. Go and have a look at the interview with Elon Musk where he talks about the mistakes they made building the Model 3 production line. They tried to get a robot to plug in wiring harnesses, it couldn’t do it consistently because they would be dangling in different places/orientation and jiggling around as the car moved down the line. Where as a human could do it in seconds, 100% of the time. They also tired to get a robot to place a sheet of floppy insulating material on the top of a battery pack, again it kept failing because it’s hard for a machine to manipulate.
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Caporegime
It is like when people post £30 a hour jobs in London on the groups I frequent for lorry driver jobs. Yes it looks great on paper but when a equivalent house costs a million quid I would much rather be on a little less but only have to stomach the costs for a 300+K house. Not to mention I do not get the grief of driving around London in a HGV.
Then when you look at £12 a hour you could almost cry. I was on £11 a hour 15 years ago working in a food factory after leaving school at 21. Not only that but anything after 37.5 hours was time and 25%, £20 clocking in bonus on bank holidays paid at time and half and anything over 48 hours paid at time and half. You don't even get those perks anymore in most places. Just an incredibly poor flat rate across the board.
I fear this is going to become a major problem in a very short period of time in London as the people that are relied upon to keep the country running will simply leave and go somewhere else.
As far as London goes the pyramid scheme there is becoming increasingly top heavy with the bottom dwindling very fast. When people end up with nothing to lose things will get messy real fast.
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Soldato
Gf is meant to fly out on 28th :/
Caporegime
It is pretty much like Autonomous Vehicles and the rubbish that within ten years they will replace all drivers. Until AI can think like a human it will never happen but when that happens the vast majority of jobs will be gone. Everything now is just computer language learning from sensors which just do not work in the day to day weather and hustle and bustle that a human brain can do.
I get the sentiment but who is going to shift all those bags if they all go and get jobs that pay more elsewhere?
I can’t imagine that many baggage handlers are in it for the long haul either, it’s hard graft.
The reality is that people are already doing those better paying jobs. Those who find themselves without a better paying job are left with little choice but to do what ever work is available and unionise to negotiate better terms.
As long as you can get a £40 flight to Spain, it’s all good right?
I’d love to see an AI baggage handler
Got a family member as a baggage handler (at a different airport), he actually quite enjoys the job. But yeah I think we'll be a while off before baggage is completely automated. It's easy at the front end when people drop bags off - and a lot of that part already is automated. But loading and unloading the plane is the tricky part.
Brother in law also applied for airport security a few years ago, turned up to do the training and was talking to the existing staff who basically said it was hell, didn't even bother going back for day 2.
I'm still amazed that aircraft don't have removable cassetes to allow for easier/faster loading.
Soldato
- Joined
- 21 Sep 2020
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- 4,375
Yep, I can see this being the next big thing. Bang turn around done in 20-30 minutes.
Caporegime
Ah, how I miss the British seasons.
Spring, strikes at Gatwick, autumn, winter...
Spring, strikes at Gatwick, autumn, winter...
Sure if an individual thinks that.
But if you're in a union you don't need to quit because you think your voice is too small to negotiate more pay.
Caporegime
Aircraft can be 30+ years old. It really isn't cost effective for them to have them refitted plus some airports are even more archaic.
Well if the individual wants a few percent rise then stick with the job and union. If they want a significant pay rise then they should look at a new job. But I guess taking the easy route for themselves, taking a lower payrise and inconveniencing customers is what they want to do
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Soldato
- Joined
- 25 Nov 2005
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- 12,650
Did you even watch the vid, there's no barcodes and the description literally says it's AI
There's nothing in baggage handling which can't be automated, obviously you willl need some human supervisors but everything can be automated and will be automated, it's a matter of when, not if
I've definitely seen these sorts of things for cargo - maybe because they can load the containers before arrival at the airport.
But for passenger flights it probably doesn't make much difference to someone loading them directly onto a plane versus a container in the airport and just loading the container.
The one thing I am surprised no-one has looked at doing is building an underground conveyor right to the plane stand. That way the baggage guys just have to go from conveyor onto the plane and vice versa. Would cut out the loading and then unloading.
Soldato
I've worked in the industry for years, and one of the biggest issues with autonomous vehicle development is handling humans driving their cars, and all of their irrationality / impatience. When you take human drivers out of the equation, the systems are much easier to build/operate, as computers aren't irrational and aren't impatient. Automous driving systems can also easily talk with the infrastructure (like traffic lights) and other vehicles in the road as well.
Many larger aircraft do. Most large international passenger aircraft are loaded with air cargo when they have spare capacity.
Hartsfield-Jackson airport in Atlanta, Georgia, USA has an underground system of pipes for loading fuel and unloading sewage. This has made aircraft turnaround much faster and easier, as there's now no need for fuel and sewage trucks by the planes. Presumably there's no space for putting a baggage system underground as well.
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