Sycamore Gap tree at Hadrian's Wall 'felled overnight'

Malevolence said:
Pillories are better, why let them sit down?
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Why stop there?

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Trebuchet into the North Sea!
 
Werewolf said:
As a very simple example.
If I break a car window I am doing criminal damage.
However there are long established legal defences to that, for instance if I break the window to get a small child out of a car that has been left in the sun and is dangerously hot I am almost certainly clear e, even just doing so to aid a pet animal is IIRC enough in law.
There are massive numbers of these often very specific defences, as we've got something like 1000 years of case law and precedent.
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The decision to let the jury rule on colston - at all - was challenged ,those pesky echr rules, so like the complex financial cases trial proposal, laws can change,
and indeed punishment for the tree , how do you avoid punitive punishment in response to the baying social media mob;
like for colston how many people had heard of the sycamore tree before their internet awakening/indignation.

Little argued that the question of whether any interference with defendants’ rights under Articles 9, 10 and 11 of the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) was proportionate ‘was not one which it was proper to leave to the jury in a case of criminal damage.

‘Acts of criminal damage, whether it be that statue, whether it be other statues in many other towns or cities around the country, [they] cannot be pulled down and damaged in the way that this was in pursuit of or pursuant to the rights under Articles 9, 10 and 11,’ Little added.
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uscool said:
We don't know the sentence yet ? if you told me which I rather do id pick community service over doing few months in prison

Also even if you say they haven't hurt anyone, I respect nature and it really grinds my gears when people destroy it just community service wouldn't be enough punishment for me
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I think most people would but the question is whether it would make enough of a difference before the fact to deter people. People who commit crimes don't usually make a business case for it and weigh up the pros and cons.

And yes, I don't like people destroying nature either but in the grand scheme of things, how bad is this? People clear whole areas for building a house or a golf course. The scumbags of society fly tip, drop their litter wherever they fancy. I simply don't think this particular crime deserves or is served best by sticking these idiots in prison.
 
Make them stand in the gap dressed like trees until something is grown in place (amount of growth to be voted on by the public :D).
 
They should cut up the tree and make a park bench with it and use the rest to make some keyrings or something and sell them for charity. Then transplant a new tree. Its sad to see some idiots vandalise it, but instead of all the negativity, it could be turned into a positive.
 
They get sentenced today, and here’s hoping for at least some jail time or lengthy community service.

Edit

“The maximum sentence for criminal damage is 10 years and aggravating factors include whether it was done to a heritage or cultural asset and evidence of wider impact on the community.”

When she remanded the pair, Mrs Justice Lambert said they could face “a lengthy period in custody”
 
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given how overwhelmed our prisons are i hope they get massive fines as well as a lot of community service. In principle i would be happy to see them locked up... but not when other worse criminals are being let out early.
 
And a maximum inside of 40% of their sentence before release...
So, 18 months to a couple of years in prison depending on when they were taken in to custody.
I hope they meet some unpleasant people inside who loved that tree...
 
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why the hell are they destroying the guys range rover? that is such a waste. Surely better to confiscate it, send to auction and then either put the money back into the legal system or give it to some charity or something?.
As i said earlier... given the state of our justice system with hardened criminals getting light sentences i kind of feel this is OTT, probably as much for the media as anything.

i would rather community service and instead give a bunch of more violent criminals or repeat offender thieves etc a slightly longer sentence myself.
 
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StriderX said:
If you want to cut a tree down just have a company do it because it's 'unsafe', then it's just following orders and fine apparently.
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I note your posts have all been "What about this other bad thing XXXX?"

Let's be frank. Both these individuals, out of their own free will, chose to cut down a culturally significant tree, which then damaged Hadrian's Wall. They both then lied about their actions, sought to blame others, then blamed each other, then blamed pre-existing issues, and even in the Judge's sentencing remarks still seemed reluctant to accept what they did.

They are both clearly immature individuals, but ultimately had they accepted responsibility straight away, then there would never have been a need for a lengthy trial (at our expense), and their sentences would have been a lot lighter. As such, it's hard to have that much sympathy with them.

Yes, corporations, companies, and many people in powerful societal positions also do bad things—but I'm struggling to see why you have such difficulty understanding why these two still deserve to be punished.
 
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Nigel Kingdon said:
Seems odd that this version of the tree instigated jail time when all the other previous instances didn't.
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It's a tourist destination and one of the most photographed trees in the country.

No one would care if I destroyed some random rock, but if I destroyed Stonehenge, people would care.
 
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