*** The 2011 Gym Rats Thread ***

[Pigeon_Killer]

Squats completely killed me again tonight for some reason. Did 142.5K for 5 sets of 5 compared to 165K on Monday and it was taking around 10 minutes between sets to recover. 5 sets of shoulder presses, deadlifts and pullups were all done in around 1/2th the time it took me to complete my squats. 180K on Friday

 

[Skillmister]

Pretty easy HST session today. It's such a difference when you don't feel tired 5s are so weird i just feel like i'm getting started by the 5th rep. Maybe that will change in the later sessions

 

[icecold]

Had flu for a week now, not been to the gym since monday last week Finally starting to feel better. Still feel weak, but I haven't lost any weight due to a combination of mostly staying in bed and forcing food in me whenever I could. Hopefully I'll be able to jump back into HST where I left it, otherwise I'm going to work up slowly to some big triples in squat/bnech/deadlift (conventional) and then go onto my standard powerlifting routine.

 

[icecold]

Pretty easy HST session today. It's such a difference when you don't feel tired 5s are so weird i just feel like i'm getting started by the 5th rep. Maybe that will change in the later sessions

Yep it's such a nice change! Getting to 5 and realising you have to stop...ahhhhhh

On squats I've found that the high rep stuff makes me a little slower, but that soon changes.

 

[Skillmister]

Not gonna lie this new bag of unflavoured whey is pretty vile when taken with only water. Gonna buy some chocolate milkshake or something so i dont have to have coffee with it every time

 

[Phaser]

I can't recommend HST enough, it's my staple routine if I ain't got anything else going on.

How would this fair up for a first cycle of HST?

http://www.hypertrophy-specific.com/imgs/tables_3daysplit.gif

 

[Mansize_tissue]

I wasn't a huge fan of the example routine given. Instead I did the following, 3 days per week. Week 1: ABA, Week 2: BAB, etc.

A
Back Squat
SLDL
Heel Raise
BOR
Inc. DB Bench
BB Upright Row
Inc. Flies
DB Hammer Curl

B
Front Squat
SLDL
Heel Raise
BOR
Dec. DB Bench
Reverse BB Curl
Dec. Flies
DB Shoulder Press

Kept the same A and B workouts for the 15, 10 and 5 rep stages.

When I come to do it again in a few weeks I'll do the same except substitute SLDL on workout A for deadlifts and get rid of the reverse and hammer curls.

 

[wedgie]

1) Whats your height?

5" 10.5, and while I don't have a well above average frame, it's enough above average that I'm clearly underweight at the moment. About par would be around another 2/2.5st I reckon, one of the obvious flaws to going the full on cardio/low cal route. I've always approached weight loss this way, although never had to go this extent, it's the only way I've found that I can actually stick to it.

4) Work out what you will actually be eating and add it up on something like dailyburn.com before you go thinking about supplements as they are exactly that but the basics would just be a standard whey shake if you need more protein.

I'll work it out but I've already been strict in the opposite direction for the last few months so it wouldn't be easy for me to go for over my daily allowance. My working/sleeping times also pose certain problems, I work 4pm-8:30pm and 4am-7am on split shifts so my breakfast/dinner/tea times don't quite fall in line with the norm. Although it will certainly help if I can spread it over fewer meals. I'm also pretty firmly tied into having to go to the gym after I finish in the morning (So for me that's 3 hours after waking). Sorting a meal out at 4 in the morning simply isn't going to happen, would it make sense then to have a protein shake upon waking, one immediately after the workout and then a meal soon after?

How often does everyone actually go to the gym? Is it simply a case of the more you do the more you get out of it? I have no problem doing 5 days if I need to, but if the same work can be done over 3 then all the better.

 

[Mansize_tissue]

A meal in the morning isn't necessary, it would be beneficial to have a protein shake (or at the very least a dose of BCAA if you're interested in training fasted) prior to training. Also your biggest meal should be postworkout, I usually eat half of my daily calories here and get in 100g or more of protein, lots of fat and a medium amount of carbs.

The rest is really up to you.

For what it's worth at the moment I'm doing a 5-day split but you can get just as much out of 3 days, it just depends on the effort you put into each workout. I'd say something like I posted about (post 9241) would be ideal for you. Alternatively you could reduce a similar workout into a 3-day split if you find that more convenient.

For a beginner in resistance training, I'd tend to recommend 3 full-body workouts a week. High reps (12-15) and very low weight initially.

For example:

Monday
Deadlift
Bench press
Pull ups
(Rear DB raises)

Wednesday
Back squats
Overhead press
Calf raise
(Chin ups)

Friday
SLDL
Bench press
Front squat
(Upright row)

You could use something like that as your base routine, with bracketed exercises optional.

 

[wedgie]

A meal in the morning isn't necessary, it would be beneficial to have a protein shake (or at the very least a dose of BCAA if you're interested in training fasted) prior to training. Also your biggest meal should be postworkout, I usually eat half of my daily calories here and get in 100g or more of protein, lots of fat and a medium amount of carbs.

The rest is really up to you.

That's good, shake I can do, meal no chance, I barely make it to work on time as it is .

For what it's worth at the moment I'm doing a 5-day split but you can get just as much out of 3 days, it just depends on the effort you put into each workout. I'd say something like I posted about (post 9241) would be ideal for you. Alternatively you could reduce a similar workout into a 3-day split if you find that more convenient.

I think that's part of what's confusing me at the moment, I see a 3 day split v a 5 day split and without knowing enough on the matter I naturally assume more days = more work. So it is possible to work groups more than once a week with a 3 day split? Because that seems to be the main benefit I can see in doing 5 days.

 

[Mansize_tissue]

I think that's part of what's confusing me at the moment, I see a 3 day split v a 5 day split and without knowing enough on the matter I naturally assume more days = more work. So it is possible to work groups more than once a week with a 3 day split? Because that seems to be the main benefit I can see in doing 5 days.

A lot of it went over my head when I started but at least you're looking at it objectively and asking all the right questions!

You can indeed work a single muscle group more than once a week with a 3-day split. In my post above for example you'd be working lower and upper body each workout using compound movements (except rear DB raise and calf raise).

 

[wedgie]

A lot of it went over my head when I started but at least you're looking at it objectively and asking all the right questions!

Best way I think, I'm asking questions of people who know what they're talking about, if I try to pretend I have some prior knowledge I'll quickly be made to look a ****. Much easier to just accept I'm at the bottom of the ladder and go from there .

How long would you recommend between switching up routines? 10-12 weeks, less?

Would I be right in thinking the idea of starting off doing a full body workout 3 days a week is mainly so I can get familiarized with the different exercises and also to get my body used to weight training? If so, what is the benefit to switching to a split routune later on, to work the groups harder on their designated days?

I know I'm asking a lot of really dumb sounding questions here, but I'm coming into this almost completely cold so think it's for the best I understand things as well as I can to begin with.

 

[Brumboy]

I'm currently on a 3 day split, however after 3 days my muscles feel perfectly fine again. Is it detrimental to train a muscle more than once a week? I'm really tempted to do biceps & triceps every 3 days instead of once every 7 days. Is this a good idea or would this only hurt my progress?

 

[Mansize_tissue]

They're not dumb, better to ask now and get it right than to ask later.

My reasoning for suggesting a routine such as that above is, as well as the reasons you mention, but also because:

- It's simple, as a beginner the last thing you want to be doing is overcomplicating things;
- It comprises the basic compound lifts on which you should be learning perfect form to prevent you from getting into bad habits;
- It will hopefully lower chances of future injury as the high rep, low weight structure will ensure correct form is adhered to (which also bolsters the point above) since you won't be sacrificing form in an attempt to chase higher numbers.

Ultimately it's completely up to you when you decide to change routine. Don't be fooled into thinking changing every few weeks will "confuse" your muscles into growing and boost hypertrophy yadda yadda. Muscles can't get confused. Different movements that target the same muscle group can place more emphasis on different muscles within that group, however. For example: seated calf raise and standing calf raise; chin ups, pull ups and BORs; lateral and front dumbbell raises; etc.

Maybe after a couple of months of the above it would be worth experimenting (by all means experiment from the beginning, but it's important to have quite a rigid base routine to stick to as consistency is key). Perhaps try a Stronglifts 5x5, that was my first experience of weight training and I really enjoyed it, though I did modify the routine somewhat. You could try a bodypart split (push/pull/legs) to see how you like it, you might find you love smashing your chest with 3 or 4 different exercises on one day, likewise back and legs on their respective days.

I'm currently on a 3 day split, however after 3 days my muscles feel perfectly fine again. Is it detrimental to train a muscle more than once a week? I'm really tempted to do biceps & triceps every 3 days instead of once every 7 days. Is this a good idea or would this only hurt my progress?

I wouldn't do bicep/tricep specific exercises full stop let alone multiple times a week, completely unnecessary unless you're an advanced lifter. By all means hit them multiple times per week as subsidiary muscles when doing compound lifts, but targeting them specifically is a waste of time unless you have very good reason.

 

[Buffman]

I'm currently on a 3 day split, however after 3 days my muscles feel perfectly fine again. Is it detrimental to train a muscle more than once a week? I'm really tempted to do biceps & triceps every 3 days instead of once every 7 days. Is this a good idea or would this only hurt my progress?

Train with higher intensity if you're not feeling it, also main focuses should be back and legs (biggest muscle groups).

 

[icecold]

A meal in the morning isn't necessary, it would be beneficial to have a protein shake (or at the very least a dose of BCAA if you're interested in training fasted) prior to training. Also your biggest meal should be postworkout, I usually eat half of my daily calories here and get in 100g or more of protein, lots of fat and a medium amount of carbs.

The rest is really up to you.

For what it's worth at the moment I'm doing a 5-day split but you can get just as much out of 3 days, it just depends on the effort you put into each workout. I'd say something like I posted about (post 9241) would be ideal for you. Alternatively you could reduce a similar workout into a 3-day split if you find that more convenient.

For a beginner in resistance training, I'd tend to recommend 3 full-body workouts a week. High reps (12-15) and very low weight initially.

For example:

Monday
Deadlift
Bench press
Pull ups
(Rear DB raises)

Wednesday
Back squats
Overhead press
Calf raise
(Chin ups)

Friday
SLDL
Bench press
Front squat
(Upright row)

You could use something like that as your base routine, with bracketed exercises optional.

That's a pretty good routine and the rest of your advice has been awesome, but just a few points from observing beginners:

- avoid high rep deadlifts. Keep the reps low (3-5) and the weights light (60kg or less working up to 80kg MAX) for a few weeks until form is sorted. So few people know what neutral spine even feels like, it's shocking.

- similarly with SLDLs, I've seen people do them with zero hip hinge. Higher reps are fine here though, but caution is required.

- always maintain a ratio of at least 1:1 pulling: pushing, ideally more upper body pulling. For example with the program you posted you'd need the chins on weds (I'm assuming the brackets imply that they're optional...?) and something like DB rows, chest supported rows or inverted rows on friday.

- I have a personal vendetta against the upright row, may it die and never be seen again. Consider face pulls instead, which hit the shoulders much more safely.

 

[wedgie]

Thanks for the all the help, starting to get an idea of how I should go about this, got a couple more weeks before I start though so will use that time to nail down the specifics re diet/workout.

With regards to diet, are my daily goals (in terms of cal, % protein/carbs etc) identical 7 days a week regardless of the fact I'll only be training 3/5 days?

What role (if any) does cardio play? I don't play football anymore so keeping a decent level of fitness isn't exactly essential. I can keep it to a quick 5 minute jog to warm up before training if that's all that is required, although I have no problem doing more if that would be beneficial?

At what rate should I be looking for the gains to be? I'm talking more weight rather than inches as I'm sure results vary pretty wildy from person to person. Should I just weigh weekly and look for a certain per week gain, say 1-2lb?

Again, I do feel really dumb asking all these questions, but it's the kind of thing I'd rather seek advice from people that know their stuff than go into it with any wrong assumptions I may have.

 

[Delvis]

Best shoulder workout...

Polishing a maaaaaaasive horse box for three days straight! I can't lift my damn arms now

 

[TommyV]

Not gonna lie this new bag of unflavoured whey is pretty vile when taken with only water. Gonna buy some chocolate milkshake or something so i dont have to have coffee with it every time

I promise you you'll soon get used to it mate.

 

[Delvis]

Not gonna lie this new bag of unflavoured whey is pretty vile when taken with only water. Gonna buy some chocolate milkshake or something so i dont have to have coffee with it every time

Horrible isn't it?

I'm currently mixin two huge spoonfuls in water, adding a dash of flavoured instant oats and some milk.

Tastes okay then.

Will certainly be getting flavoured whey after this 5KG bag is over! I guess the good thing is I'm taking mroe of it just to get rid of it