Poll: The EU Referendum: How Will You Vote? (March Poll)

[Burnsy2023]

No offence, but if I was taking part in an informed discussion then you would have already been aware of Juncker's thoughts on Defence. It was a bit story this time last year.

I was aware. Your citation didn't back up your claims which was pretty much the point of asking.

 

[Burnsy2023]

So what make people think Cameron has got anything from his negotiations.

At least he got agreement from all member states which is the difficult part.

 

[Burnsy2023]

But not something that can't just be overturned later(?) That's my understanding, but I could be wrong. Hope I am.
Basically this deal we have, isn't written the paper it's written on (assuming it's written somewhere)

The ECJ would rule on this, whilst it's not a treaty which is usually what guides decisions, they would take this agreement into consideration when ruling.

So not a treaty, but does have weight.

 

[Burnsy2023]

no he didn't.

he got a "we will look at it later and see if we agree with it then"

No, he basically got an agreement in principle - which is still an agreement. If the wording went straight into treating without edit, then it's reasonably easy to do that if the opportunity for treat change negotiations occurred.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Sums it up perfectly for me. Pro-EUers forget this simple fact.

It's not a fact, it's an opinion - an opinion that whilst valid, not all people share.

 

[Burnsy2023]

I've never been asked if I'm European when I've been abroad - it's always "Are you British?", or occasionally American or Australian.

How other's perceive you is different to self identity. Most people looking at you will think you're either European or North American, so asking that question wouldn't be all that useful.

 

[Burnsy2023]

So if you're abroad and someone asks you where you a from, what is your response?

I'd answer British, despite that not being technically correct. The fact that I've answered in that way doesn't mean that I don't self identify as a European as well though.

 

[Burnsy2023]

You can't argue on the one hand say pulling out of the EU will create a brain drain because the best people will be put off by going through a visa process despite being attracted to our language/having family here/getting a higher wage, whilst at the same time saying businesses here will be prepared to spend millions and go through a lot more work to move out of the country to avoid paying tariifs.

Visas add cost and delays to hire people and therefore a business' ability to do work. That cost may be less than moving offices depending on the industry and labour costs.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Works just fine in the USA for donkeys years.

It certainly does not "work just fine" in the US, indeed the US is a particularly bad example for adding cost to businesses.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Being a member of the English ethnic group.

1. Yes
2. No
3. No
4. No
5. No
6. No

So how much blood ancestry do you need to be "ethnically English". Both parents English? One? What about a single grandparent?

 

[Burnsy2023]

They will all have a big party after the crybaby left and live happily ever after.

Or most likely UK will join EEA and have no more say in any laws/ decisions making but will still have to implement them and they will all laugh.

And still have the requirement of freedom of movement.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Whilst I didn't make this claim because I'm not sure the terminology is correct, I did happen to notice that one of the points raised during the millionwomenrise march was that "One woman in four will experience sexual assault as an adult."

So let's assume that women in Sweden are assaulted at the same rate as they are in the UK.

Apparently in Sweden, "individuals with an immigrant background made up 61% of all rape convictions between 1985 and 1989" (wp)

I think it's fair to suggest that that figure has either remained or more likely increased, given the massive rise in immigration since thenand the reports of ongoing attacks throughout Europe.
Now getting an exact figure on this is being made deliberately difficult simply because Swedish politicians/police cynically refuse to register ethnic or immigration background while compiling rape statistics, and have in the past pretended that raping Somalians were really native Swedes.
To have a corrupting statistical bias at Government level would suggest to many that they are hiding something.

But just going on what we can reasonably assume, we can suggest that 1 in 4 Swedish women are going to be assaulted and that the majority of those attacks will have been committed by immigrants to Sweden.

Not quite the headline, but near enough for this to be a legitimate social concern.

To argue against such a reasonable position suggests that some people are more concerned with how this looks than the safety of women.
This unprincipled blind spot amongst the Left is an interesting contradiction, and one they haven't properly explained yet.

I have done a lot of reading into claims about rape statistics in Sweden. They really need to be read in context and with an understanding of the Swedish legal system.

 

[Burnsy2023]

It's seen as good practice not to speak out but she can't be locked up if she changed her mind, it's not the law.

Even if it were she can't be prosecuted. The CPS can't prosecute the Crown for which they serve.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Project fear propaganda video

Not going to actually address any points that have been made? Surely you think it would be a bad thing for migrants to claim asylum on British soil?

 

[Burnsy2023]

How about "it's all I can find on you tube to backup my IN vote"

Still not seeing any debate on the points made.

 

[Burnsy2023]

Still waiting for your evidence from the last 2 threads.

Why doesn't the EU follow it's own rules? I.E The Dublin Regulation which states.
" that the country where asylum seekers first arrive has a duty to process their claim."

http://www.ecre.org/topics/areas-of-work/protection-in-europe/10-dublin-regulation.html

Surely that is even less relevant if we leave the EU though?

 

[Burnsy2023]

What's the point of any immigrants who claim benefits?

I've claimed a benefit. I've also paid a crapload in tax and I'd suggest many people here are the same. Just because someone claimed benefits doesn't mean they're not a net contributor to the economy.

 

[Burnsy2023]

We would be the the only major global economy to not be in the EU and I think new more favorable terms would be offered immediately by the EU for us to re-join.

Except that the EU has absolutely no incentive to do that, indeed for stability of the bloc, they need to avoid that.

 

[Burnsy2023]

The rise in eastern Europeans in my area is recent, they are all getting plonked in one area and their numbers are swelling. Somehow they are getting straight in and receiving benefits.

How do you know they're receiving benefits?

 

[Burnsy2023]

I'd say the chances of a UK Govt. putting our small army under EU control is virtually guaranteed once we've been bounced into the new "reformed" EU superstate.
Once the referendum is over the EU will have us pure and simple, it will be open season on this country to punish us for putting the EU through a bit of bother.

Except that's not how treaty negotiations work, especially as you need agreement from all nation states to pass reform.