The King of the Kop is back for Good (well 3 years)!

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 21:22

Sone said:
History says otherwise

It really doesnt.

How much influence did player manager KD have at Liverpool in the 80s and how much was the "if it aint broke dont fix it" of the bootroom? He spent a genuine fortune at the time at Blackburn and nicked one title largely due to Eric Cantona attempting to remove the right of free spreech from a spectator and Ludek Miklosko having the game of his life. The money he spent should have left a legacy, not a relegation.

Newcastle.......

Celtic.....

Im not wanting to turn this into a KD bashing thing at all, he is a decent man, i just dont happen to think he is quite the genius he is portrayed as, thats all.

Sone · 13 May 2011 at 21:25

placeholder said:
It really doesnt.

How much influence did player manager KD have at Liverpool in the 80s and how much was the "if it aint broke dont fix it" of the bootroom? He spent a genuine fortune at the time at Blackburn and nicked one title largely due to Eric Cantona attempting to remove the right of free spreech from a spectator and Ludek Miklosko having the game of his life. The money he spent should have left a legacy, not a relegation.

Newcastle.......

Celtic.....

Im not wanting to turn this into a KD bashing thing at all, he is a decent man, i just dont happen to think he is quite the genius he is portrayed as, thats all.

2nd at Newcastle and Winning the league with 2 clubs regardless of the circumstances means he is a very good manager. Perhaps not truely great but very good none the less

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 21:34

Sone said:
2nd at Newcastle and Winning the league with 2 clubs regardless of the circumstances means he is a very good manager. Perhaps not truely great but very good none the less

I dont buy it really. The best thing he has done in his managerial career has been Liverpools turnaround this season. However even that coincided with new owners, the loss of the problem that was Torres and the switch from the fans hating everything to being 100% fans again. The only way was up in those circumstances.

To my mind, the next season or two will determine his place in history as a manager. If he brings success back to Liverpool my gripes will seem petty in the big picture. If he screws up then my gripes will become the norm for him and his successes will be the exeption rather than the rule.

Pigeon_Killer · 13 May 2011 at 21:37

placeholder said:
The best thing he has done in his managerial career has been Liverpools turnaround this season.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 21:46

Pigeon_Killer said:

Sorry. Its just an opinion. I question how much genuine influence he could have had in 86. Having said that it was a great achievement.

It would be wrong to throw the way he walked out on Liverpool back at him given the circumstances.

He bought a City-esque amount of players at Blackburn then bailed when the title was won. As i say,there was no legacy, it was simply an exercise in the winning of one title and then the job was done. Relegation followed.

Newcastle and Celtic dont stand up to much scrutiny.

Let me ask this...... If liverpool hadnt employed him this season do you think his CV was putting him on the radar of any other clubs looking for a manager?

Sone · 13 May 2011 at 21:51

placeholder said:
Let me ask this...... If liverpool hadnt employed him this season do you think his CV was putting him on the radar of any other clubs looking for a manager?

Nope, only because i don't think he would have taken any other job

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 21:53

Sone said:
Nope, only because i don't think he would have taken any other job

That doesnt mean he wouldnt be asked. Blackburn, Newcastle and Celtic did and he said "yes".

BaZ87 · 13 May 2011 at 21:55

He was asked to return to other clubs but he said no.

As for his achievements first time around at Liverpool; while he certainly inherited a great side, he also oversaw the transition of that side and produced arguably the best club side to play in England.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 22:03

BaZ87 said:
He was asked to return to other clubs but he said no.

As for his achievements first time around at Liverpool; while he certainly inherited a great side, he also oversaw the transition of that side and produced arguably the best club side to play in England.

I wasnt aware he turned down other jobs, thats fair enough. I guess you would only hear about it if he said yes.

I sort of get the point you mean with Liverpool. Barnes, Houghton, Alderidge etc. Im on thin ice here so plese dont take it the wrong way.

The team he left at Liverpool needed major surgery, he brought that team through but by the time of the draw vs Everton in the FA cup it looked done. It needed work.

Souness screwed it up but he was right in identifying that work had to be done.

Im NOT saying Dalglish left cos the team was fininshed (96 fans dying while he was managing the team is something no one can quantify and attending all these funerals must have been almost impossible.) but the fact remains that he left a team needing change.

He then did it at Blackburn.

The Newcastle didnt go well.

Celtic.......

BaZ87 · 13 May 2011 at 22:11

The team he left didn't need major work. It needed some work but not much; they won the league the season before he left and the season he left they went on to finish 2nd. Our problems started from Souness believing it needed major work and as he now admits, making those changes were his biggest failing.

As for Blackburn, he won the league which I'm sure their fans are thankful for and I bet Newcastle wish they were finishing 2nd again and getting to FA Cup finals.

As for Celtic, iinm, he only took over temporary after Barnes got the sack.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 22:23

BaZ87 said:
The team he left didn't need major work. It needed some work but not much; they won the league the season before he left and the season he left they went on to finish 2nd. Our problems started from Souness believing it needed major work and as he now admits, making those changes were his biggest failing.

As for Blackburn, he won the league which I'm sure their fans are thankful for and I bet Newcastle wish they were finishing 2nd again and getting to FA Cup finals.

As for Celtic, iinm, he only took over temporary after Barnes got the sack.

No, Souness said that changes were needed but he made them too quickly. It becomes a bit of a moot point i guess there.

Blackburn would have enjoyed the league win but its not unreasonable to expect more than they got for the money spent?

They bought the likes of Shearer, Ripley, Wilcox, Batty, Warhurst, Le Saux, Flowers, Sutton. Im just listing them off the top of my head and it resulted in one last day of the season win. Then it crumbled. If cantona hadnt been banned would it have happened? Its not an excuse, they won it fair and square but is that one league an endorsement for the money spent? 2,3,4 leagues? - Yes absolutely. One league then relegation soon after? Not so much.

dannyjo22 · 13 May 2011 at 22:40

BaZ87 said:
he also oversaw the transition of that side and produced arguably the best club side to play in England.

Only cos your thugs got the country kicked out of europe. So our best players went 'abroad'

Arguably the best team in the 80's I would debate, best club to play in england ever? **** off

He did well with the team he inherited in the 80's, did well at blackburn with the money and I think he deserved more time at newcastle. I wouldn't knock him for what he did at blackburn, he's not the last manager to get a sackfull of cash but unlike many others he did get the job done.

Suarez looks like a very good buy, was it already lined up? Is it his choice?

It will be interesting to see how he does but so far he's done well enough and it's not like there are any other big managers interested and he will be cheap.

Tombstone · 13 May 2011 at 22:44

Dalglish is not really any different to any other manager, every single manager has their detractors. Theres no manager who is immune from people not rating them for one reason or another. The fact remains, not what he has done in past years, or what he will do in the future, the fact remains what he is doing right now and I think that whats happened this season makes it plain to see that right at the moment he is the right man in the right place.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 22:49

Tombstone said:
Dalglish is not really any different to any other manager, every single manager has their detractors. Theres no manager who is immune from people not rating them for one reason or another. The fact remains, not what he has done in past years, or what he will do in the future, the fact remains what he is doing right now and I think that whats happened this season makes it plain to see that right at the moment he is the right man in the right place.

If that is the case how did he get the job?

Tombstone · 13 May 2011 at 22:54

placeholder said:
If that is the case how did he get the job?

Presumably because they decided he was the right man at the right time in the right place.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 23:02

Tombstone said:
Presumably because they decided he was the right man at the right time in the right place.

I dont really think thats how its done. Imagine if Jan Molby had been on the Anfield tour that day....

You are really suggesting Liverpools decision was based on who was handy at the time?

Seriously, i dont think KD was emloyed as a long term solution TBH, what he has done has forced the hand of the owners, thats just my opinion.

Tombstone · 13 May 2011 at 23:05

placeholder said:
I dont really think thats how its done. Imagine if Jan Molby had been on the Anfield tour that day....

You are really suggesting Liverpools decision was based on who was handy at the time?

Seriously, i dont think KD was emloyed as a long term solution TBH, what he has done has forced the hand of the owners, thats just my opinion.

I really wouldnt know, I'm not in the industry and I have no insider knowledge in the thought processes or decision making procedures as to why they selected Dalglish at that moment in time. At best whatever my thoughts would be on the matter it would be nothing more than completely unbacked assumption, all I can say with any accuracy is that its clear from the way the season has panned out that he has been the right man at the right time in the right place.

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 23:15

Tombstone said:
I really wouldnt know, I'm not in the industry and I have no insider knowledge in the thought processes or decision making procedures as to why they selected Dalglish at that moment in time. At best whatever my thoughts would be on the matter it would be nothing more than completely unbacked assumption, all I can say with any accuracy is that its clear from the way the season has panned out that he has been the right man at the right time in the right place.

Yup, spot on, cant really argue with that.

I dont think he will replicate that next season.

Tombstone · 13 May 2011 at 23:19

placeholder said:
Yup, spot on, cant really argue with that.

I dont think he will replicate that next season.

I dont know whether he can or cant, at this point in time I simply could not say with any real justification whether he will or wont. All I can do is wait and see what happens.

All I know is that he has achieved remarkable things in the last few months, it seemed every man and his dog said he wouldnt manage it. People said he had been out of the game too long, people said that playing with 3 at the back was an outdated formation that nobody uses any more when he lined it up against Chelsea, and then promptly won with it. People said the squad was rubbish. Some people on here said that he would get Liverpool relegated. Ultimately he has proved all of those people wrong. What happens next year remains to be seen, but so far its Dalglish 1 Media/Armchair Pundits 0

placeholder · 13 May 2011 at 23:30

Tombstone said:
I dont know whether he can or cant, at this point in time I simply could not say with any real justification whether he will or wont. All I can do is wait and see what happens.

All I know is that he has achieved remarkable things in the last few months, it seemed every man and his dog said he wouldnt manage it. People said he had been out of the game too long, people said that playing with 3 at the back was an outdated formation that nobody uses any more when he lined it up against Chelsea, and then promptly won with it. People said the squad was rubbish. Some people on here said that he would get Liverpool relegated. Ultimately he has proved all of those people wrong. What happens next year remains to be seen, but so far its Dalglish 1 Media/Armchair Pundits 0

Thats a terrible explanation.

He took over a team that were a great side a couple of years previously finishing second. However they had terrible owners and a huffy striker.

He got the gig when the terrible owners left and so did the huffy striker.

Someone bought Suarez before this.

Someone sancitioned £35m for Carroll afterwards

KD wasnt overly keen on being associated with either deal at the time.......

Today its another masterstroke.