This is getting ridiculous (energy prices - Strictly NO referrals!)

[jpaul]

but you don't pay tax to uk govt for fuel used abroad ?

hmmh, for public chargers, does the handshake identify the car uniquely (like a sim) so, as well as giving tracking on the cars location(if there isn't a cctv there anyway)
that kwhr's tax could be removed from your yearly mileage based tax bill, to avoid double payment.

 

[touch]

but you don't pay tax to uk govt for fuel used abroad ?

and that wouldn't change either.

 

[Curlyriff]

So, no different from the current system then?
You pay the same UK VED each month whether the car is in the country or not, you dont get any pro-rata refund by showing your car was not in the country when you took it on holiday.

But you are at a fixed cost currently regardless. If you are abroad and paying your mileage tax there cause they are and you are paying mileage tax in UK you are charged twice for that distance travelled. And if you do say 30k miles in say France why should the UK government get monies taxing you when you are not a) utilising the roads b) contributing to fuel usage c) not polluting in that country.

The idea to tax on mileage is based on driving on UK roads at that time which you are not when you are on holiday.

It isn't an issue on fixed because it is just that fixed. I can travel in another country as much as I want to regardless. I am not forced to pay more for travelling on holiday to see the sights or take a roadtrip.

 

[squerble]

but you don't pay tax to uk govt for fuel used abroad ?

hmmh, for public chargers, does the handshake identify the car uniquely (like a sim) so, as well as giving tracking on the cars location(if there isn't a cctv there anyway)
that kwhr's tax could be removed from your yearly mileage based tax bill, to avoid double payment.

As far as I've seen, the only handshake is a control signal which tells the charging unit how much current to send. Nothing identifiable.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

On DC they can identify the car, some networks have implemented ‘plug and charge’ where you simply plug it in and they bill your account for the session.

Tesla use a similar system but I think it’s proprietary rather than what’s in the CCS standard.

 

[touch]

If you are abroad and paying your mileage tax there cause they are and you are paying mileage tax in UK you are charged twice for that distance travelled. And if you do say 30k miles in say France why should the UK government get monies taxing you when you are not a) utilising the roads b) contributing to fuel usage c) not polluting in that country.

That's not an argument against changing to a mileage-based system when it equally applies to the current system. You have to have to have paid for UK VED before you can go and do those 30k miles in France then you'll have to pay again to use the roads when you get there.

Yes, you'll be forced to pay more for a long roadtrip abroad but there's people who are forced to pay a fixed amount under the current system who don't use their car for weeks at a time. IMO, paying based on the amount you use your car is fairer than paying a fixed price regardless.

 

[jw2331]

A few weeks ago, there was a story of a lady going on the bus all day to keep warm. I went on a bus two weeks ago for a hospital appt - the first bus journey this year. I can tell you its cold on the bus as windows are open to promote fresh air coming into the bus.

I think the story is a load of claptrap

 

[SPG]

Spot the townie.

Neither of those options are realistic for rural areas.

Its perfectly realistic. You do the miles you pay for the miles its very very simple.

You could even discount the rate for pensioners and the disabled, not because you live in some posh hamlet in the Cotswolds you think its unfair.

 

[Curlyriff]

That's not an argument against changing to a mileage-based system when it equally applies to the current system. You have to have to have paid for UK VED before you can go and do those 30k miles in France then you'll have to pay again to use the roads when you get there.

Yes, you'll be forced to pay more for a long roadtrip abroad but there's people who are forced to pay a fixed amount under the current system who don't use their car for weeks at a time. IMO, paying based on the amount you use your car is fairer than paying a fixed price regardless.

Each to own but my view is that it is a reason because it is literally taxing someone in a country for something they are not doing in said country. Having the fixed amount was simple. You knew the cost up front and that was it. Bearing in mind it is currently vehicle tax, not car travel tax which is basically what this is suggesting.

Yes it is fairer when you have an option. To be forced over to a new tax scheme where you will be forced to possibly pay double what you currently are should not be something that happens. It would force me to quite my current job because I would literally not be able to afford the difference in the increase unless my work offered a pay rise of £1000 just for this single increase on top of all the other increases. To get to parity of take home from November last year I would need a pay rise of £5000 and was already struggling.

Its perfectly realistic. You do the miles you pay for the miles its very very simple.

You could even discount the rate for pensioners and the disabled, not because you live in some posh hamlet in the Cotswolds you think its unfair.

But for instance I don't have a choice, I live in a not posh area at all and yet I have to travel 95miles a day for work commute of which there is no viable public transport both in terms of cost and time taken. So now what, loose my job cause I can't afford to travel too it?

 

[SPG]

Yes you have a choice.

You can either change jobs, (or work from home), pay the the fair price or sell the house and move.

Like all things you have had it good for X number of years and when changes are required due to changes in tech and society some people will be worse off, your on the pile of worse off and the majority will be better off due to a more fair system that is not supporting your country lifestyle based on vehicle tax.

Winners and losers i am afraid. But I guess your safe as most Tory voting scum live in rural areas so it will be on their failed/cheat/lies manifesto to object to any form of mileage taxing as it bad for my country loving lifestyle and posh friends who drive range rovers and lets keep the city labour voting plebs paying for my cushyness.

I am all for tax per mile

 

[DXP55]

I have had my smart meter since last Thursday and I am struggling to find the meter readings - Bare in mind my eyes are not perfect -the meter is in a dark corner in garage and I have new reading glasses for the left eye and right eye is no good anyway so I am one eyed Dick -and a big work LED torch.
If anyone has one of these where is the readings - I have found 00037 kw but not sure if that is what I am lookin for -
Also on the home display -where is it on there.
I am on electric only.
This is not my picture just a screen shot.

One other thing -on the indoor display does the green light go out when it's charged showing orange light then later green comes on again for a while to charge again.

Getting a bit toxic some of these replies above.

 

[Freakbro]

Its perfectly realistic.

I'm commenting on your "get public transport or get a bike" comment as not being a realistic solution for people in rural areas, which it isn't, so you'll have to come up with a better one.

You do the miles you pay for the miles its very very simple.

Of course, I'm not against a ppm way of charging in principle, just that a solution has to work for all, not just for Townies who have the infrastructure in place to have other options. I mean all solutions are simple if you just ignore the bits where they don't work

You could even discount the rate for pensioners and the disabled, not because you live in some posh hamlet in the Cotswolds you think its unfair.

See, there we go, it didn't take much effort to start coming up with other solutions! And I'm pretty sure my location says Lincolnshire.....and it's not posh around here

 

[robj20]

You'd just get people clocking cars again as well.

 

[Bug One]

IMO solar should be compulsory for every new build and all social and council housing. I would also welcome a scheme to encourage all private owners to have solar but the age old question of funding will always be the problem as no-one wants to pay for it

The problem with any blanket rule like that, is that there are always exceptions where it's not suitable.

Hopefully, with the cost of energy increasing and the cost of solar panels ever decreasing it will become such a no-brainer that the uptake will increase. I've been trying to get my parents to invest in solar for years. They've got a perfect facing roof for it. But they don't see the long term benefits outweighing the initial investment cost. And they think that adding them will decrease the value of their property.

 

[Curlyriff]

Yes you have a choice.

You can either change jobs, (or work from home), pay the the fair price or sell the house and move.

Like all things you have had it good for X number of years and when changes are required due to changes in tech and society some people will be worse off, your on the pile of worse off and the majority will be better off due to a more fair system that is not supporting your country lifestyle based on vehicle tax.

Winners and losers i am afraid. But I guess your safe as most Tory voting scum live in rural areas so it will be on their failed/cheat/lies manifesto to object to any form of mileage taxing as it bad for my country loving lifestyle and posh friends who drive range rovers and lets keep the city labour voting plebs paying for my cushyness.

I am all for tax per mile

So I tried to sell my home to move but couldn't get approved for a mortgage to do so and thus had to remain where was and just get a new mortgage on current property even though my outgoings would have reduced as zero fuel per month and only a slight mortgage increase. I am not based in the country, I am based in a town so nothing to do with the country lifestyle.

Moving job is not that easy. It has taken 18yrs in this career to get here and to a company where I can finally do my degree (been promised a number of times previous and finally doing it) so it isn't just that simple. Why have you brought in Try and country life which is nothing to do with myself or my personal choices. I moved to the cheapest place in Oxfordshire to even afford to get on the property ladder. I haven't had it good any year at all. Work and graft hard to keep moving forward and this is just adding to the increased costs of just living a pretty average life.

 

[Bug One]

I don't have a choice, I live in a not posh area at all and yet I have to travel 95miles a day for work commute of which there is no viable public transport both in terms of cost and time taken. So now what, loose my job cause I can't afford to travel too it?

Sod that for a daily commute!

I'd be looking at something like this. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144556642720 and staying at work during the week.

 

[touch]

To be forced over to a new tax scheme where you will be forced to possibly pay double what you currently are should not be something that happens.

I do feel for your situation but, realistically, this is going to happen sooner or later. The number of road users paying no VED or fuel duty is growing and something needs to change soon. EVs don't fit into the current emissions-based system so it's either going to need an overhaul (presumably that would be to a mileage-based system?) or just big increases to the existing rates to make up the shortfall (but that would disproportionately hit the people who can't afford newer EVs harder so I think that's a less likely option).

 

[Curlyriff]

I do feel for your situation but, realistically, this is going to happen sooner or later. The number of road users paying no VED or fuel duty is growing and something needs to change soon. EVs don't fit into the current emissions-based system so it's either going to need an overhaul (presumably that would be to a mileage-based system?) or just big increases to the existing rates to make up the shortfall (but that would disproportionately hit the people who can't afford newer EVs harder so I think that's a less likely option).

Indeed and I completely understand a system for EV and the tax coming in to make shortfall especially as the travel distance for the end user is cheaper due to electric charging cheaper than fossil fuels. Fine. But then separate them out for now until 2030. The cost of EVs are huge in terms of about double what a used fossil fuel option is and so it leaves millions not able to afford such a change.

When EV prices being parity to fossil fuel current options and there is a robust second hand market then yeah sure, because a larger % will have moved across. I did try to get an EV but I couldn't get financial approval. I can't not have a car, I have an ex with two children and she has moved away on top of my general commute means I travel every weekend to see them hundreds of miles because of something out of my control.

I get why it benefits and is a fairer system generally, but it needs a transition period where it is phased in for different vehicle types. My brother works as marketing manager for a lorry EV company and am in tune with the needs to reduce emissions etc and still keep the government funded but the short sighted view of some members here just gets to me as if I live in a lap of luxury in a hamlet or something and salty because of that.

The solution when they are looking to ban fossil fuel vehicles from new sales, companies pushing more EV line ups from 2025 as their big year for a number of manufactures and the need to give time for EV pricing to come down all starts to make sense but pushing it now and as fast as is being suggested is not helpful. Not to mention the proposed system is to track number plates nationwide, the cost of that system will be tens of millions if not hundreds so the income needed to recoup that seems mental right now.

 

[Curlyriff]

Sod that for a daily commute!

I'd be looking at something like this. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/144556642720 and staying at work during the week.

I had old cars that were like £2k, £3k all these years tbh. It has been fine, first time brought something to last because it needs to do the mileage. But the cost of staying at work (in a local hotel) at £69 a night isn't viable. Can't just sleep in the office, its commercial property and so not legal to do so. For a start building insurance wouldn't be valid. The company policy is no office sleeping because of such. Obviously this different in some specific industries because they provide accommodation accordingly but general commercial properties it is a non-starter.

 

[Richie]

They could update / make it a requirement for chargers to log how many kw/h's have been used to charge a car and put on a tax on top of that.

That's a decent idea there. Most home chargers are connected to the net and it should allay any privacy fears as it's only recording kWh used.

Public chargers can simply increase the costs directly.