To be taken
- Thread starter Nathan
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![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
Toast said:
I disagree. As i already stated. I drive a CTR and pay £1700 for insurance. I havent killed anyone, i have zero points on my liciense and i consider myself to be a sensible driver on the roads. Whats wrong with that?
Again as already stated, i do consider myself to be a mature 21 (nearly 22) year old.
On that basis if I wang my car into a tree it will go from a 1.4 to an XSi... result, er kind ofagw_01 said:Yes Fox, I spotted the alloy as well
Its a shame about the innocents that lost their lives. I wonder if they knew the two guys drove like bum holes before they got into a car with them?
I'd say under 25, most people have that boy racer crap out of their system by 25, although there are still idiots (of course, there always will be, such is life). At least that's how it is with the majority of people I know.
And by 'thousands' I mean literally that, for example on the itr-dc5 forums I've seen people between 18 and 21 willing to pay £3000-£4000 on insurance on a DC5, whether they actually did or not is another matter. But my point is, I have a decent job, I work hard and I value money, I also have no intention to be involved in an accident and will try my damndest to avoid it. £3-£4k is an obscene amount of money to pay out for something that will most likely not happen. Sure, fine if you're unlucky and something does happen but if you go an entire year with nothing happening then you may as well have just piled that money up in the garden and set it on fire.
And by 'thousands' I mean literally that, for example on the itr-dc5 forums I've seen people between 18 and 21 willing to pay £3000-£4000 on insurance on a DC5, whether they actually did or not is another matter. But my point is, I have a decent job, I work hard and I value money, I also have no intention to be involved in an accident and will try my damndest to avoid it. £3-£4k is an obscene amount of money to pay out for something that will most likely not happen. Sure, fine if you're unlucky and something does happen but if you go an entire year with nothing happening then you may as well have just piled that money up in the garden and set it on fire.
Toast said:
See, I disagree. Personally I feel despite being a few years under your suggested age limit, I am quite capable of handling a 250bhp car. I don't really think its the place of legislation to restrict my choice in this way.
You keep forgetting there is a legal requirement to have insurance. It's not about whether you think you will crash - if you wish to drive on the road, you must have insurance.
[TW]Fox said:
Oh, I'm fully aware it's a legal requirement. However, £3-£4000 is a lot of money to most people and most people would have the sense to know that money would be better spent elsewhere. Personally I'd say that about £1000-£1500 max is what I'd be willing to spend on insurance on any car, any more and it's becoming ridiculous especially when the price some younger drivers are paying is a third or even half the value of the car. It's like that lad here recently, £3500+ for Third Party Only, all because he was too impatient to wait a while for the price to become reasonable, all because he had some desire to own his 'dream car before 20'. So impatient he borrowed the money, etc, etc. Those actions say a lot, and they don't really inspire confidence in him lasting long on the road.
I should also point out that a lot of younger drivers (from what I see here) aren't willing to pay huge sums of money to insure a car, these people actually show some common sense, like I said, it's those who are willing to pay huge wads that are likely to cause the trouble.
I know though that restrictions on younger drivers isn't ideal and is unfair on those who don't drive like morons
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Toast said:
Again i disagree. Quite the opposite. I'm well aware how much i pay a year for insurance. Im also VERY well aware of the consequences on insurance if i pile the car sideways into a tree. Hence i always think twice about putting my foot down - knowing that if i do, and i crash, i wont be insuring my car again next year.
I work hard, earn my money, and deciede to spend a good chunk of it on my car + insurance. I dont see anything wrong with that, and i dont see why i should be tarred with the same brush as boy racer idiots, just because i chose to own a fast car at a young age.
I think people should have to earn the right to drive a car with very quick acceleration and speed. You have to be a certain age to drive a 500cc motorbike, so why not with a car over a certain litre or bhp.
It would save a lot of lives from inexperienced drivers and also take away the british culture of late night driving and car meets in towns.
There is no way its going to happen. The lads who crashed could have been driving 170bhp cars for a couple of years or more.
Also being drunk and driving home from town with some girls in the car just because they wanted to show off and save £10 on a taxi, ******* pathetic. I hope every time he looks down at where his leg was wishes he left the car home that night.
I just hope I never got knocked of my bike or hit by these sort of lads in this country at night.
It would save a lot of lives from inexperienced drivers and also take away the british culture of late night driving and car meets in towns.
There is no way its going to happen. The lads who crashed could have been driving 170bhp cars for a couple of years or more.
Also being drunk and driving home from town with some girls in the car just because they wanted to show off and save £10 on a taxi, ******* pathetic. I hope every time he looks down at where his leg was wishes he left the car home that night.
I just hope I never got knocked of my bike or hit by these sort of lads in this country at night.
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James_N said:
If you're paying £3-£4k on insurance then there's something wrong with you. It's like our 19year old Lotus driving friend, he's paid £3.5k Third Party Only, he's not even bothered about what happens to his £13k car, just taken out the minimum insurance available JUST so he can drive THAT car. It's literally like he's bought a license to put other peoples lives at risk. Maybe there should be some psychological profiling by insurers then to see whether a driver is responsible enough to drive a high performance car
different strokes for different folks i guess. Im thinking about saving for an S2000 next year (hence the reason im driving round in a battered volvo atm, and yes it is insured!) My insurance on an S2000 next year would be around £2,300 (1 year NCB) thats getting near to the limit of what i would pay but as the S is a car ive always WANTED to own, im quite prepared to pay it.
I might work at a mental hospital but i can assure you theres nothing wrong with me I just work hard to earn my money and think i should be allowed to spend it on what I want to spend it on.
With respect, what people do with THEIR own money is up to them. Obviously if a 21 year old drunk driver hits your daughter or something, i can understand your opinion, but how much money others spend on insurance and what car young people drive isnt really going to effect you.
/edit - after reading the last part of my post back, it may come accross as harsh and a dig at you, this isnt how its intended, this is purely my opinion
I might work at a mental hospital but i can assure you theres nothing wrong with me
I just work hard to earn my money and think i should be allowed to spend it on what I want to spend it on. With respect, what people do with THEIR own money is up to them. Obviously if a 21 year old drunk driver hits your daughter or something, i can understand your opinion, but how much money others spend on insurance and what car young people drive isnt really going to effect you.
/edit - after reading the last part of my post back, it may come accross as harsh and a dig at you, this isnt how its intended, this is purely my opinion
Toast, if it was this simple dont you think the insurance companies would do this. People are complicated and with so little previous history you cant tell what they will do even young drivers can be good drivers and sensible with the little experience they have.
People who pay 2k to insure a car especially if its comp when they could have saved a grand or more going with lesser cover are obviously going to take great pride in their car imo, but its not possible to presume anything..
Cars now are definetly more powerfull. Todays group 3 car has more bhp then my first car which was a group 11, two thirds more if you consider power to weight. I think australia may be trialing some law based on PWR
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I live about 5 mins from there. That tree is extremely resilient, as it's had at least one other car round it since then.
It is a good job that tree is there though, as at least it stops these nutters from ploughing straight into the pumps on the petrol station forecourt just behind it.
It is a good job that tree is there though, as at least it stops these nutters from ploughing straight into the pumps on the petrol station forecourt just behind it.
geiger said:
Erm, I believe Jollygreen has an SP30.
As I said, £3-£4k is a lot of money to pay out in the event you're unlucky and something happens, most people are sensible to realise this. If an S2000 is your dream car then it's still going to be available to buy in a year or two years although £2300 is still a lot of money and more than I'd pay it's not quite 'ridiculous amounts'.
When someone is all too eager to pay £3000, £4000+ on insurance just so they can drive a specific car then that really says a lot to me. To me it would be like burning money. Right now I'd like an M3 but until insurance falls to around £1500FC then I'll hold out (although the new warranty prices are a little off putting now). It's not that I can't afford the insurance, I can, I'm just not stupid enough to pay a company thousands so that I can play russian roulette should I have to claim (will they pay out, won't they, will they wiggle and squirm, who knows!)
It more about what is going on in their head, than the car they are in I think.
I like to go fast and will 'race' people on the road, I may perform some risky manoeuvres, but I retain a sense of calm and control, some restraint. (Me = 25 / 7yr NCB)
I've come accross many many people round here who don't know when to stop. They perform the most dangerous manoeuvres possible with seemingly no thought, just because its heat of the moment. They also seem to show no respect, if you are going to 'race' on the road, you should at least give the other guy some room or allow him in etc if needs be. However they don't, they will run the guy they are having a bit of fun with off the road
Personally I'm really only interested in car comparisons, I'll have a go to see how my car shapes up to theirs, but not how I shape up vs them and I think that is the difference. When they start to make it dangerous for me, I drop off and leave well alone.
I like to go fast and will 'race' people on the road, I may perform some risky manoeuvres, but I retain a sense of calm and control, some restraint. (Me = 25 / 7yr NCB)
I've come accross many many people round here who don't know when to stop. They perform the most dangerous manoeuvres possible with seemingly no thought, just because its heat of the moment. They also seem to show no respect, if you are going to 'race' on the road, you should at least give the other guy some room or allow him in etc if needs be. However they don't, they will run the guy they are having a bit of fun with off the road
Personally I'm really only interested in car comparisons, I'll have a go to see how my car shapes up to theirs, but not how I shape up vs them and I think that is the difference. When they start to make it dangerous for me, I drop off and leave well alone.
Toast said:
Which makes him a reckless driver, does it?
I've got an SP30 as well.
It's not JUST incase you are unlucky, is it? You are LEGALLY OBLIGATED to buy insurance should you wish to use a car on the road.
Thats your opinion and you are entitled to it - I wouldnt pay £4k for insurance either but different people have different opinions on whats worth paying for and what isn't. Some people will chose to spend £4k a year on golf club membership and golf clubs, others will chose to spend £4k a year to ensure they can drive a car they really like. It doesn't make them wreckless - infact it makes them a damn sight more sensible than the morons who can't afford to pay the £3-4k insurance so pretend its Mummys car and insure it as a named driver.
Fox, you're usually the first to say "They're trying to tell you something" or "It's because they don't really want your business" or "It's because they see you as a risk" when people complain they've had a quote for ridiculous amounts of money.
I'll agree with you on that last part though.
I'll agree with you on that last part though.
Toast said:
Becuase it's true - he pays £4k to insure a Civic Type R becuase there is a huge risk involved in doing it - but if he's going to do it I'd rather he did and insured himself properly.
My views on 17-19 year olds in powerful cars are well known, but once you've got 2-4 years experience although you are still a 'new driver' I think it's time to start considering decent cars.