Transfer Fees Have Gone Mad

I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure wage spending as a percentage of revenue is actually a lot lower than it used to be at PL clubs. Barca's is the shocking one, their wage expenditure is like 85% of their revenue or something crazy.
 
Market forces determine the price of players and their salaries. It's not a coincidence that everytime a new TV deal is signed, fees and wages rise a similar percentage. Fees may have double or tripled since x but the money clubs have available to them had doubled or tripled too.

If you're looking specifically at PL sides, nobody is forced to sell a player anymore. There is so much money in the PL that unless you're offered an amount that you believe can be used to improve your side then why would you sell.

Huddersfield received more money this season than Atletico Madrid who came third in La Liga, despite being relegated.
 
Market forces determine the price of players and their salaries. It's not a coincidence that everytime a new TV deal is signed, fees and wages rise a similar percentage. Fees may have double or tripled since x but the money clubs have available to them had doubled or tripled too.

If you're looking specifically at PL sides, nobody is forced to sell a player anymore. There is so much money in the PL that unless you're offered an amount that you believe can be used to improve your side then why would you sell.

Its not market forces that makes every slightly talented kid 100m euros - salaries are more in line with market forces but you can still find odd ones massively outside that (like Sanchez, who didn't come on a free and still costing an arm and a leg)

As I said the club still has a duty of care to allow the player to leave IF he genuinely wants to - they shouldn't selfishly keep a player just because they want to make 4 times as much money after less than 12 months

Its not like players have long careers - the likelihood is that 75% of the clubs in the EPL will probably still be in the EPL in 15-20 years time still making massive profits long after majority of stars have retired

Obviously the player should decide whether a possible bench position at a bigger club is worth it, or playing every week for sure at current club, and as I said earlier Im all for the club business to continue - but market forces cant be judged on one decent season


I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure wage spending as a percentage of revenue is actually a lot lower than it used to be at PL clubs. Barca's is the shocking one, their wage expenditure is like 85% of their revenue or something crazy.

I believe majority of EPL clubs aim for about 55%, last time I saw it anyway (which might be a couple of years ago now)
 
Its not market forces that makes every slightly talented kid 100m euros...
I'm sorry Frank but this is mad. The cost of players is absolutely determined by market forces - a selling club will always ask for as much as they can possibly get and the more money a buying club has the more they will ultimately pay. You're living in a fantasy world if you think a selling club will accept 30% of what they believe they can get for him just because they paid less 12 months ago and he really wants to leave.

If a Leicester, Southampton or whoever take a punt on a SPL or Championship player and they prove successful then they absolutely should be rewarded for that by receiving a huge fee if that player proves successful and they decide to move on. That's not being selfish, it's business and self preservation. If Utd want Maguire (for example), why should Leicester take the gamble on him and only receive £10m profit if they sold him last summer after he's proven himself? For every Maguire there's 3 or 4 players that sides like Leicester sign that aren't successful, the profit they'll make on a Maguire funds these failed transfers.

Your argument is that sides like Leciester should take all these punts on prospects and unproven players, lose £50m on 3-4 players and the big sides should be able to cherry pick the one big success for a modest profit? If a Utd or Liverpool don't want to spend £60m+ on a Maguire or Van Dijk then maybe they should have moved for them before they went to Leicester and Southampton but maybe they'd have also had to take punts on 4 other players too to give them a realistic chance of 1 of them proving to be a success - ultimately it would cost them the same amount of money and improve them they same amount.
 
As I said the club still has a duty of care to allow the player to leave IF he genuinely wants to - they shouldn't selfishly keep a player just because they want to make 4 times as much money after less than 12 months.

Its not like players have long careers - the likelihood is that 75% of the clubs in the EPL will probably still be in the EPL in 15-20 years time still making massive profits long after majority of stars have retired.

I don't agree with that, football clubs are businesses who should be rewarded for investing in a player. I don't think clubs should be forced into transfers they don't want to make, simply because a player has had his head turned by another club. I have no sympathy for players who sign a four or five year deal, only to turn around a year or two later and decide that they want out because a 'better' club has come calling, or because things aren't going as well for them at their current club as they'd hoped. If the club doesn't want to sell, then the player should honour their contract, it's as simple as that.

After all, players have loads of power when it comes to agreeing contract terms. Too many footballers want the guaranteed wages that a four or five year contract brings but also want the ability to get out if things aren't going their way, imo they shouldn't be allowed to 'have their cake and eat it too'. It's particularly inexcusable when a player is agreeing a contract extension, if they want to move on then don't sign the new contract. Tell your current club that you want to move on and leave them with the decision of whether to let you go on a free after getting a year or two more out of you, or sell you now for a fee.

I think the more well run, smarter clubs are getting wise to this and now consider attitude and mentality when they look to sign a player, it's the clubs who are poorly run or are chasing instant success that fall foul of the capricious footballers (United, PSG, Real Madrid come to mind).
 
Why is it clubs still pay transfer fees since the Bosman ruling...surely if a player signs a 5 year contract for say £10 million a year and then wishes to leave after 2 years he’d just have to find £30 million to buy out of that contract
Now I’m sure the club wishing to sign such a player would help to pay for him to buy out his contract
 
Why is it clubs still pay transfer fees since the Bosman ruling...surely if a player signs a 5 year contract for say £10 million a year and then wishes to leave after 2 years he’d just have to find £30 million to buy out of that contract
Now I’m sure the club wishing to sign such a player would help to pay for him to buy out his contract

Because if you want a player who is under contract then it's up to the selling club to release him from his contract and that usually requires a sweetener or fee to be paid?
 
Because if you want a player who is under contract then it's up to the selling club to release him from his contract and that usually requires a sweetener or fee to be paid?
But surely if the player pays of the remaining money of the contract then he is free to do whatever....If I want to finish my phone contract early....I don’t have to pay Vodafone a sweetener...I just pay what was agreed when I signed on for 2 years
 
But surely if the player pays of the remaining money of the contract then he is free to do whatever....If I want to finish my phone contract early....I don’t have to pay Vodafone a sweetener...I just pay what was agreed when I signed on for 2 years
It really doesn't work like that in the football world.
 
But surely if the player pays of the remaining money of the contract then he is free to do whatever....If I want to finish my phone contract early....I don’t have to pay Vodafone a sweetener...I just pay what was agreed when I signed on for 2 years
Your example is back to front. In this example, you are the club and Vodafone is the player. Clubs, just like you, can pay off the outstanding money owed and terminate the contract. Players, just like Vodafone, can't turn around and say you still owe me x over x years, instead of you paying me that, I'll pay you it and terminate my deal*.

*Unless that's specifically wrote into the contract of course.
 
I'm sorry Frank but this is mad. The cost of players is absolutely determined by market forces - a selling club will always ask for as much as they can possibly get and the more money a buying club has the more they will ultimately pay. You're living in a fantasy world if you think a selling club will accept 30% of what they believe they can get for him just because they paid less 12 months ago and he really wants to leave. .

Market forces do not dictate that for example Hazard (admittedly with only a year on his contract at Chelsea left) is the same value as Felix

Hazard has proven himself year after year at the very top of the game - may not quite be on the Ronaldo / Messi level, but is still rated incredibly highly. Even ignoring the contract situation for a moment, it is just completely barmy to think a young kid in an average league is the same monitary value as someone who has proved himself for the last 6 years or so in one of the top leagues.

I cant remember what Ronaldo's stats where at Sporting before he came to Utd - but given he cost approx. 15 million about 16 years go, including the massive jump in the market in recent years - the equivalent player should still "only" be £40-50 million because as you said - every player is still a gamble , especially going to a much more skillful league and under a lot more pressure. To practically double that fee again after not proving anything from a consistency pov is pure madness.

While there are different comparisons to take into account with Maguire (just because you mentioned it) - transferring in the same league, and a british player - so this will increase his value...but I would still suggest the year extra he has spent in Leicester since last summer when he was meant to be ~£65m , he should be slightly cheaper this summer because his contract is ~33% shorter - I think he has two years left with an option for a 3rd - (and don't try and twist my words, Im not suggesting he should be 33% cheaper, just cheaper than last summer). Its also heavily debatable that he is at vD's level as a player....who was ~ £75m 18 months ago, so its very dubious indeed to suggest Maguire should be even close to 70m this summer (and no in general prices haven't gone up that much in the same time period).

I clearly said every club deserve to make profits - its just some of the obscene profiteering on untested (or even decent but not absolute top level) that imo needs to be stopped or curtailed.

By your reckoning Maguire is a better choice than MdL because it looks like market forces have stated that Maguire will be 20% more expensive this summer......or are Leicester just being greedier than Ajax (and given Riola's involvement that's saying something).

Free choice between the two I cant see anyone choosing the british player unless they had a home-grown issue to resolve as well.

He cost Leicester £17m - a 300% profilt on that even allowing for the value of the wages on top and he would still only be ~£60m. I don't think anyone would say 300% profit is "modest " in the slightest.

Leicester / Southampton / Brighton's risk is also a lot less because they are generally buying cheaper players as well
 

Re Felix/Hazard* - yes, market forces absolutely do dictate that Felix is worth that. If that is what x offers then that is what he's worth. Supply, demand and the amount of money available to potential buyers determine transfer fees, it's no different from 50 years ago. You can argue that Hazard is better and more established but that does not change the fact that it's the market that determines how much Felix is worth. If there's multiple clubs that desperately want to sign him and they can afford to pay that fee then that is what he's worth. It's no different with Hazard* - if there was a number of clubs after him and they were willing to pay x then that's what he's worth. As it happens, he's only interested in Real so there's no auction, Real know he has 1 year left on his deal so the pressure is on Chelsea and at 28 years old Real and Chelsea know there's only a few good years left in him so will adjust their offer/demands accordingly.

*The fact that Felix is 9 years younger and likely to earn no more than 50% of what Hazard will get at Real actually means that if he's sold for the same fee, in reality he's cost significantly less.

Re Felix/Ronaldo. Back in 2003 the top sides were turning over between £120-170m per year. This season just gone Utd will turnover around £600m and there will be multiple other clubs turning over as much if not more plus your City's and PSG's of this world where money is no object. Purely from an inflation point of view £15m in 2003 is now around £60m odd today, throw in the increased levels of competition and that figure is even higher. As for Ronaldo's stats or how established he was back then compared to Felix - it's no competition, Felix is miles ahead of where Ronaldo was back then. Not that I believe that Felix will be sold for £100m but it's quite easy to see how these figures have been reached and it's not that expensive relative to historical deals and the market today.

Re Maguire. I used him as an example because last summer you were complaining about the huge increase in the fee Leicester were supposedly demanding. It's not debateable that Maguire's as good as VVD, he's not and there's not a CB in the world that's nearly as good as him but Leicester are absolutely within their rights to demand whatever they believe Utd or whoever else would pay for him. He could have 1 year on his deal or 5 years on his deal, it doesn't matter. All that matters is how much they want to keep him and how desperate x is to sign him.

And where on earth did I say Maguire was better than De Ligt? I've not commented on ability. How much somebody is worth and how good they are, are two different things. As mentioned above re Hazard, somebody's fee is determined by many factors, not just ability.

And no, I did not say a 300% profit was modest. I questioned whether you believe Leicester (or whoever) should take punts on 5 players, lose out on 4 of them as they're not a success and then accept a modest profit on the 1 that's successful? As above, you were complaining about the £60m fee for Maguire last summer so clearly you believe they should have sold him for much less. As I said last summer and again earlier, Leicester should demand every single penny they believe a buyer will pay. They took the gamble on him and nobody is going to be sympathetic with them when they try to sell a flop and offer then 80% of what they paid and when they try to replace Maguire they're not assured of success with that so they need to be compensated accordingly.

As for there being less risk for Leicester or similar. They're buying cheaper players because they have less money. Leicester's turnover the season they signed Maguire was just under £160m - he cost over 10% of their revenue. And guess what, Utd's turnover that season was £590m. Utd paying £60m on him would be just as expensive to them and just as great a risk as Leicester paying £17m.

Frank your whole argument is bonkers.
 
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