Type R and VTEC owners

Simon said:
Why on earth have you installed a map that doesn't allow you to drive the car as it should be.
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I haven't. I've installed a suitable base map for my car with my mods. I now datalog according to instructions and email the logs to the tuner. The tuner wants the part throttle map done correctly and safely before progressing to WOT and VTEC. Pretty sensible if you ask me.

Simon said:
I have a massive concern with this 'like my Facebook page and get a free emailed engine map' works we now seem to live in. You can't just email maps across the world. They need to be done properly with real contact with the car and on a rolling road! This bolt on an engine map method doesn't work. As proven at powerstation where it made no benefit.
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I guess you're referring to my car, in which case I was running a base map for a newly fitted manifold, as I've already said. So I'm not sure what that proves? I didn't expect to make any gains at all until tuned correctly. The base map was tuned safely, which was pretty much confirmed by Fuzz after speaking with him about the result.

Simon said:
If you want gains get a decat and AEM and lower vtec with a proper mase mapping session or romain. Anything else is just peeing in the wind. The mugen intake is just a brand name think too. Is a k&n filter in a box that's actually quiet restrictive. Honda had a snorkel on the prototype but didn't fit to final build cars.
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So turn up to a dyno, where the tuner uploads a base map, and then do x amount of WOT tunes then leave, is that true mapping? What about part throttle, where the engine spends 95% of its time?

I'm not naming names, but some UK tuners have been known to disable knock logic for tuning sessions in order to get good numbers. This combined with little to no part throttle tuning, I fail to see how this is better than road tuning unless done correctly. At least with the method I've chosen I get to look at the logs myself, I am no expert but I can see knock count and AFR etc, and I know what I should be looking out for.

I have my own previous poor experiences to draw from, with two different cars and two different tuners. The WOT maps were great, but part throttle jerky and no where near as smooth as OEM maps which the tunes replaced.

I'd love to have a full blown Mase map on my car as I saw first hand what he did with my Evo. The two subsequent owners of the car have both emailed me commenting on how smooth and OEM like the Mase map is, except a shovel load more power.

As for the Mugen intake, I have read up a lot about it and I'm happy with what it offers me. I'm confident it'll make more power than stock when tuned.
 
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I'm not looking for increased peak BHP, I'm looking for more noise and to increase mid range by lowering VTEC safely. I now have the noise, the mid range will come soon.

If I want to increase peak BHP, then I'd just buy a HKS Supercharger which I'm actually considering, although there's a lot to consider.

Luckily my car has OEM wideband which allows this type of tuning.
 
Tinkering as in putting on the exhaust, intake etc.

VTEC has not yet been lowered, as it's the part throttle that's being tuned right now. Once a few logs and calibrations go back and forth VTEC would then be looked at.

There's a lot more in the logs than just knock count and AFR. There are plenty of happy customers on Civinfo and other UK forums.
 
Jonnycoupe said:
LOTS.

The ability to hold a load site. ie rpm and throttle and monitor engine torque as you change ignition to understand the peak BMEP. Its all about timing of the combustion event so that the cylinder pressure works at the best time to give the conrod max leverage on the crankshaft.
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Most dyno tunes on Honda's that I have seen don't do this. Turn up, base map, 10-15 (if lucky) WOT runs, adjust base map, you see dyno graph with 'max 240 bhp' and flat ish AFR curve, then drive home.
 
Jonnycoupe said:
... ok.

And? Are you agreeing with the notion?

What ECU. If its Hondata they are effectively tuning the OEM maps anyway, cylinder enrichment, injector voltage correction etc etc is all as Honda themselves set it up as.
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Yes, Hondata.

Gibbo said:
This is true, when I spoke to Sal at Evolve down in London, Andy at Powerstation and Frank at TTFS in the USA and I asked when companies say get your car live dyno tuned, what does it mean.

They all laughed and said you cannot change values in the ECU map "live" to speak whilst running on the dyno because you can't flash the ECU whilst the car is running with new parameters. Of course some cars can have motorsport ECU's that allow such adjustment or of course old cars where adjustments were made with tools and not computers. ;)

What they do is exactly as you just said, do a dyno run with everything monitored, make some changes in the file, re-flash it and re-dyno. They then keep doing this, rinse and repeat until the tune file is perfected. :)

Live dyno tuning is myth on modern cars with ECU's. :)
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So when is the part throttle tune done exactly during this method? My DC5, great as it was WOT, was jerky as hell at times at part throttle. My Evo was exactly the same - till Mase mapped it and spent a good few hours doing all sorts to it on the dyno.
 
Gibbo said:
They do runs at part throttle on the dyno or can see issues from datalogs from road driving. Tuners will request you do two datalogs normally on road, one at WOT in 2nd/3rd and another of 5-10 minutes of driving on a warm engine on how you normally drive along with some idling and of course you should mention any drive issues you have.
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Do you mean eTuning or on a dyno? As on a dyno I've never been asked for datalogs. My current mapper is doing part throttle tuning and the car feels OEM like driving around, nice and smooth.
 
If I knew that I would self map it. :p

I'm happy with my decision, there will be internet haters but I am confident that I won't blow up my engine and I will make good power.
 
I give up trying to explain because people clearly don't read my posts.

Currently at the Nürburgring for the WTCC and had a look at the new Type R. Not my cup of tea but it does look much better in the flesh than it does in the pictures.
 
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randal, as per our texts, tyres are a pain for 17's if you want to stick with Bridgestone. You can get the RE002 for the front but not rear, and you can get the S001 for the rear but not the front.

Some on S2KI run S001 rear and RE002 front and say it's a good setup. But personally I like to have the same all around.
 
IME F1A2 are a pretty poor drivers tyre, but I admit they do offer good grip.

I'm running S001 rear and RE050 (non MZ) front. Grip at the front end is really poor, so I'm half tempted to throw some RE002's on as they're quite cheap and then by the time my new wheels arrive, we may have some news on the new RE003 (which are available in the correct sizes).
 
Honestly, Evo IV's are more hassle than they're worth. Unless the engine has been swapped out with a later Evo's engine, or had preventative work to stop crankwalk, then don't even consider it. This is exactly the reason why Evo V's are nearly twice the price of Evo IV's.
 
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