Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar

Status
Not open for further replies.
Roar87 said:
Yeah, I'm not commenting on whether a peace deal is good, bad or achievable. Simply that the author of that tweet actually went to lengths to provide accurate information that is being presented unfairly again by Colonel_Klinck. Personally I think a peace deal is somewhere at the end of a road that we're simply determining the length and cost of in lives and money.

I'm happy to be proved wrong and Ukraine defeats Russia, but the opposite isn't off the table either.

I don't think the subtext is that anyone loves war and I don't think that's suggested.
Click to expand...

Neither side appears to be able to act decisively enough on the battlefield as it stands to be able to force the other to the negotiating table, if that was even a choice bad deal or otherwise.

Russia is a difficult one to gauge in this respect - people are far too quick to write them off and often with good reason none the less, but they are still dragging this war out and sometimes their capabilities work - all this talk of F-16s concerns me as if Russia is forced to escalate the air war and their on paper capabilities even half work out then that actually swings the war against Ukraine rather in Ukraine's favour unless Ukraine is given the capabilities and freehand to go fully after air defences, bases and other related infrastructure within Russian territory - people don't seem to be looking far enough ahead on this one and convinced that Russia's capabilities will be abject failures in use which may or may not be the case. Russia can poorly afford to escalate the air war, struggles with the complexities of large scale air operations, and has significant difficulties with its S-300 and 400 and other complexes but if their hand is forced I would not be quick to write off the impact they would have.
 
Rroff said:
I don't get how any remotely not brain dead person can come out with things like "the peace which could have been" or some other forms of talk about how there should be negotiations, etc. - yes there "should" be negotiations and most reasonable people would hope this could be resolved with negotiations but it is crystal clear from a raft of sources irrespective of any propaganda that the ground for successful negotiation which result in a less bad outcome let alone a good one simply aren't there. Talk about negotiations, etc. is just wasting your own time and everyone else's with empty headed nonsense even if well intended as I suspect is the case sometimes, and not so much others.

The way this is going things are going to get a lot worse before they get better and partly that is due to people (individuals, governments and whatever whether able to directly influence events or not) not looking far enough ahead.
Click to expand...

Its amazing how "peace" can be achieved when you just give your things away to the thief.

Its also incredibly two faced, given that its hardcore american culture to shoot first and ask questions later. Thief comes to your house to steal your things? Shoot first, ask questions later, thats the american way right.

But when it comes to Ukraine, some idiots say you should not defend yourself. You should hand over everything the thief asks for, allow them to rape your wife as well and then write a letter of complaint to the UN.

How about Elon Musks hands over his billions to appease the Russians for peace. Until he puts his money where his mouth is he can stfu
 
Last edited:
Ukranian pilots say currently their biggest problem that stops them from providing support for the counter offensive is the Russian SU-35. Russia has a dozen SU-35s in the air at all times using their radar to scan for Ukranian mig-29s and when they spot them they fire their air to air missiles which destroy the mig-29. Because of this the Ukranians can't get anywhere near the front line.

So they ask for F16 so they can fire long range air to air missiles back at those SU-35s as well be able to properly use harm and other US missiles that don't work well on a mig-29.


On a side note, I've read that one of the training related issues with giving Ukraine the F16 is the plane's advanced electronic avionics - apparently F16s only operate in English and you need to be able to read English to operate the F16's systems and Ukraine doesn't have many pilots with this skill. Even the ones interviewed here are not fluent, they need to get better English skills to go through F16 training

 
Last edited:
Colonel_Klinck said:
Bad news guys, Ukraine is losing and Biden and Boris thwarted a peace deal because they love war according to David Sacks and Elon.

Click to expand...

********* Delusional. David and Elon.

The 'peace' would be all on Russia's terms. Them pay nothing back to rebuild, and them get a massive chunk of Ukraine (at best for Ukraine) and in a few years, RUSSIA DO IT ALL AGAIN.

The other part would be, that China would then see this as carte blanche to take Taiwan as clearly they have nothing to lose from such weak support. You think there is a crisis now? Wait till that fallout hits the fan and China have effectively control over Western designs and tech. (Guess who will be crying then about the situation.... Elon).

Edit: I mean *****... Just have nato roll into Belarus, demand they have it now.. or half, and then say "The peace that could have been" when they refuse to take a terrible deal. This stuff just baffles my mind on the absolute obvious answers here. Good god.
 
Last edited:
Scougar said:
China have effectively control over Western designs and tech.
Click to expand...

As an aside China has little to gain from seizing Taiwan tech wise aside from dragging the rest of the world back - the US likely has plans to destroy the fabs, etc. anyway but even if they did capture them intact they aren't much use without the experience and Western design and maintenance involvement and anything they could glean in that respect they'll likely already have from spying and so on.
 
Rroff said:
As an aside China has little to gain from seizing Taiwan tech wise aside from dragging the rest of the world back - the US likely has plans to destroy the fabs, etc. anyway but even if they did capture them intact they aren't much use without the experience and Western design and maintenance involvement and anything they could glean in that respect they'll likely already have from spying and so on.
Click to expand...

You don't think China has a lot to gain "at worst" from taking all the tech workers/engineers in Taiwan and all their knowledge?

I don't agree with your assessment. For example, if USA do as you say and destroy fabs, what happens to the Wests comfy tech life? It is gonna be an absolute ***** show.
 
Scougar said:
You don't think China has a lot to gain "at worst" from taking all the tech workers/engineers in Taiwan and all their knowledge?

I don't agree with your assessment. For example, if USA do as you say and destroy fabs, what happens to the Wests comfy tech life? It is gonna be an absolute ***** show.
Click to expand...

As I said they'd drag the rest of the world back - but to do anything useful needs more pieces of the puzzle than they'd gain from taking all the tech workers and engineers when it comes to advanced semi-conductors and they've probably gleaned most of what they can in that respect already from espionage and so on. They can't easily replicate the work of companies like ASML who are key to advances beyond China's existing capabilities.
 
Roar87 said:
Are you struggling to read again? At no point in that Tweet did he say Boris and Biden love war. You're actually just lying in a lot of your posts now it seems.
Click to expand...

Slightly hyperbolic but that post deserved it becuase the peace deal is a Putin lie, nothing was scuppered by Biden and Boris yet Sacks and Elon just spread that lie and give it credence. The implication is they wanted war. The only person who wanted war is Putin and now he has Sacks and Elon doing propaganda for him. No surprise you'd jump to their defence and take the Putin line in this.
 
Minusorange said:
It makes you wonder if they've done it on purpose, get a bill through for intentionally overpriced gear, then say the gear was accounted wrong, so there's money spare for future donations without needing to go through congressional approval as it's already approved in the amount previously passed
Click to expand...

They have undervalued the equipment to create an underspend in order to create "free money in this year's budget" and avoid appropriations committee.

If the republicans win the next presidential election, a lot of accountants are going to jail.
 
Rroff said:
Interesting comment though I don't think we are seeing clearly discerned lines that Russia is focussing on freezing the war.


This leads to a dangerous situation, especially if Russia can undermine governments in Western nations, of 2nd round being finishing off Ukraine and 3rd round trying to replay the strategy against NATO.
Click to expand...
I cant see there being many men left in Russia at fighting age if it gets to a 3rd stage tbh.
 
Rroff said:
Interesting comment though I don't think we are seeing clearly discerned lines that Russia is focussing on freezing the war.


This leads to a dangerous situation, especially if Russia can undermine governments in Western nations, of 2nd round being finishing off Ukraine and 3rd round trying to replay the strategy against NATO.
Click to expand...

I have a nasty feeling Russia will grind Ukraine down by attrition unless the West takes a more active role in this war. I don't think Zelensky can hold out for as long as Putin. There's a huge resource imbalance.
 
Tuppy_Glossop said:
NASAMS can fire the AMRAAMs from the ground right now, albeit with the reduced range of operating at lower altitudes. Not sure how many systems they have, though.
Click to expand...

No point putting NASAMs on the front line they will get destroyed

If putting anti air systems on the front line was a viable way to remove the Russian Air Force from the battlefield the ukranians would have done it already
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom