Hallelujah!
Ukraine Invasion - Please do not post videos showing attacks/similar
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Hallelujah!
That's a throw away comment, it's not about being blase, it's about not putting the country you are actually responsible for in harms way for what is a non strategic location. That might sound terrible, but it's a basic expectation of the population of any country. To everyoone about to cite Churchill and WWII, if you cannot see how that is not even remotely the same as what is happening here, then i revert back to my previous comments of you are still stuck in command and conquer red alert 2 mode.
We won’t do anything Putin will just make another nuclear threat and we’ll just wring our hands and let him crack on.I'd like to think so but I'm not so sure. We didn't seem to care too much when the Assad regime released the nerve agent sarin on its own people in the Ghouta district of Damascus, killing more than 1,400 Syrians, many of them children
Soldato
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There comes a point where you simply have to make a stand and thats one of them my guess is Putin won't do anything so blatant he'll simply push the boundary to see how much he can get away with and generally be a damn bloody nuisance i.e. fly planes on or over the border, park tanks right up to and all along the border that sort of thing a bit like exchanging insults over the fence with an annoying neighbour
If it did come to that they'd try and make sure its limited to purely conventional weapons but the risk of escalation is always there thats why all bets are off at that point
i bid this thread a farewell. i love you all, not weird really
don't worry there won't be anything bad for us, this is all staged
to make more money for the 1% that have all the money.
don't worry about it and move on imho.
/notsureifserious
I think you have an entirely valid viewpoint here.
On the point about all of this being prelude to the next escalation I wonder if the US is trying to lull Putin into a false sense of security over his plan(s) for the other ex-governates of the Russian empire (Baltics and Finland being the most likely targets).
The US ought to know that failing to defend any member is end of NATO and probably also grievously wounds their wider geopolitical goals, so how do they intend to prove it if not to provoke someone into testing it?
The US ought to know that failing to defend any member is end of NATO and probably also grievously wounds their wider geopolitical goals, so how do they intend to prove it if not to provoke someone into testing it?
Caporegime
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Putin does not have the capacity to keep hold of Ukraine, he will face an insurgency and those tanks will not last long.
As ever Putin is escalating to de-escalate, the longer the war goes on the weaker his hand gets, he needs to shock a surrender out of Ukraine soon before he runs out of military on the ground.
Man of Honour
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The Ukranian and Russian Foreign Ministers are meeting in Antalya (Turkey) tonight, maybe more discussion going on that we know about?
https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...ey-talks-with-ukraine-counterpart-2022-03-09/
https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...ey-talks-with-ukraine-counterpart-2022-03-09/
Soldato
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You both seem to think once he's done with Ukraine Putin's issue with NATO will go away, if you think he's capable of using nukes if we do more to help Ukraine, what makes you think he's going to stop at Ukraine ???
Soldato
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People get emotional when they see stories and pictures on tv etc and it runs away with them. If you think thats bad Any Answers on R4 last week people were basically calling for WW3, I mean I don't think they'd quite thought through what they were saying.
If it means avoiding mass death and destruction then yes? Threats are one thing and can be ignored actions are another if we'd taken action everytime the USSR threatened with nukes WW3 would have happened long ago.
Because he's got nowhere else to go? After that its article 5 of NATO and WW3
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Indeed and he's terrorising the population to crush their will to resist.
There's not a shred of humanity in Putin nor his army of terrorists.
Associate
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Soviet and Russian doctrine on nuclear war is very interesting. The Soviets planned to try to survive it. Unlike the British government, they built large numbers of nuclear bunkers to house their civilians in if WW3 kicked off. The Russians are still rumoured to spend over a billion dollars a year improving their main military HQ/government/VIP nuclear bunkers at Mount Yamantau. Whereas, most of our nuclear bunkers are around London and were built to protect the royal family, MoD HQ, government, civil service and ruling classes: Nuclear Bunkers – Subterranea Britannica (subbrit.org.uk)
Most minor cities in the UK have 2 nuclear bunkers for military and local government to use. The average Brit is on their own if there is a strategic nuclear exchange. Of course, this difference in the mentality regarding surviving nuclear war was summed up by the hopeless advice given by the British government in their "Protect and Survive" emergency broadcast. Hiding under your kitchen table and surrounding yourself with mattresses and doors will do sweet F.A. to protect you against fall-out!
My impression is that both sides cannot agree on a single thing.
It must be seriously hard for the Ukraine ministers to keep cool, knowing that Russia sent killers to take them out.
Alexander Dugin might be one of the the most dangerous influences on Putin. He's authored several books about Russian ideology & geopolitics which Putin appears to lap up.
Russia has a history of ebb and flow over centuries. He likens the fall of the Soviet Union to a heart attack where the nation constricted in short time. Now there is this imperative to get the good times back.
In the 90s and 00s Putin had one foot in the West. He was brought in by pro-democratic Yeltsin. Modern day Putin has totally rejected the liberal West and is playing to a different rule book. A multi-polar political ideology. A compartmentalization of values and ethics.
In essence the things we in the West deem unacceptable, like bombing children's hospitals, is somehow rationalised by Putin. In a similar way to how the West might view Sharia law as barbaric and cruel, Putin has his own unnamed law running in parallel that is threatening the free world.
Russia has a history of ebb and flow over centuries. He likens the fall of the Soviet Union to a heart attack where the nation constricted in short time. Now there is this imperative to get the good times back.
In the 90s and 00s Putin had one foot in the West. He was brought in by pro-democratic Yeltsin. Modern day Putin has totally rejected the liberal West and is playing to a different rule book. A multi-polar political ideology. A compartmentalization of values and ethics.
In essence the things we in the West deem unacceptable, like bombing children's hospitals, is somehow rationalised by Putin. In a similar way to how the West might view Sharia law as barbaric and cruel, Putin has his own unnamed law running in parallel that is threatening the free world.
Soldato
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If you know anything about the history of Russia and NATO then you would realise that it's now all about Ukraine.
Putin has no reason whatsoever to go beyond Ukraine. This is not anything new, he went into Georgia in 2008 over a similar reason and this was 14 years ago. As soon as the pro-Russian Ukrainian president was ousted in 2014 Putin annexed Crimea, thereby putting to halt any NATO membership.
This is a about a West Slavic country (Ukraine), of which the only other one besides Russia is Belorussia, joining Russia's cold war enemy in NATO.
Putin was never going to let that happen, by hook or by crook. Hence, this is why we are where we are today.
Will we let him take every other non-NATO country in the region too? Maybe we should hand them all over now and avoid the bloodshed.
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