Universal basic income to be trialled

[adam cool dude]

I'll add that it's entirely possible to have work and not feel purpose. Seems quite a common theme since I switched to remote work, some people try it out and realise it's not for them.

One of the reasons I changed career. The job satisfaction I get now is far greater than the extra 3k a year I got before. I was watching all the people below me doing the "real" work and for some reason it always played on my mind that I didn't justify my salary. Less stress too as I have gone from managing 50+ people to just managing myself. I could have progressed even further in my old job but I would have become a more hateful person in my eyes and that isn't me.

I too have plenty of hobbies but I only work 4 days a week so still have plenty of time to do what I want and that is with two kids as well. The old cliché of if you enjoy your work it isn't really a job is true.

What I get concerned about is how outdoor stuff is so important and what happens if I can't do that? For whatever reason.

Seeing as I don't get purpose from work and won't be having kids, I do wonder how I'd mentally cope of (for example) I became physically disabled due to injury or just age.

World of Warcraft.

 

[GIBURROWS]

I can't read through 23 pages but has anyone discussed 1,600 up north vs 1,600 down south?!?

 

[Energize]

Evidence from decades ago suggests this would be a huge success.

Book called utopia for socialists explains far more than those links.

It's also a popular libertarian idea as well.

 

[imtoooldforthis]

I can't read through 23 pages but has anyone discussed 1,600 up north vs 1,600 down south?!?

Ain’t no one in London going to be living solely off 1,600 a month without further handouts.

Whereas could prob live like a king in Birkenhead on that

 

[adidan]

I can't read through 23 pages but has anyone discussed 1,600 up north vs 1,600 down south?!?

People can afford to move to cheaper areas with 1600 a month. Should cover your rent and bills ok to enable you to live off a wage.

 

[GIBURROWS]

People can afford to move to cheaper areas with 1600 a month. Should cover your rent and bills ok to enable you to live off a wage.

Sounds like a plan to keep the rich areas for the rich.

 

[adidan]

Sounds like a plan to keep the rich areas for the rich.

There's rich areas everywhere, even up North

 

[eddiemcgarrigle]

As far as I see it, UBI would end poverty, end zero-hour contracts and end poorly paid jobs.

 

[GIBURROWS]

As far as I see it, UBI would end poverty, end zero-hour contracts and end poorly paid jobs.

Seems like a utopia of sorts but there will be a catch or many of them with governments of the last 40 years.

 

[Caracus2k]

As far as I see it, UBI would end poverty, end zero-hour contracts and end poorly paid jobs.

"If we just give poor peope money then they won't be poor anymore"


Stunning insight.... stunning.

Now how are we going to fund this giveaway?

Or do you think there's no consequences to a goverment printing a shed load of money because it's suddenly spending more on UBI than it did on all the other stuff it was spending money on beforehand?

 

[hurfdurf]

"If we just give poor peope money then they won't be poor anymore"


Stunning insight.... stunning.

Now how are we going to fund this giveaway?

Or do you think there's no consequences to a goverment printing a shed load of money because it's suddenly spending more on UBI than it did on all the other stuff it was spending money on beforehand?

It’ll be cheaper than our current system as the economic output who shoot up, way less red tape and admin costs, and free up people who want to work to be able to not work to live, but work to enjoy life.

Stay at home parents will become a thing again, child welfare would be sorted.

The benefits would be obscene, and employers would have to treat workers well to keep them.

 

[SpellowHouse]

"If we just give poor peope money then they won't be poor anymore"


Stunning insight.... stunning.

Now how are we going to fund this giveaway?

Or do you think there's no consequences to a goverment printing a shed load of money because it's suddenly spending more on UBI than it did on all the other stuff it was spending money on beforehand?

Honestly, that smacks of "no way is a poor person having any of my money".

The fact that even this conservative government are making plans like this, tells me there is a seriously good reason why they are doing it, and the numbers must add up.

I believe one of the long term plans is that this will be funded directly by companies as they employ alternatives to a human.

 

[eddiemcgarrigle]

"If we just give poor peope money then they won't be poor anymore"


Stunning insight.... stunning.

Now how are we going to fund this giveaway?

Or do you think there's no consequences to a goverment printing a shed load of money because it's suddenly spending more on UBI than it did on all the other stuff it was spending money on beforehand?

As far as I am aware, the money spent on the current benefits system would go a long way to funding this.

 

[Sythe79]

As far as I see it, UBI would end poverty, end zero-hour contracts and end poorly paid jobs.

No it wouldn't part of how it would work is that everyone would end up on a zero-hour contract and pretty much all employment law would disappear so no minimum wage to prop up poor wages.

It's where the economic boost would come from to pay for it, at least in part.

 

[Bear]

The fact that even this conservative government are making plans like this, tells me there is a seriously good reason why they are doing it, and the numbers must add up.

It’s not the Tories that are running this trial, it’s a privately funded experiment.

 

[SpellowHouse]

It’s not the Tories that are running this trial, it’s a privately funded experiment.

That's a shame. It is widely believed that we may need to move to some sort of system like this in future. Personally, I think it may well be just another over-reaction to AI, the same way doom was predicted when the PC was created.

 

[robgmun]

As far as I see it, UBI would end poverty, end zero-hour contracts and end poorly paid jobs.

I would expect the whiners will still whine, the complainers will still complain. Also, it would kill the Labour party permanently because there'd be no reason for them to exist. Whining about Poverty is their bread and butter

 

[GIBURROWS]

I would expect the whiners will still whine, the complainers will still complain. Also, it would kill the Labour party permanently because there'd be no reason for them to exist. Whining about Poverty is their bread and butter

I'm all for it just to expunge the labour party.

 

[Irish_Tom]

No it wouldn't part of how it would work is that everyone would end up on a zero-hour contract and pretty much all employment law would disappear so no minimum wage to prop up poor wages.

It's where the economic boost would come from to pay for it, at least in part.

Why would it?

Ultimately, this is the problem with any discussion about UBI at the moment.

You have some posters saying it will unleash a land of milk and honey, and others saying it’s completely unworkable.

As Energize said, it’s a popular idea both with socialists and libertarians — but for opposing reasons based on certain assumptions about how it would be implemented. They can’t both be right.

Until someone comes up with a comprehensive and fully costed plan, including how you would reform the tax, employment and benefits system, any discussion around UBI is largely moot.

In a previous discussion, Dolph proposed a negative income tax solution (with figures) that seemed to tick a lot of boxes, although some would argue that it’s not “true” UBI. But it seems like a practical step on the way towards UBI that could keep the majority of people happy.

 

[Chojin]

Countries with high natural resources and a low population could have the option of UBI. The macroeconomics might work in that scenario e.g. Saudi Arabia with their oil and large number of cushy government jobs for nationals is basically that anyway. But that's not the case with the UK.

During covid the majority of people who were on furlough didn't look for other work. This is indicative of what people do with their time when given enough to live on. There are too many non-productive distractions in modern life that I don't buy the idea that people will work for the love of it.

I don't see AI helping much either. There's no guarantee that the countries that have strong economies now will correlate with those in an AI world. It could just as easily be a group of technocratic microstates at the top of the list with control of the world resources.

I would rather see trials being done to improve the work ethic of the population, than implementing UBI.