Venezuela the failed socialist state - Rising tensions.
- Thread starter terley
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Yeah, the Venezuelans suffered terribly at the hands of Colonel Gaddafi - fake news and 100% off-topic but, hey, who cares, so long as it doesn't involve the unmentionable EU debate.
A reminder that Venezuela's problems are entirely self inflicted: 'Venezuela: US sanctions hurt, but the economic crisis is home grown.'
Meanwhile, Pompeo has just announced that the USA is withdrawing all diplomatic staff from Venezuela.
Meanwhile, Pompeo has just announced that the USA is withdrawing all diplomatic staff from Venezuela.
That word "entirely", I am unconvinced. Its economic problems are largely down to internal mismanagement but US embargoes stopping it from selling its oil (which they've been doing for years), attempts to destabilise its government, pressuring other countries into no longer recognizing its government, attempting to instigate its military to stage a coup, threatening invasion... It's akin to saying someone got drunk and then excusing the mugger who runs up and tries to knife them whilst they're in that state.
US embargoes are not stopping Venezuela from selling her oil. The USA even buys oil from Venezuela; she's the third-largest supplier of crude oil to the USA!
Evidence please?
I don't think you can entirely disentangle the actions of the US from the actions of the Venezuelan state.
If the Venezuelan goverment didn't do things like violently surpressing their domestic opposition and seizing US owned assets like General Motors factories the US might have been less inclined and less justified in imposing sanctions.
If the Venezuelan goverment didn't do things like violently surpressing their domestic opposition and seizing US owned assets like General Motors factories the US might have been less inclined and less justified in imposing sanctions.
About those blackouts, in case anyone's wondering...
Venezuela's energy infrastructure is in very bad shape, and has never been reliable. Then you add the typical South American penchant for corruption, and... that pretty much covers the bases:
(Source).
So their grid is inadequate, their primary dam is operating under great strain, and their backup dam isn't even finished. Major blackouts were inevitable.
Venezuela's energy infrastructure is in very bad shape, and has never been reliable. Then you add the typical South American penchant for corruption, and... that pretty much covers the bases:
(Source).
So their grid is inadequate, their primary dam is operating under great strain, and their backup dam isn't even finished. Major blackouts were inevitable.
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'Don't vote for Hillary, she's a warmonger who's always interfering in other countries! We should be more like Russia!'
Next minute: 'Venezuela crisis: Russian military planes land near Caracas.'
Next minute: 'Venezuela crisis: Russian military planes land near Caracas.'
John Bolton has ramped up his rhetoric against Russia's growing presence in Venezuela, warning that 'all options are on the table' as the USA considers a response.
Trump has done a great job of kickstarting Cold War 2.0, and this plays right into Putin's hands.
Trump has done a great job of kickstarting Cold War 2.0, and this plays right into Putin's hands.
But it's one of the few examples of a democratic socialist utopia, praised by the corbyns and mcdonnells of this world, so how can this be?
It's well established historically that despite every single socialist state failing in exactly the same way, it's never the problem of socialism and always related to the Americans, the west, or some other group of 'others'.
Why do you keep repeating the facts without the associated conspiracy nonsense that blames something else for the problem?
It's well established historically that despite every single socialist state failing in exactly the same way, it's never the problem of socialism and always related to the Americans, the west, or some other group of 'others'.
Why do you keep repeating the facts without the associated conspiracy nonsense that blames something else for the problem?
The lefties who champion Venezuela as 'socialist' really make me laugh. Venezuela has never been socialist; in fact, ever since Chavez, it's been a Bolivarian dictatorship.
Bolivarianism is nationalist/authoritarian, and if there's one thing nationalists love more than blaming foreigners for all their problems, it's nationalising private industries. Which is exactly what Chavez did.
The thing with Socialism is it has to have an authoritarian in charge. The more brutal the better. Look at the Socialist nations of yesteryear. They all have a pattern (and supporting tropes from advocates):
Seizure and confiscation of private entity (that's the main part)
A lurch into authoritarianism as an immanent part of the above
Suffering
Often large scale death and murder sponsored by the state
One of the reasons I didn't respond to one of your posts back to me a while ago on UBI where I made the comment: Socialism basically to which you denied was that you have missed the fact that UBI requires complete and total state control to administer. In that sense UBI is an "economic theory of ... organization ... Production and distribution owned and regulated by the state"
No other entity could enforce this.
What can you say about the Venezuelan people at this point, they allowed the government to confiscate their guns a few years ago and this is their reward. Tyrannical/oppressive governments don't fear an unarmed populace.
So after two and half years of shrieking about Trump being a Russian puppet he's now to blame for starting a new cold war, you couldn't make it up.
So after two and half years of shrieking about Trump being a Russian puppet he's now to blame for starting a new cold war, you couldn't make it up.
The legal leader of Venezuela cannot, by definition, mount a coup. Maduro coup, sadly, seems to have been successful.
Guaido isn't the legal leader of Venezuela. He is the president of the national Congress, but that's been in contempt of the supreme court since 2016. Whatever else you can say about Maduro (and his incompetence at running the economy provides a lot), he was legally elected president in May 2018. I'd contest the legality of the ANC (it's clearly gone way beyond the role set out for it in the constitution, and partly as a consequence hasnt actually done much in the role of writing a new constitution that is meant to be), but otherwise Maduro and his party have been very successful at getting their people into the institutions to ensure the legality of their rule.