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What do gamers actually think about Ray-Tracing?
- Thread starter Purgatory
- Start date
Nope, remember RT is the future… the present is irrelevant.
The truth is adoption is slow (but steady) because the majority of hardware can’t use it to anything like game changing levels. Right now if games developers want to target the majority of cross platform gamers, then they have to develop primarily for the raster race and not the master race.
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Jensen, is that you?
Didn’t we hear this very argument almost 5 years ago when these same people said the 2080Ti was worth the premium as it was future proofing for RT because “RT is the future”
Then they said the same about the 3090, then the 3090Ti and now the 4090.
Strangely we keep seeing more and more pointless levels of RT that seems to need the best NV tech to run. Yet the last gen bestest ever GPU suddenly isn’t compatible with the new shiny shiny. It’s like old mate Jensen has some planned obsolescence built in to his so people keep on “future proofing”.
Turing was **** because it was over priced and:
- dlss 1 was ****
- RT choice was ****, 2 games? Control and bf 5 (which didn't look much better)
Fast forward to 30xx, dlss 2 as shown is leaps ahead and the RT became more common, again, everyone is different but I consider myself to play most games (outside of smaller indie ones) and 90+% of games I have played have had RT to some extent and most of the 10% ones I've played with just raster are older titles.
Fast forward to now, well - https://www.nvidia.com/en-gb/geforce/news/nvidia-rtx-games-engines-apps/
The list is only going to grow more and more.
What games are you referring to when you say, there's so few games with RT? Please don't tell me about titles on steam which anyone can publish to.....
Most ampere and even turing/2070 and above owners have been able to enjoy RT to some extent if they wished to use it along with dlss too so yeah I would argue the gpus were future proofed better than any other competitors products here which weren't able to use RT at all for a long time and even then still didn't provide the same experience.
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Associate
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Tbh I have Avatar and I’m not impressed with RT (if there is any- as I can’t spot it!) and I’m playing at Ultra settings 1440p without FG. I get around 60-70 avg fps.
I’ve also got Spider-Man and Cyberpunk and barely notice it except in buildings glass etc.
Not sure it adds a lot to the experience.
It all looks a bit meh.
Looking forward to Unreal 5 to improve on that.
If you say it’s a way of developers rendering a scene cheaply then would welcome that in falling game prices to me as end user
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Tbh I have Avatar and I’m not impressed with RT (if there is any- as I can’t spot it!) and I’m playing at Ultra settings 1440p without FG. I get around 60-70 avg fps.
I’ve also got Spider-Man and Cyberpunk and barely notice it except in buildings glass etc.
Not sure it adds a lot to the experience.
It all looks a bit meh.
Looking forward to Unreal 5 to improve on that.
If you say it’s a way of developers rendering a scene cheaply then would welcome that in falling game prices to me as end user
I’ll be honest in games like CP the RT is noticeably better, but mainly because the raster version is so compromised and poor looking. In most games I can make out the RT effects and if I can get them playable with RT and quality level upscaling, then I leave RT on.
Though in my opinion the two biggest IQ improvements for gaming in the past 10 years, is VRR and HDR. For me even my HDR 600 IPS monitor shows a big impact in black levels and colours. My son’s HDR 1000 1440p monitor was fairly cheap and looks great for HDR content. It really makes a difference and it has no performance hit.
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Still only
Only handful games I've played had RT, recently Spiderman , ratchet and clank don't know if these show it off well or not really doesn't add that much imo , in ratchet and clank case it really tanks performance on 3080 1440p I can live without it bigger noticeable difference is oled with HDR
And you need to pay top dollar for GPU to have it not tank not worth it imo
Last game I was very impressed with graphically was the last of us and that didn't use any RT?
Tbh I have Avatar and I’m not impressed with RT (if there is any- as I can’t spot it!) and I’m playing at Ultra settings 1440p without FG. I get around 60-70 avg fps.
I’ve also got Spider-Man and Cyberpunk and barely notice it except in buildings glass etc.
Not sure it adds a lot to the experience.
It all looks a bit meh.
Looking forward to Unreal 5 to improve on that.
If you say it’s a way of developers rendering a scene cheaply then would welcome that in falling game prices to me as end user
Only handful games I've played had RT, recently Spiderman , ratchet and clank don't know if these show it off well or not really doesn't add that much imo , in ratchet and clank case it really tanks performance on 3080 1440p I can live without it bigger noticeable difference is oled with HDR
And you need to pay top dollar for GPU to have it not tank not worth it imo
Last game I was very impressed with graphically was the last of us and that didn't use any RT?
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Associate
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TLOU was amazing and if that’s without RT then that’s even more impressive
Caporegime
Ray tracing is awesome, however some games it's hardly noticeable, there is a ray tracing mod for Pal World and it looks hardly any different
I think ray tracing is very good for still shots, you can take 60 of them for each second and make a video, if you have lots of time.
You can really get that cinematic feel.
If you use frame generation, you would only need to take around 30, then pretend you did 60
You can really get that cinematic feel.
If you use frame generation, you would only need to take around 30, then pretend you did 60
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Tbh I have Avatar and I’m not impressed with RT (if there is any- as I can’t spot it!) and I’m playing at Ultra settings 1440p without FG. I get around 60-70 avg fps.
I’ve also got Spider-Man and Cyberpunk and barely notice it except in buildings glass etc.
Not sure it adds a lot to the experience.
It all looks a bit meh.
Looking forward to Unreal 5 to improve on that.
If you say it’s a way of developers rendering a scene cheaply then would welcome that in falling game prices to me as end user
Reason you won't spot it or notice in avatar is because you can't turn off RT
I think ray tracing is very good for still shots, you can take 60 of them for each second and make a video, if you have lots of time.
You can really get that cinematic feel.
If you use frame generation, you would only need to take around 30, then pretend you did 60
If you know what to look at/for, it's actually far more impressive in motion especially for reflections since reflections won't magically disappear or have the halo'ing around edges of objects which are in front of bodies of water where ssr is used.
Soldato
My 2070 couldn't run RT'ing without excessive smudging and artifacting to the point of producing faint but visible gridlines in Metro due to reliance of needing DLSS for RT.Jensen, is that you?
Didn’t we hear this very argument almost 5 years ago when these same people said the 2080Ti was worth the premium as it was future proofing for RT because “RT is the future”
Then they said the same about the 3090, then the 3090Ti and now the 4090.
Strangely we keep seeing more and more pointless levels of RT that seems to need the best NV tech to run. Yet the last gen bestest ever GPU suddenly isn’t compatible with the new shiny shiny. It’s like old mate Jensen has some planned obsolescence built in to his so people keep on “future proofing”.
The only thing that's changed is DLSS is vastly improved but still got a looong way to go to alleviate the artifacts it introduces.
Personally the DLSS negatives still outweighs the benefits.
The 5090 will only receive higher RT'ing effects at higher cost keeping the frame rate where NV want it to be.
As if that ever happened in gaming industry history...If you say it’s a way of developers rendering a scene cheaply then would welcome that in falling game prices to me as end user
For us who know what is what, sure we notice it and appreciate improvement. For people like my wife, or even my gaming buddy (who doesn't care how stuff works, just want 90+ FPS and fun) it makes 0 positive visual difference. I shown her CP2077 pure raster VS PT and her comment was "The second looks worse, too busy on the screen, I can't see what's going on, turn it off for me please". Then again, she considers HDR too bright and hurting her eyes too and prefers much more tame SDR image. And her opinion seem quite common amongst casual players, where they just want easy to see things on the screen, clean image, no HDR, no RT or other busy stuff. Often preferring to cut down on details not for FPS but to have cleaner image.
Generally speaking, the whole chase after realistic looks in games seem to be desired mostly by people who like technology, new toys (GPUs and CPUs etc.), enthusiasts/hobbyists etc. Majority do not care one bit, I've noticed on multiple occasions. One of the reasons they prefer cheap GPUs too - no need to pay more for stuff they don't want to see anyway. I reckon alsp one of the reason people prefer older games - just cleaner image, simpler to play (as in mechanics) and fun/relaxing.
Just by the way, been playing CP2077 a bit more, but this time looking at graphics more than just playing and I have to say the more I play it the more I see how big of an image quality downgrade is DLSS FG in movement - it smears the image quite a bit, especially in a bit higher contrast places. To the point that I started to prefer around 60FPS no FG than 100+ FPS FG, as that just gives me much cleaner image in movement. It's bit harder to notice when one just plays the game but definitely visible when one knows where to look for it. Latency increase is also quite noticeable. As much as it's impressive in some games, I don't feel this is the future - we need at least 60+ standard FPS before FG is even usable in such cases and by then it's mostly meh anyway. Nice to see higher FPS number, but not without downgrades.
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Associate
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5090 as a benchmark for future RT is not for the masses so until next console gen (and maybe even the PS7 or whatever) full on RT won’t be commonplace.
Considering what I wrote a bit earlier, to me it's not so much impressive as it's just bringing back in games reflections I have already had many years ago (with the good old cube mapping and the likes). Games evolved, SSR were a downgrade in that regard (but upgrade in details), so this is just getting back what we already had look-wise. And when you just get something back, it doesn't feel that impressive at all. Not a feeling younger audience will have, though.
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Or because well done RT is closer to reality and by that generating image as our brains expects things to be, hence it's transparent for us. We only notice things that are out of ordinary. Which means, the moment RT becomes really widespread in good implementation (not just everything shiny but realistic looking instead), people will stop noticing it or talking about it. And NVIDIA will have to have another marketing talking point instead (likely more of the AI).Reason you won't spot it or notice in avatar is because you can't turn off RT
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Well as said above, it doesn't matter what the average Joe's think, no matter how much they show their detest, it's the direction the industry is heading in whether they like it or not.
Each to their own, dlss + fg on my 3080 with path tracing is a far superior experience to my eyes than no dlss and normal RT let alone raster.... Raster does look great in cp 2077 though but alas supposedly "downgraded to make RT better"
As above, it's pointless to look back at what we had, the industry has moved on and is moving on to another new thing.
Exactly what I have said before. Will come a point where it won't even be mentioned/talked about as has happened with every other implementation of new graphical effects.
Nvidia have already given us what the end goal is going to look like (in their interview with df), where game worlds and graphics are just generated on the fly.
Soldato
Was using the 5090 as an example of how NV will increase the RT performance penalty gen on gen, not as an overall example of where RT will be.