What is 'woke' and why do we use it?

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C Kent said:
You know that the 2 things arent mutually exclusive right?
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Fair point. Common and extreme can both be true. But I would challenge you to prove "common" that both "giving children life altering drugs and chopping of their genitalia" is a common view amongst any but the extreme. I certainly don't support any genital surgery including circumcision before the age of consent.

Puberty blockers are not only used in cases of dysphoria and your own numbers show that 10-20% do not outgrow their feelings.

By the way, the idea that I am an extreme leftie would come as a great surprise to anyone that knows me. I don't equate being woke with a political side. I guess it's probable that most woke people aren't fascists since fascism tries to suppress any individuality in favour of the "greater good". Being woke means being aware of the individual.
 
C Kent said:
"professional"
I would be wondering why a professional would be issuing life altering drugs to a child when the vast majority don't need it, but that's just me.
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because some do. I suspect that the vast majority of children expressing feelings of dysphoria are not prescribed any drugs. Only in extreme cases would it be warranted and I expect that's what actually happens.
 
MikeTimbers said:
The BBC article linked above about "Zoey" a 9-year-old was linked by an anti-treatment proponent.
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Who would this 'proponent' be, then?

MikeTimbers said:
I quoted from that article as it was originally linked by ttaskmaster at post 209. Perhaps ask him why he quoted an article that is 8 years old to support the position that I am arguing against.
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Why not ask ttaskmaster yourself?
Also, did you just assume ttaskmaster's gender, in a thread all about wokeism and gender-fluidity??!!

Nitefly said:
If it’s recommended by medical / psychological professionals, or is considered by them to be a reasonable option, then it’s probably sensible?
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It wasn't that long ago that medical professionals were recommending (and often prescribing) cigarettes for their patients. They considered Camel and Lucky Strike to be very reasonable options, especially as treatments for asthma, bronchitis, hay fever and bad breath.
Remember, "More doctors smoke Camels than any other brand"...
 
MikeTimbers said:
because some do.
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So you are willing to give children experimental life altering drugs because of the 1 in 10? That's pretty messed up in my opinion. The figure could be 9 in 10 and I'd still be against it.
MikeTimbers said:
Fair point. Common and extreme can both be true. But I would challenge you to prove "common" that both "giving children life altering drugs and chopping of their genitalia" is a common view amongst any but the extreme.
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Ask any trans activist and you'll have your answer, unless you are saying trans activists are extreme?
MikeTimbers said:
Puberty blockers are not only used in cases of dysphoria and your own numbers show that 10-20% do not outgrow their feelings.
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No they arent, but we're specifically talking about trans kids.
MikeTimbers said:
I suspect that the vast majority of children expressing feelings of dysphoria are not prescribed any drugs. Only in extreme cases would it be warranted and I expect that's what actually happens.
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I'd point you to the Tavistock case from 2020, which shows your assumptions to be false. Then again I'd also point you to the interview with the girl that detransitioned from my post (244) which shows just how easy it is to circumvent any restrictions that are in place. There's also numerous stories about trans youths getting their blockers/cross sex hormones from overseas, and there's plenty of pro-trans forums where members, and folks within the social media sphere, that will get them to be passed along.
 
MikeTimbers said:
Yes, if the medical professionals deem it necessary. Puberty blockers were invented to delay early onset puberty. In young children of 8 or 9, getting the menarche is a really scary thing. They probably have no idea what is happening to them. And as the out-of-date Zoey article states, children have killed themselves over such things.
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They were invented for chemical castration;

www.healthline.com

Chemically Castrating: How It Works, Uses, and Side Effects

Chemical castration is the use of drugs to lower the production of hormones in your testicles. Learn how it works, and more.
www.healthline.com www.healthline.com

  • goserelin (Zoladex)
  • histrelin (Vantas)
  • leuprolide (Lupron, Eligard)
  • triptorelin (Trelstar)
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www.webmd.com

What Are Puberty Blockers?

Puberty blockers help temporarily suppress puberty. Transgender and gender-diverse children might use these to stop certain changes to their bodies.
www.webmd.com www.webmd.com

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C Kent said:
So you are willing to give children experimental life altering drugs because of the 1 in 10? That's pretty messed up in my opinion. The figure could be 9 in 10 and I'd still be against it.
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I'd be willing to give it to the 1 in 10. The ones who really want it and have wanted it for years. The ones that medical professionals - specialists in this area - deem it worth doing for. After very careful consideration. As I have said multiple times now although you keep taking an alternative position of me saying it should be given to all kids at the slightest sign of confusion. That's not a quote. But you're misquoting me too.

I have better things to do than this.
 
MikeTimbers said:
I'd be willing to give it to the 1 in 10. The ones who really want it and have wanted it for years. The ones that medical professionals - specialists in this area - deem it worth doing for. After very careful consideration. As I have said multiple times now although you keep taking an alternative position of me saying it should be given to all kids at the slightest sign of confusion. That's not a quote. But you're misquoting me too.

I have better things to do than this.
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Jesus man, how do you know which of the 10 is the one that won't be normal after going through puberty? Little hint for you, its impossible to tell....
 
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MikeTimbers said:
Being woke means being aware of the individual.
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Yeah, I know I'm taking this bit out of context, but it's a bit of a bugbear of mine. People think that being "woke" is about individualism and promotion of the individual. It's the opposite.

Its origin is is about encouraging awareness of the individual and solidarity with them, whatever and whoever they are and whoever you be. And a warning that that ****ers are gonna come for you either way. It's a collectivism, not a individual act or "being woke".

It's a state of mind. It's rather like the archetypal British sense of fair play.

Anyone that uses it as a pejorative is either owning up to not knowing the etymology or being a bully.

Stay woke, don't be a dope :)
 
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D.P. said:
you might have read it but clearly you are incapable of understanding what was written!
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I think it's pretty clear, he'd give it to the ones that really want it, the ones the 'professionals' think need it despite there being a 1 to 2 in 10 chance it would actually help in the long term. Joseph Mengele would proud.
 
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So are we now saying that being "woke" increases the chance of deviancy in your or others progeny by embracing and normalising stuff that in earlier times was left unmentioned to young kids?
 
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