What were the advantages in being in the EU?

davewhite04 · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:23

toshj said:
...
It may not seem like a big deal or that Leave voters from the regions are quite removed from banking, but the fallout from this will be disastrous and keenly felt across the whole UK. Just because you don't believe it won't happen that doesn't mean it won't. Confirmation bias in these situations can be dangerous.

I said it would be difficult, and I said who will be hit the most.

I can't make you optimistic, but all my message is is to stand shoulder to shoulder with everyone from every walk of life.

It is what I'm going to go out of my way to do, I really feel British for the first time in my life.

Boycey0211 · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:27

davewhite04 said:
I really feel British for the first time in my life.

Thats good to know then, we can all sleep safe at night knowing you're happy.

You've got no answers, no party supporting the brexit line at the moment, but as long as you feel british then thats great. I felt british last week, not any more.

Angilion · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:33

amigafan2003 said:
Employers can't opt out of it.

It's employees that have the option of opting out of it - and it's voluntary, no one can make you opt out of it.

On paper, perhaps, yes, if you can afford to buy a legal case and probably lose your job anyway.

It's better than the complete lack of protection that we'll have soon, but it's not ironclad.

toshj · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:36

davewhite04 said:
I really feel British for the first time in my life.

That's a shame. I feel British by contributing, not by isolating.

In a grandiose explanation I think this is the final nail in the coffin for the country. We've managed to go from the world's largest empire to this. We've been part of a cooperative bloc that engaged us with our European neighbours. Despite all the advice we've now stepped away, to go out on our own despite the very dynamic on the way of the world indicating at every turn that to do so is to sign your own death warrant. We've just gone from being part of something to being part of nothing, and hoping against hope that our ****ing spirit will get us through.

The world has changed since we last found ourselves in this position, the world has moved on from yesteryear, but we've chosen an option of regression. It's just so arrogant. I've felt British my whole life and I love being part of tbis country, but I've never felt less British as a result of this vote. Like I said in a previous thread, I get that it's a democratic purpose and I have no issue with that whatsoever, nor would I support a second referendum simply because it would be undemocratic. But that doesn't mean I need to agree with the result.

From a selfish standpoint, I'm going to be OK from here on out, but I worry desperately for the future of this country.

Angilion · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:53

Boycey0211 said:
Thats good to know then, we can all sleep safe at night knowing you're happy.

You've got no answers, no party supporting the brexit line at the moment, but as long as you feel british then thats great. I felt british last week, not any more.

I'm English. Whether the UK is part of the EU or not has no effect on that.

I'm also poor, which is why I'm worried about the effects of leaving the EU. It's very unlikely to be good news for me and there's nothing I can do to change anything about anything. I don't like the idea of imposed unification of Europe and I don't think it can really work anyway (unification has a very poor track record unless it happens on its own accord or is very forcefully imposed and very forcefully maintained for long enough) but I think it was the least bad of the two options. I'd prefer alliance rather than union, but that hasn't even been suggested as a possibility.

The question that comes to my mind is "What's the plan after leaving the EU?". It worries me that there's no sign that those who campaigned for leaving the EU have an answer or have even thought of the question, as if leaving the EU is the end point. We're not going to have hyper-advanced aliens turn up and make the UK into the land of milk and honey because we left the EU. We need a plan.

Sankari · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:54

Strife212 said:
Good job that you can visist almost any country in the world on a British passport

Not to mention Schengen states have no internal borders anyway.

I don't know if you're deliberately missing the point, or simply don't understand the issue. Either way, this post is utterly misguided.

Sankari · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:55

davewhite04 said:
We didn't have a say in the EU.

This is demonstrably false.

dowie · 27 Jun 2016 at 01:59

Evangelion said:
I don't know if you're deliberately missing the point, or simply don't understand the issue. Either way, this post is utterly misguided.

your post wasn't exactly great either re: your passports supposedly being virtually useless

Amp34 · 27 Jun 2016 at 02:53

davewhite04 said:
We have made a bold step there is no doubt, but despite all this talk about the financial services leaving London and bankrupting the country etc. I don't buy it, a handful might leave, but we will continue to have all our major trade deals as it's in our partners bests interests. Like I said, we will rise once this rock(EU) holding us back has gone and we can setup trade routes with existing partners and new, much larger ones.

Britain isn't finished, it's just getting started.

Out of interest do you have any experience in international companies, management or international deals?

Amp34 · 27 Jun 2016 at 03:04

davewhite04 said:
I "get" where most of the anger is coming from. I think we all need to calm down and stick together. Even though we will be leaving the EU, we will all be in this together, if everyone decides they want to stay here.

The reason we are in this together is because we could be facing an awful government for the next 4 years, so yes, the poor will probably be hit harder than ever, they will take the brunt of the "blame", and if you can't understand their plight but wish them to understand yours then we'll be one of the worst countries on the planet.

Stick together and show the Great British resilience, just like our football team, who depend heavily on spirit, and pride.

Actually we are not all in this together. Those with good educations and experience have the option of leaving elsewhere if things get really bad. The poorly educated and/those with low skilled jobs do not have those luxuries. They unfortunately will be with you in this "together". So no, luckily, we are not all in this together.

Also to back up what has already been said about business investment:

http://gu.com/p/4mytj?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

The IoD said a quarter of the members polled in a survey were putting hiring plans on hold, while 5% said they were set to make workers redundant. Nearly two-thirds of those polled said the outcome of the referendum was negative for their business. One in five respondents, out of a poll of more than 1,000 business leaders, were considering moving some of their operations outside of the UK.

Hedge · 27 Jun 2016 at 05:00

Will remove my comment as although in jest could be personal insult

Kreeeee · 27 Jun 2016 at 06:22

JBod · 27 Jun 2016 at 07:01

davewhite04 said:
I said it would be difficult, and I said who will be hit the most.

I can't make you optimistic, but all my message is is to stand shoulder to shoulder with everyone from every walk of life.

It is what I'm going to go out of my way to do, I really feel British for the first time in my life.

May I ask what you do for a living?

JBod · 27 Jun 2016 at 07:03

Amp34 said:
Actually we are not all in this together. Those with good educations and experience have the option of leaving elsewhere if things get really bad. The poorly educated and/those with low skilled jobs do not have those luxuries. They unfortunately will be with you in this "together". So no, luckily, we are not all in this together.

Also to back up what has already been said about business investment:

http://gu.com/p/4mytj?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

I am seriously reconsidering returning after 3 years as per my original plan. At least if the worst happens here and Trump becomes president the US remains economically stable.

SexyGreyFox · 27 Jun 2016 at 07:41

OP - did you actually vote?
You didn't say in your opening post!

deuse · 27 Jun 2016 at 07:47

"What were the advantages in being in the EU?" I can't think of anything.

Fens · 27 Jun 2016 at 08:25

I am not sure if it has been mentioned but being in the EU is of great benefit to the scientific and medical research community. We have some of the top researchers in the world based here receiving billions of pounds worth of EU research grants. What happens when we lose that funding? Do you think the government will step in to plug those huge funding gaps, and if so where are they supposed to find the money?

There are also huge question marks over the potential legal and regulatory implications. I work in cancer research and I am currently working on a cancer drug trial that is run in both Germany and the UK. A collaborative project such as this is only possible because of existing EU clinical trials directives and agreements and ease of movement for our research staff. This decision therefore has huge implications for the future of our research.

You don't have to take my word for it though, the entire higher education, research, medical and pharma sectors have already made it very clear that they were for remain.

mid_gen · 27 Jun 2016 at 08:27

As a brit living and working in the EU, in a skilled profession where the staff are non-German EU nationals, the advantages for both workers and businesses are very clear.

Witor · 27 Jun 2016 at 08:29

In Gibraltar, lots of Projects received EU funding, from local shopfronts receiving an EU grant, to a project I was involved in (IT Disaster recovery) receiving approx 60% of the funds required. The EU also did more to "manage" the situation at the Gibraltar/Spain border than the UK ever has.

That is now in danger of being lost. Financial services passporting arrangements (Which Gibraltar relies hugely on) I guess are now up in the air.

The Gaming/Online Betting sector (at least those that receive bets from Europe, BWin, 888, Bet368, et al.) is now in flux.

60% of Tourism enters via the border. God knows what will happen there, although the ruminations from the Spanish Government aren't good. Theoretically they could close the border to what will become a non EU Territory.

That's my local angle, let alone the standard ease of travel/medical points.

Membership of the EU for Gibraltar is/was much more critical than it was for the UK, it seems.

joeyjojo · 27 Jun 2016 at 08:49

Nice idea for a thread davewhite04 but you need to get your facts straight.

davewhite04 said:
I never saw any evidence of this at all.

The FT did some nice graphics, including a chart that shows "leave vote was strongest in regions most economically dependent on EU" (final figure):

http://blogs.ft.com/ftdata/2016/06/24/brexit-demographic-divide-eu-referendum-results/

As others have said, Cornwall is a striking example where the majority voted leave despite the area getting about 110 million euros/year from the EU.

davewhite04 said:
There will be no freedom of movement.

Boris is today trying to spin that the brexit vote wasn't based on immigration :rolleyes:

and we'll still be part of the single market. EU officials have said that we won't be allowed to stay in the single market without paying the membership fees and allowing 'some' freedom of movement. It seems very likely there will be 'some' in the future.