Soldato
6+ ft is a generous assumption. This might be an odd concept to grasp on a computer forum but more people have teenagers and big dogs than people who put bikes inside their car
When are you going fully electric?
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6+ ft is a generous assumption. This might be an odd concept to grasp on a computer forum but more people have teenagers and big dogs than people who put bikes inside their car
>150 miles a day, 5 days a week is north of 40k miles a year. That’s some mileage even for your ‘traveling sales person’.
It’s fine to charge to 100% and then use it the following day and always has been. People charge to 80% because they only do 30 miles a day and pinning the battery at a high state of charge constantly will cause it to degrade a bit faster than keeping it at 80 or below. On a 200 mile EV, driving it 30 miles is only going to use about 15%.
That’s fine but you would have already done a 100% to 5-10%, going back up to 80% again means a trip length of >300 miles on a 200mile EV. you would also only go back up to 80% if you needed the charge complete the trip or needed to have a further charge on top of that. Otherwise you’d just stick in what you need to get home in the day, why wait round for longer and pay more than was needed?
E.G. you have a 200 mile EV, you need to do 250 miles. You probably only need to be on a HPC for <10 mins to get you home.
In something like a Kona like you have you are probably talking >370 mile trips with a 100% to 10% back up to 80% and back to 10% again given how efficient the car is.
I'm more concerned about my circumstances than anyone else's Teenager with big dogs scenarios6+ ft is a generous assumption. This might be an odd concept to grasp on a computer forum but more people have teenagers and big dogs than people who put bikes inside their car
I have neither so the Sportback is as practical for me, as the standard car.
Soldato
You asked the question
Exactly this, my only wobble was going to Edinburgh but manage to drop into a carpark near Hotel and left overnight on 11kW. Thats a big trip though but about the only case ive wanted to get to a destination with more head room than 5% and Ive had the car 1 year nearly now.
I have far more frustration now when having to put fuel in cars!
Exactly this, my only wobble was going to Edinburgh but manage to drop into a carpark near Hotel and left overnight on 11kW. Thats a big trip though but about the only case ive wanted to get to a destination with more head room than 5% and Ive had the car 1 year nearly now.
I have far more frustration now when having to put fuel in cars!
Soldato
I don't do it every day, but I do a 500 mile round trip at least once per week. And the maths is predicated on there being a charger when you're showing 10% or 5% battery left and that's generally not the case, so you have to stop a bit earlier usually. It's not an issue, I'm quite happy. But when people ask me how many miles it does and I say "realistically, 200" they always say - "but it's a 300 mile WLTP car". Which it is, but it won't do more than 200 miles continuously on the motorway on an 80% charge. And I think we should be honest with each other about that.
[Edit]And I don't go home every night either! So it's generally rapids to 80% [/Edit]
When I first got my 3LR I thought it was the new chemistry battery and was charging it to 90 every day but the app starting to warn me about doing that and it not being good for the battery. When you set the charge levels on the latest version of the app it actually shows directly daily charge level suggestions and "trip" suggesting levels. Now I charge to 80 every day and higher if I have a few miles to do over the weekend (as its better for me to charge at work, although I do have a home charger too)
Soldato
Pfft, my car regularly sees single digit percentages on the battery try to keep it to 3-4%, but has been as low as 1% when I was feeling particularly brave. Charging is done as and when it is needed, but being an ex Agile users it used to get topped off to 100% very often, and now if it is really sunny and my home battery is full it will divert to the car, like today as I'm not out in it, so will no doubt hit near 100% again.
As for rapid charging I agree that charging past 80% in a lot of cars make no sense due to the fall off, but that is changing with newer models, and we all know sensible people who actually want to make their journeys shorter would use the optimal charging curve, if they aren't stopping for a reason which pushes them past that. I've gone past 90% on a rapid before, which would be stupid in most circumstances as 76-95% takes about as long as 10%-70% does, but I was doing "other stuff" not just there for a charge.
As for rapid charging I agree that charging past 80% in a lot of cars make no sense due to the fall off, but that is changing with newer models, and we all know sensible people who actually want to make their journeys shorter would use the optimal charging curve, if they aren't stopping for a reason which pushes them past that. I've gone past 90% on a rapid before, which would be stupid in most circumstances as 76-95% takes about as long as 10%-70% does, but I was doing "other stuff" not just there for a charge.
Soldato
So does the Jaguar not regen on a full battery? The Hyundai uses the upper buffer to still allow regen at 100% battery. I don't know what it would do if you attempted to regen down the Stelvio Pass, but for the first couple of miles it still works.
aaah there is a charger at the top ? haven't been to a ski resort for a few years to see how they are provisioned.
Caporegime
Yeah it has markedly reduced regen for the first few minutes when setting off at 100%.
Soldato
Yes just limited and then will fill, theres an update that allows a bit more now. With 4WD and a big battery is a serious about of regen. (first car to do WLTP without friction brakes)
You can see the line between regen/friction brakes introduced on the dash wide in regen move down as the battery empties.
I'm sorry but what you described is not close to what you claim as "most people would use it" and would be a scenario the VAST majority would encounter 2 or 3 times per year at most. Most people will charge at home as and when they need to and never go more than 40 miles on a single day (at worst). I have done longer range trips 3 times in 18 months in my E-Tron 50 with max range of 180 miles. I charge to 100% before I leave, and when using rapids just let it sit to 100% again. It will have no impact on battery life becuase it is a rare occurence. I have yet to know ANYONE who owns an EV who only charges to 80% when they are going on a long trip. So your scenario is not how most people would use it, it is how most EV owners "wouldn't" do it.
Incidentally 0% to 100% charge in an VAG MEB platform car is ~60 minutes at a 125kW+ rapid charger. VAG are allegedly going to release an update to reduce that to ~45 minutes.
Soldato
Possibly it's because I don't know anyone who doesn't do at least 20K miles per year. But that's how everyone I know does it.
That's a really odd statement to make. Irrespective of battery capacity and onboard charger they all take an hour? Cool.
I take it you've not seen the RSEV Youtube video then?
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See here in lies the problem. You made an absurd argument from a postion of poorly concevied logic, got called out and are moving the goalposts.
You replied to my post that was specifically and accurately pointing out that MEB platform cars (Q4 in this case) are getting 2.8 mi/kW - 3.2 mi/kW in winter, which would be ~200+ miles range and NOT 150. Your reply was highly convoluted and an utterly unrealistic scenario about most people driving ~350 miles per day, but only ever charging to 80% (cus internet says so). All in some very vain and utterly failed attempt to show that an MEB car, really only has 150 miles of range.
Me stating the MEB cars charge 0% - 100% in 1 hour is specific because they were the type of EV we were SPECIFICALLY discussing. I was attempting to show that the difference between charging to 100% at a rapid compared to 80%, is negligible form a time point of view. You are the one trying to claim that "most people" do 20,0000+ miles per year and 350~ miles per day is "normal". You are also claiming that people who own EVs will only charge to 80% 100% of the time at rapid chargers. In reality they will charge to whatever they need to finish their journey, be it 25% or 100%.
You replied to my post that was specifically and accurately pointing out that MEB platform cars (Q4 in this case) are getting 2.8 mi/kW - 3.2 mi/kW in winter, which would be ~200+ miles range and NOT 150. Your reply was highly convoluted and an utterly unrealistic scenario about most people driving ~350 miles per day, but only ever charging to 80% (cus internet says so). All in some very vain and utterly failed attempt to show that an MEB car, really only has 150 miles of range.
Me stating the MEB cars charge 0% - 100% in 1 hour is specific because they were the type of EV we were SPECIFICALLY discussing. I was attempting to show that the difference between charging to 100% at a rapid compared to 80%, is negligible form a time point of view. You are the one trying to claim that "most people" do 20,0000+ miles per year and 350~ miles per day is "normal". You are also claiming that people who own EVs will only charge to 80% 100% of the time at rapid chargers. In reality they will charge to whatever they need to finish their journey, be it 25% or 100%.
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Soldato
This is why I don't post here. My response was actually about ALL BEVs.
A Tesla Model 3 will even find it impossible to fit that brief, if you are expecting "at least" 200 miles of range from 70% of the total battery charge in the coldest wettest winter days. Most winter tests here in the UK give about 220-250 miles in a TM3 LR on longer mostly motorway road trips for 100% charge. 80% charge would give ~200 miles range at best and sometimes lower and that is assuming you will drive it below 10%.
So I would say there is not a single EV out there that will get 200 miles of range from 70% of its battery in the coldest wettest UK winter days.
The numbers I have been giving for the MEB ID.4 and Q4 are for 100% state of charge.
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Nope, you are moving the goalposts again. This is your post, specifically replying to my post that was specifically about the ID.4 (and Q4) real world range in winter.
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/posts/35293979/
The fact you qualified at the end it was the same for all EVs means nothing in this context. You were wrongly implying that all EVs (and by extension the ID.4) should only quote ranges at 80% battery.
Soldato
Whilst also posting here to confirm he doesn’t post here
I don't want to sound confrontational but I call out when people are making convoluted arguments why EV range isn't really what it really is.
Claim: I need a car that gets 200 winter miles and the Q4 only gets 150 winter miles
- No it doesn't and here's proof.
Claim changed: Well the Q4 only gets 170 miles on the coldest winter days.
- No it doesn't and heres more proof.
Claim changed again: I meant on the coldest wettest winter days and have also decided to set an arbitrary cap of 80% maximum allowable battery charge. Oh and you are not allowed to use the last 10% of battery. So I want at least 200 miles of range on the coldest wettest winter day and only want to use 70% of the battery.
- Well even the most efficient of EVs will find it mpossible to achieve that.
Hmmm, OK.
It's the old anti EV meme of "unless it can drive 500 miles towing a caravan in a blizzard at 80mph on a motorway, EVs suck".
Claim: I need a car that gets 200 winter miles and the Q4 only gets 150 winter miles
- No it doesn't and here's proof.
Claim changed: Well the Q4 only gets 170 miles on the coldest winter days.
- No it doesn't and heres more proof.
Claim changed again: I meant on the coldest wettest winter days and have also decided to set an arbitrary cap of 80% maximum allowable battery charge. Oh and you are not allowed to use the last 10% of battery. So I want at least 200 miles of range on the coldest wettest winter day and only want to use 70% of the battery.
- Well even the most efficient of EVs will find it mpossible to achieve that.
Hmmm, OK.
It's the old anti EV meme of "unless it can drive 500 miles towing a caravan in a blizzard at 80mph on a motorway, EVs suck".
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Soldato
I most certainly charge to 100% prior to a long trip.. Having a home charger, usually we just charge it to 100% in the 4 hour cheap EV tariff window (2-6AM for me) and it's ready to go in the morning.. since a lot of our journeys are the same 150 mile trip, that's enough to complete it in any weather/conditions we've ever encountered thus far.
The majority of the time we are just doing normal commuting and normal local trips and we charge to 80% and then every 3 days or so when it's around 20-30%, pop it back on charge over night..
The fact that light use is generally in the 20-80% range for optimal battery life doesn't mean we think of the 'range' as only being that 60% window, that would be absurd..
The majority of the time we are just doing normal commuting and normal local trips and we charge to 80% and then every 3 days or so when it's around 20-30%, pop it back on charge over night..
The fact that light use is generally in the 20-80% range for optimal battery life doesn't mean we think of the 'range' as only being that 60% window, that would be absurd..