When are you going fully electric?

I'm old enough to remember a time before SUVs were popular, and if you wanted a practical car an estate was the go to. Maybe I'm old fashioned, or maybe I just realise that the (relatively) long, low and more aerodynamic shape of an estate is more practical, more economical, and offers a better drive* than a tall, boxy SUV.

well so I am I, hence my comment on who used to buy them.
Estates have never been popular with the majority.
I guess I missed off painters and decorators in my list

Better drive, possibly if your only worried about dynamics.

My other half has had a few SUVs and on longer drives they are actually quite nice on motorways, back roads etc due to better visibility.
Its quite marked for me when I switched from her car to mine (TT so low) how much the better visibility meant busy traffic was less stressful.
Its oddly something I had dismissed many years ago when someone who had a Range Rover told me the height made driving less stressful. He was right.

SUVs are better for families, car seats, etc
 
I prefer estates but tbh happy to buy an SUV if that's the way things are going. All EVs just have such small boots though in general - even for the monster 5m long cars the boot size is pretty small.
That's due to the stupid trend of coupe SUVs... All the size but none of the practicality. The X6 has a lot to answer for!!
 
Model Y rear motor, out of interest

s-l1600.jpg
 
well so I am I, hence my comment on who used to buy them.
Estates have never been popular with the majority.
I guess I missed off painters and decorators in my list

Better drive, possibly if your only worried about dynamics.

My other half has had a few SUVs and on longer drives they are actually quite nice on motorways, back roads etc due to better visibility.
Its quite marked for me when I switched from her car to mine (TT so low) how much the better visibility meant busy traffic was less stressful.
Its oddly something I had dismissed many years ago when someone who had a Range Rover told me the height made driving less stressful. He was right.

SUVs are better for families, car seats, etc

I've slept in the back of quite a few estates, nice and long, lovely flat floor - would certainly be a struggle in most SUVs!
Lifting a heavy tent (or anything else) into the boot of a low estate is much easier than over the lip of an SUV which is raised up high for *reasons*.
Long loads in the back of an estate is much easier than wedging them into the passenger footwell.

SUVs certainly have their place, if you actually need the ground clearance and off-roading capability, but sadly the overwhelming majority of modern SUVs are just a jacked up hatchback. Yes, estates might be more of a niche, but that's only because for most people a hatchback would serve their needs - for most driving an SUV doesn't offer any benefits over one (I guess they might be better for old people or anyone else with mobility problems who struggle to get in/out of a lower car).

SUVs might be more popular, but I'm not sure that's valid measure of how practical they actually are.
 
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I've slept in the back of quite a few estates, nice and long, lovely flat floor - would certainly be a struggle in most SUVs!
Lifting a heavy tent (or anything else) into the boot of a low estate is much easier than over the lip of an SUV which is raised up high for *reasons*.
Long loads in the back of an estate is much easier than wedging them into the passenger footwell.

SUVs certainly have their place, if you actually need the ground clearance and off-roading capability, but sadly the overwhelming majority of modern SUVs are just a jacked up hatchback.

Again I am not sure what your angle is here.

How many people sleep in their car?
I knew a couple of rally fans who would hire an estate and do what you suggested as they followed the rally for the extended weekend but they still used a "normal" car the rest of the year.

Lifting heavy things in is a double edged sword. I mentioned my TT, its far easier getting heavy things in than an SUV granted, but its more awkward when getting them out than my other halves SUVs used to be.
I would use hers by preference when buying heavy stuff from wickes as it was easier to get stuff out at the other end. I preferred doing the more awkward lift to get stuff in when it was easier to get access than getting it out which had worse access obviously.

Its horses for courses I guess.

Historically as I said estates were a niche market, low sales so they held their price well second hand.
Most people didn't want the ugly, heavier, slower, less fuel efficient cars ;)
Then they switched to SUVs ;)

I am sure some mainstream EV estates will come. But no matter how you cut it, its a niche market compared to saloons and hatches/SUVs*
*(I actually dislike the SUV term as well for these but thats what the mainstream have decided to call them)
And yep agree they are basically jacked up hatches, but then many people really like hatches due to the size/practicality
 
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say what now?

Have you seen the size of a tesla motor and gearbox?

As for the space in the model y, it's flipping cavernous. Don't forget, ICEs have a fuel tank where the boot COULD be as well...
Yeh the id3 motor is much smaller than the rear engines golf it replaced :p
 
Lifting heavy things in is a double edged sword. I mentioned my TT, its far easier getting heavy things in than an SUV granted, but its more awkward when getting them out than my other halves SUVs used to be.
I would use hers by preference when buying heavy stuff from wickes as it was easier to get stuff out at the other end. I preferred doing the more awkward lift to get stuff in when it was easier to get access than getting it out which had worse access obviously.

Hmm, not sure how that works - slide out of the back of estate vs lift over boot lip?

Most people didn't want the ugly, heavier, slower, less fuel efficient cars ;)
Then they switched to SUVs ;)

Yeah, I guess this is my "issue" with them - all the downsides of an estate with none of the benefits! :mad:
 
Fair enough, that's where it is in many cars - I'm guessing under the rear seats instead then?
Oh god yes! About the only cars with fuel in the boots was the previous X5 hybrid and A3 etron as tactical fixes - pretty much all are under row 2, structure protecting occupants and fuel is a really good use of metal. This is where you find the power electrics on some HV batteries, ie the Tesla model3 / y penthouse. An alternative is Honda with the Gen8 Civic is under row1 seats to enable the clever magic seats.

Hmm, not sure how that works - slide out of the back of estate vs lift over boot lip?


Yeah, I guess this is my "issue" with them - all the downsides of an estate with none of the benefits! :mad:

Ground clearance is a benefit i now realise is a big one. Reality is most tailgates are above 700mm from the ground to avoid insurance rating impact as the Thatchame test increases cost of repair as the 700mm sled takes out the tailgate aswell as the rear bumper!
 
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Not that much difference in terms out outer dimensions - you can't count the empty space inside the subframe

Ermm, yes it it, massive difference to the size of the body structure above and around it... why do you think the casting is so appealing. Imagine what a FWD Golf looks like compared to the ID.3 or the frankly comedy Hyundai stack on their new EVs that eats into the boot space horrendously. Also means the links have enough space for proper size bushings that don't squeak and rattle after 60k miles. but that's another story...

Put the Tesla Kool-Aid down.
 
Hmm, not sure how that works - slide out of the back of estate vs lift over boot lip?



Yeah, I guess this is my "issue" with them - all the downsides of an estate with none of the benefits! :mad:

I guess its again what your lifting.

If your dragging something in and out then I guess an estate would be easier.
But again thats sounding more niche.

I'm talking about stuff like sleepers, big aggregate bags, large bags of peat etc and they are 100% without doubt easier to get out of an SUV at closer to stomach height as opposed to lower.

As somone who actually hurt my back for the first time weekend before last either shifting some breeze blocks or sleepers I am now far more conscious on height in regards picking and lifting that I once was.
I work in a manufacturing environment (although not in manufacturing myself) and all those talks about how to correctly lift etc now seem far more sensible than I gave them credit for!
 
But then as @Yaayuh! says, that's a £70k car. The Model S is 800L+ if you include the frunk, but again way outside of most people's budget.

I can get a Focus estate with a 575L boot for ~£27k or an Octavia with a 610L boot for ~£26k. Where are the equivalent EVs - even for £10-15k more?



No. If that was my complaint I would have said "Cheaper small cars have small boots and SUVs are not estates". What I said instead was "Need more EV estates", from which cryptic clue, most people would be able to infer that my complaint was that there aren't enough EV estates and we need more of them. :rolleyes:


Skoda Enyaq 62kWh battery good for 200 miles of mixed driving. 585L of boot space and can be had for less than £28k used.

Before you go on a "it's an SUV" rant ;), it is actually more estate than SUV and is a few cm shorter, a few cm wider and only 14,8cm taller than both the Octavia etate or the Focus estate. If you are gneuinely going to call ~15cm taller substantial enough to warrant an anti SUV stance?
 
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I guess its again what your lifting.

If your dragging something in and out then I guess an estate would be easier.
But again thats sounding more niche.

I'm talking about stuff like sleepers, big aggregate bags, large bags of peat etc and they are 100% without doubt easier to get out of an SUV at closer to stomach height as opposed to lower.

The stuff you've mentioned is exactly the kind of thing I would expect to be easier to "drag" out of an estate, rather than having to lift over a lip, but I guess down to personal preference. :)

Skoda Enyaq 62kWh battery good for 200 miles of mixed driving. 585L of boot space and can be had for less than £28k used.

Before you go on a "it's an SUV" rant, it is actually more estate than SUV and is a few cm shorter, a few cm wider and only 14,8cm taller than both the Octavia etate or the Focus estate. If you are gneuinely going to call ~15cm taller substantial enough to warrant an anti SUV stance?

Yup, the Enyaq is definitely a good option, but again, it's not been available in that price range for long at all
 
Ermm, yes it it, massive difference to the size of the body structure above and around it... why do you think the casting is so appealing. Imagine what a FWD Golf looks like compared to the ID.3 or the frankly comedy Hyundai stack on their new EVs that eats into the boot space horrendously. Also means the links have enough space for proper size bushings that don't squeak and rattle after 60k miles. but that's another story...

Put the Tesla Kool-Aid down.
but, but, but, it's so delicious! :D
 
The stuff you've mentioned is exactly the kind of thing I would expect to be easier to "drag" out of an estate, rather than having to lift over a lip, but I guess down to personal preference. :)



Yup, the Enyaq is definitely a good option, but again, it's not been available in that price range for long at all

Just checked and I think it has a lip on the boot. Then I see some images where it looks totally flat. Maybe a kind Enyaq owner will confirm
 
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