World Cup 2010 - GROUP C (England, USA, Algeria, Slovenia) **spoilers**

[Participant]

The only real conclusion to draw, is that the players are not technically good enough. All other discussions of the manager and the formation are secondary to the key fact: we're just not as good as the hype would have us believe.

They have no presence on the ball.
They cannot trap the ball and pass it.
They cannot strike a dead ball.
They cannot pass to someone five yards away, without that person either losing the ball with a poor first touch or not reaching it in the first place.
They cannot shoot.

Look at any other side in this competition - they can at least do the simple things correctly. Trap, pass, and move. Pass your way out of a sticky situation. Keep the ball on the ground, rather than wacking up to your donkey lump of a striker.

They look good at their clubs because they're surrounded by technically proficient foreign players.

The other problem I think English players have is a lack of mental strength meaning they are overly nervous and scared, and unable to generate the passion that they should have playing for their country.

Shoddy, weak, embarassing.

 

[One More Solo]

The saddest thing is, the one moment we played the ball into our striker's feet it resulted in a goal. Unfortunately, that was 186 minutes of football ago.

 

[drunkenmaster]

been listenning to talk sport since the match ended, and in typical talk sport fashion, theres been lots of vary (angry lol) commentators, and varying viewpoints.

One thing that is obvious, is that Capello and the F.A cant be to blame for this. Adrian durham had it right, there were 11 men that walked out on that field, and with maybe 1 or two exceptions, all of them played like garbage. Capello is having the same problem as all the england managers before them - england players who play better for their club than they do for their country.

We've done things capellos way, kept the media away, let them train behind closed doors, let him keep the players in the dark till the day etc.. etc.. and its still not changed.

Only players can go out on their field and play as well for their country as for their club. But they dont appear to give a damn. Its the only possible explanation for years of shoddy performances.

That is still completely Capello's fault, completely, firstly he picked all the same combo's that have previously not worked, thats bad management.

Two "less good" players who play very well together are massively more effective than the two best players in the country, who can't play together at all. Its Capello's choice to continue to play those two, he could have gone with Parker and Noble, (which I wouldn't, noble sucks this year) but the point is, he could have chosen ANYONE but ultimately went with a pair thats failed for 6 years before, that IS Capello's fault.

Its Capello's fault the keepers are playing with no confidence, Dida isn't the greatest keeper ever, but the Brazilian defence are used to him and he's used to them as they've been consistant for years and Dida KNOWS he's the No'1. None of our keepers know they are number 1 so play like guys without confidence, again Capello's fault. If he just picked James, or Green or Hart MONTHS ago and had them start every game and get used to being number 1, that breeds confidence and the defence gets used to communicating with a single keeper who will tend to talk with his defence or prefer them to position a certain way.

Its also clear as day the team aren't happy, the team don't believe they can win, the whole team has gone out like they know they can't win the cup and know they can't get very far and can only really embarasse themselves and be ridiculed when they come back. Capello has failed to instill any belief in this team in the slightest, he's failed to give them confidence they can win and failed to make key choices that would massively benefit the team.

Can you imagine how the Spanish team would feel if they were expected to win the world cup and anything less was a failure, and then the manager decided to start Heskey in every game, intentially and ridiculously crippling your team for no reason whatsoever. What would you have more confidence with starting with a Rooney and Bent/Defoe upfront, both who scored 15 goals plus, or starting with Heskey upfront who scored -8 goals this season.

Capello is massively responsible for their state of mind, and the inability of the team to play together as a team.

All the players could have played better than they did, without question, and they have done before, but when you play the same broken formation with the same bad players shoved in with the same bad tactics for the 50th time(or 100th time maybe over the past 6-7 years some of these guys have played) you don't play the same, when you haven't won in almost this exact team for years and you know it can't work, where does the enthusiasm come from.

Capello needed massive changes for the sake of the players actually thinking a new start might work, aswell as the fact that, the players he went with don't play well together.

 

[Iaink]

rooney played terribly imo, he was frustrated and didn't go for it, he kept passing it to someone else as soon as he got it instead of smashing through the Algerian defence himself. Heskey played well IMO, but he's definately not a natural striker, maybe in another lfie he would have made a good winger/ full back. We need to strat crouch on the pitch, get rid of Lampard and get Joe Cole on. Carraggher always plays bad for England so I think that's a blessing in disguise- Yes he can tackle, but then he always loses the ball again!

 

[Locky]

All those people comparing Rooney to Messi LOL, Messi is a million times better player that Rooney is you can't even name them in the same breath.
Rooney is a fat over paid over hyped, POS English player who only looks good at Manchester united because of the wealth of foreign players around him.
In fact that goes for all of our players they are all crap.

 

[One More Solo]

I've got to laugh at all the knee jerk reactions about Rooney, absolutely pathetic.

 

[FTM]

If it clearly isn't working at half time, get Lampard/Gerrard off and move back to a 4-4-2 with Crouch/Bent up front with Rooney. As a last throw of the dice, i'd take Rooney off with a quarter of an hour to go and partner Crouch/Bent up front and see what happens.

this would be handy if we had taken the next highest english goalscorer after Rooney, but mr capello left him at home and decided to take 3 strikers who didnt score as many put together as Bent

I assume you meant Defoe instead of Bent

 

[Locky]

I've got to laugh at all the knee jerk reactions about Rooney, absolutely pathetic.

Knee Jerk? Rooney consistently fails to turn up on the big stage, and only looks good smashing the lower depths on the premier league, he's an average player in a decent team built around him.

 

[Naan_H]

I've got to laugh at all the knee jerk reactions about Rooney, absolutely pathetic.

Not really, i think man utd fans are deluded about how good he is. he is probably the best english player in the league - no doubt - but thats not saying a lot considering how bad england players actually are.

Goes asleep on the big stage as already said, and only plays well against the lesser teams.

the only english players in recent times who have performed under pressure are beckham and owen - they always had that something extra when we needed it.

 

[valve90210]

rooney played terribly imo, he was frustrated and didn't go for it, he kept passing it to someone else as soon as he got it instead of smashing through the Algerian defence himself.

What I saw was Rooney getting frustrated with the midfield cos they weren't getting the ball to him, so he ended up having to go back to the halfway line to get the ball to try to do something but he had very little support really and if he's back getting the ball at the halfway line, he's got a lot to do to get to the goal.

I saw him on several occassions get the bal and pass it off to someone then run forward to get closer to the box and hopefully get some service, get a few balls back to him nearer the goal where he's got more of a chance to turn a defender and get a chance on goal, and every time the service to him was terrible, most of the time it never got anywhere near him again, more often than not being lost to the opposition in the middle of the field.

 

[Cosimo]

Also saw some vuvulas horns in sainsburys today

I'm buying some to welcome them home.

 

[GeezerButler]

Not a football expert so sorry if this sounds naive but:

Isn't it time that the FA bit the bullet and took a long term view? Get rid of all these millionaire divas from the squad who are only interested in their club careers. Hire a bunch of new young players to form a dedicated international team who work and play together full time just like a club squad. Same for the manager - get someone dedicated to the job who isn't just using it as a stepping stone to his next big club paycheck. It might take five years or more to get anywhere, but we've been waiting 44 years for another World Cup win already - what will a few more years matter?

You'd get players and coaching staff who actually give a toss as it would be their career, not a part time job like it is now. You'd get to develop understanding between the players and get them working as a proper team. You'd have no conflict between international and club duties and you wouldn't have club managers dictating who can and can't play for the national team. Yes the team would have less experience of playing against the other international players at club level, but the same would apply in reverse.

Of course the players and manager would have to be on long term contracts to stop the temptation to drift off to club sides. But I'm sure there's lots of young players who would love a chance like this. And who would manage it? Maybe someone like Stuart Pearce - someone who actually seems to care about playing for his country?

As I said I'm not a football person, but I'm just sick of watching England's overpaid divas deliver such poor results. Football is our national game - we should be taking teams like Algeria and the USA to the cleaners. But we're not doing it and tinkering with the team and sacking the manager every couple of years just isn't going to fix the problem.

 

[UltimateBadger]

A random collection of thoughts:

I'm glad other people have mentioned Lampard. Apart from the shot on goal he did absolutely nothing last night. England's midfield need to take a good look at themselves - they are so poor at retaining possession and off the ball movement it is untrue. Capello's tactic of pressing the opposition all over the pitch just doesn't work. The midfield is easily bypassed with a couple of basic one-two's because they are too tight. This in turn makes every team who play against England look like a 70's Brazilian team.
I really don't think we will get through the group stages and it is mainly down to tactics and player selection.
Joe Cole should be starting every game - he has masses of flair and creativity and plenty of energy and he also hasn't just played a ton of games for his club.

 

[bloodline76]

I've got to laugh at Rooney, absolutely pathetic.

Fixed for you

 

[rayb74]

Same old story with England. I said at the start of this world cup they would be lucky to even qualify from the group never mind win the thing. If they got through to the quarter finals that would be a good achievement.

99% of England fans get roped in by the media hype and the false elevation of Rooney as being some world class player who will win us the world cup.

This is a TEAM game so stop putting all the spotlight on one player. England and the Media do this every world cup (Gazza, Owen e.t.c.)

The only world class player in the squad is Gerrard. No wonder he gets fed up. I think he is fed up with carrying a mediocre club team for so long, and now has to do it with England.
Come on if Gerrard has a slightly off game NO ONE ELSE CAN STEP UP AND MAKE THINGS HAPPEN.

How many times did Stevie have a chance of smashing the ball into the net last night and instead tried to find Rooney?

What orders is Cappello dishing out? Lets get Rooney on the score sheet to get the tournament going? Keep the nation of sheep that is England going?

Why is Englands most prolific scorer in recent times, Crouch not starting?
This England manager has not got the balls to start with Crouch & Defoe.
He is so **** scared of dropping the nations artificially inflated, media lovechild Rooney.
Rooney should be the "super sub" NOT Crouch.

Same old England ..........Same old over hyped ****.........

 

[Locky]

Joe cole is the only player I rate whos English along with Ashly, The rest are average at best.

 

[BFCTom]

Persisting with SWP off the bench is a joke. The formation is not working, the subs are not working - Capello needs to change it around.

 

[Locky]

The only world class player in the squad is Gerrard. No wonder he gets fed up. I think he is fed up with carrying a mediocre club team for so long, and now has to do it with England.
Come on if Gerrard has a slightly off game NO ONE ELSE CAN STEP UP AND MAKE THINGS HAPPEN.

Heh? Gerard world class, I don't think so somehow, he plays the big stage Vanishing act just like the rest of them.

 

[rayb74]

I've got to laugh at all the knee jerk reactions about Rooney, absolutely pathetic.

Ive got to laugh at the comments like this from mancs.

 

[newbiejim]

Despite all the possible excuses I think the sad facts are that England just arent good enough, maybe just maybe this is the truth?. Tbh it really shouldnt be a surprise, you are playing against decent sides with one of the poorest England squads in a long time (IMHO). It seems to me that its a case of the emperors new clothes guys and no one wants to face it or cant believe it, therefore we have all these possible excuses/reasons which are simply that, ie; opinions with no way of proving any of the touted hypotheses for England drawing two games against these decent sides, I say the overwhelmingly likelihood is that the reason is staring you in the face, England are playing to their level. For what its worth imho the only chance is to stick Crouch up front and punt long balls to him, after all it is plain to all that England cant play the passing game.